North and South Koreas are normalizing relation

[Trausti]

The very last person who merits a Nobel Peace Prize is Donald Trump. Even Obama was puzzled when he was awarded his (as he well should have been), but Donald Trump has done more to destabilize world peace than any President in living memory. The best argument that can be made here is that Trump's antics have so frightened China that it finally gave Kim no option but to take advantage of South Korean President Moon's campaign promise to improve relations with the North. If anyone deserves a Peace Prize, it is Moon.

Meanwhile, Donald Trump has ramped up tensions with China and other nations with his tariff threats. He has pulled out of the Paris treaty. He is about to pull out of the historic agreement with Iran. He has done all he could to damage the growing rapprochement with Cuba. He has angered Muslim nations with his hostile rhetoric and worsened relations with European allies. As far as Korea goes, Donald Trump has yet to meet with Kim, and nobody knows how that will go. All Kim wants is to sit down with him and be treated as a legitimate world leader--something that he has never gotten in the past. And he gives up nothing at all for that except vague promises of denuclearization--which North Korean news services are downplaying.

So no. Donald Trump does not deserve a Nobel Peace Prize. That would be an incredible embarrassment for the Nobel Prize Committee.

Look not at his methods, but to his results.

 

[Copernicus]

Whose results, Trausti? So far, we are just seeing the results of Moon's initiative to make peace with the North. He is a liberal who ended 9 years of conservative rule and campaigned on a policy of "learn to say No to America". Kim's interest is in driving a wedge between South Korea and the US, which will almost certainly lead to a weakening of punitive sanctions against his country. The rest of the world is not going to follow America's lead, if it appears to mess up rapprochement between the Koreas, so Trump has almost no leverage here.

You are counting unhatched chickens at this point. Let's wait and see if Trump gets any results that can actually be attributed to him.

 

[Trausti]

Whose results, Trausti? So far, we are just seeing the results of Moon's initiative to make peace with the North. He is a liberal who ended 9 years of conservative rule and campaigned on a policy of "learn to say No to America". Kim's interest is in driving a wedge between South Korea and the US, which will almost certainly lead to a weakening of punitive sanctions against his country. The rest of the world is not going to follow America's lead, if it appears to mess up rapprochement between the Koreas, so Trump has almost no leverage here.

You are counting unhatched chickens at this point. Let's wait and see if Trump gets any results that can actually be attributed to him.

Ya know, Moon and the South Korean Foreign Minister credited Trump. Seems they may know more about this than anonymous posters on an internet forum.

 

[RVonse]

It is beautiful, and the role reversals are hilarious with Trump and the Democrats. Hillary was a war hawk. Trump is apparently trying to usher in peace and doing it more effectively than anybody else has in Korea. Isn't the Democrat and Republican usually the other way around? Same with the fearmongering about Russia. That used to be Republicans afraid of the reds, didn't it?

+1 Agree.

 

[Copernicus]

...Ya know, Moon and the South Korean Foreign Minister credited Trump. Seems they may know more about this than anonymous posters on an internet forum.

Absolutely. Moon has discovered that flattery seems to work well on narcissists, although Macron learned, much to his chagrin, that it didn't get him very far with Trump. South Korea has to walk a tightrope while it juggles relations with China, North Korea, and the US.

My point still stands that Trump has yet to even sit down with Kim. It is arguably the case that fear of a US invasion has driven China to read the riot act to Kim, but neither China nor North Korea is looking to hand Trump a propaganda victory. And, unlike Trump, both Xi and Kim listen to advisers and do their homework. They will both have an end game in mind. Trump will be working on his next spate of tweets.

 

[RVonse]

Haven't we seen this play out before? .

No. Not in my lifetime. I am 60 years old. I have never before turned on the television to CNN and observed "Korean War Has Ended" in red title.

This has never before happened.

 

[Copernicus]

Haven't we seen this play out before? .

No. Not in my lifetime. I am 60 years old. I have never before turned on the television to CNN and observed "Korean War Has Ended" in red title.

This has never before happened.

The Korean War has not ended. South Korea is not actually a signatory, so the US and China will need to sign any official peace treaty. It is unlikely that Moon will agree to anything without at least the nominal support of the US, and nobody, least of all Trump, knows what Trump will do.

 

[RVonse]

Haven't we seen this play out before? .

No. Not in my lifetime. I am 60 years old. I have never before turned on the television to CNN and observed "Korean War Has Ended" in red title.

This has never before happened.

The Korean War has not ended. South Korea is not actually a signatory, so the US and China will need to sign any official peace treaty. It is unlikely that Moon will agree to anything without at least the nominal support of the US, and nobody, least of all Trump, knows what Trump will do.

So CNN is putting out fake news LordKiran?

 

[T.G.G. Moogly]

The very last person who merits a Nobel Peace Prize is Donald Trump. Even Obama was puzzled when he was awarded his (as he well should have been), but Donald Trump has done more to destabilize world peace than any President in living memory. The best argument that can be made here is that Trump's antics have so frightened China that it finally gave Kim no option but to take advantage of South Korean President Moon's campaign promise to improve relations with the North. If anyone deserves a Peace Prize, it is Moon.

Meanwhile, Donald Trump has ramped up tensions with China and other nations with his tariff threats. He has pulled out of the Paris treaty. He is about to pull out of the historic agreement with Iran. He has done all he could to damage the growing rapprochement with Cuba. He has angered Muslim nations with his hostile rhetoric and worsened relations with European allies. As far as Korea goes, Donald Trump has yet to meet with Kim, and nobody knows how that will go. All Kim wants is to sit down with him and be treated as a legitimate world leader--something that he has never gotten in the past. And he gives up nothing at all for that except vague promises of denuclearization--which North Korean news services are downplaying.

So no. Donald Trump does not deserve a Nobel Peace Prize. That would be an incredible embarrassment for the Nobel Prize Committee.

Kim gives up nothing in the end, shakes a few hands, gets loads of money and concessions from the west, gets to keep his nukes, and the Trump loyalists drool with glee.

And why isn't anyone asking about Kim's Nobel?

 

[Trausti]

I really want Trump to win the Nobel Prize because the reaction from The Resistance™ will be hilarious.

 

[Copernicus]

The very last person who merits a Nobel Peace Prize is Donald Trump. Even Obama was puzzled when he was awarded his (as he well should have been), but Donald Trump has done more to destabilize world peace than any President in living memory. The best argument that can be made here is that Trump's antics have so frightened China that it finally gave Kim no option but to take advantage of South Korean President Moon's campaign promise to improve relations with the North. If anyone deserves a Peace Prize, it is Moon.

Meanwhile, Donald Trump has ramped up tensions with China and other nations with his tariff threats. He has pulled out of the Paris treaty. He is about to pull out of the historic agreement with Iran. He has done all he could to damage the growing rapprochement with Cuba. He has angered Muslim nations with his hostile rhetoric and worsened relations with European allies. As far as Korea goes, Donald Trump has yet to meet with Kim, and nobody knows how that will go. All Kim wants is to sit down with him and be treated as a legitimate world leader--something that he has never gotten in the past. And he gives up nothing at all for that except vague promises of denuclearization--which North Korean news services are downplaying.

So no. Donald Trump does not deserve a Nobel Peace Prize. That would be an incredible embarrassment for the Nobel Prize Committee.

Kim gives up nothing in the end, shakes a few hands, gets loads of money and concessions from the west, gets to keep his nukes, and the Trump loyalists drool with glee.

And why isn't anyone asking about Kim's Nobel?

Exactly. If Trump merits a peace prize, then Kim should get one as well. These two bozos drive up international tensions with saber rattling, and then they collect a reward for not actually doing what they've been threatening to do.

I really want Trump to win the Nobel Prize because the reaction from The Resistance™ will be hilarious.

I think that this is exactly what it is all about. Schadenfreude at the discomfort of the left is the fundamental driver of Trump's popularity among his base.

 

[Emily Lake]

It is beautiful, and the role reversals are hilarious with Trump and the Democrats. Hillary was a war hawk. Trump is apparently trying to usher in peace and doing it more effectively than anybody else has in Korea. Isn't the Democrat and Republican usually the other way around? Same with the fearmongering about Russia. That used to be Republicans afraid of the reds, didn't it?

Hey, it's a post-factual world. Anything goes. Cue the Twilight Zone music.

 

[Trausti]

Trump should win the Nobel Peace Prize, says South Korea's Moon

 

[arkirk]

It is beautiful, and the role reversals are hilarious with Trump and the Democrats. Hillary was a war hawk. Trump is apparently trying to usher in peace and doing it more effectively than anybody else has in Korea. Isn't the Democrat and Republican usually the other way around? Same with the fearmongering about Russia. That used to be Republicans afraid of the reds, didn't it?

Hey, it's a post-factual world. Anything goes. Cue the Twilight Zone music.

Looks mighty post factual to me. I am reading it that Kim has only to look at Libya to realize he needs a way out. The U.S. murders leaders who give up their nukes. I do not think Trump has done anything but make matters worse and spend our taxpayer money ginning up a military confrontation with North Korea. Both North and South know what the actual threat is and where it is coming from. Kim is not the ignoramus he is portrayed as being by our military industrial media. Watching what happened to Saddam and Mumar has got to have a sobering effect on both North and South. They are both pawns in a global chess game and leaders who lose lose their heads.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

GOP considers nominating Trump for Nobel Prize after Lucy sets the football up for Charlie Brown to kick.

Cart and horse issues here.

How come no thread about that? Looks like it could be real this time. I think Trump scared them both into this.

Because it's a Trump win. Folks around here hate Trump so anything that makes him look good they'll ignore. If this does lead to peace / nuke-free Korea, he should win the Noble Peace Prize. But he's Trump, so they won't happen.

Yeah, it has absolutely nothing to do with bait and switch that North Korea is famous for.

- - - Updated - - -

I really want Trump to win the Nobel Prize because the reaction from The Resistance™ will be hilarious.

I really hope Chelsea Clinton wins the Nobel Prize for the enduring Middle East Peace deal she struck.

 

[Keith&Co.]

I mean really all this lip service doesn't cost Kim anything, and that's exactly what it is: lip service.

Pretty much.

I'll be less dismissive when there's a treaty, with a schedule of inspections. Some sort of measurable limits to production of stockpiling of nukes, or a limit to the number of delivery vehicles.

We have a treaty with Russia, which has had clear results in the number of nukes we can possibly deploy, we have regular inspections of facilities, we have limits on the tests we will perform.

We have a treaty with Iran, but Trump wants to junk that, mostly because it's not his accomplishment.

So far, Trump has nothing to show to anyone that something has changed in Korea besides rhetoric.

Trump's biggest problem in this case is that he hasn't got the temperament to actually sit down for an extended meeting and hammer out details. Not like Carter with Egypt and Israel. And if he delegates someone else to carry the bucket, here, there's a good chance THEY will be covered with glory for the accomplishment, and Trump will look silly trying to claim it.

I think the ideal possible future here, assuming NK is AT ALL serious, is that China, NK and SK work something out, then present it to Trump as fait accompli, and ask him to pay for it. Trump gets to make a big speech about how AMERICA will be policing the treaty, AMERICA will pay for the inspectors, publish the results, and AMERICA will dismantle X% of the mines on the border, and it's all ME! ME! ME!

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

The very last person who merits a Nobel Peace Prize is Donald Trump. Even Obama was puzzled when he was awarded his (as he well should have been), but Donald Trump has done more to destabilize world peace than any President in living memory. The best argument that can be made here is that Trump's antics have so frightened China that it finally gave Kim no option but to take advantage of South Korean President Moon's campaign promise to improve relations with the North. If anyone deserves a Peace Prize, it is Moon.

Meanwhile, Donald Trump has ramped up tensions with China and other nations with his tariff threats. He has pulled out of the Paris treaty. He is about to pull out of the historic agreement with Iran. He has done all he could to damage the growing rapprochement with Cuba. He has angered Muslim nations with his hostile rhetoric and worsened relations with European allies. As far as Korea goes, Donald Trump has yet to meet with Kim, and nobody knows how that will go. All Kim wants is to sit down with him and be treated as a legitimate world leader--something that he has never gotten in the past. And he gives up nothing at all for that except vague promises of denuclearization--which North Korean news services are downplaying.

So no. Donald Trump does not deserve a Nobel Peace Prize. That would be an incredible embarrassment for the Nobel Prize Committee.

Look not at his methods, but to his results.

It's like people believe they are going to have sex, but are just reaching orgasm in their pants. Nothing is even on the back of a napkin yet and the Trump brown coats are celebrating like the last nuke was dismantled.

 

[Tom Sawyer]

Looks like they've set up the summit now. June 12th in Singapore.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/trump-announces-june-12-summit-in-singapore-with-north-korean-leader/2018/05/10/8f1ad3ac-5438-11e8-9c91-7dab596e8252_story.html?utm_term=.88aa9cddbacd

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

According to the President, who declared peace a while ago, says the meeting could turn out well or poorly. He is a sage!

 

[funinspace]

According to the President, who declared peace a while ago, says the meeting could turn out well or poorly. He is a sage!

FFvC could be right this thyme...