Police Misconduct Catch All Thread

[marc]

Video recently released of an incident where police apparently shot and killed a teen that had been kidnapped.

Video shows California police fatally shooting teenager who was reported kidnapped

Revealed: Savannah Graziano, 15, shot by sheriff’s deputies in 2022 while unarmed and following instructions to move toward them

www.theguardian.com

 

[lpetrich]

Yet more good reason for cops to have only low-lethality weapons like Tasers most of the time.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

Yet more good reason for cops to have only low-lethality weapons like Tasers most of the time.

You realize this situation had already gone to bullets before this happened?

And this is the Guardian and even it notes that they weren't sure if the girl had shot at them. If the Guardian is going to admit that she's probably far from innocent in this. The details are blurred out but she's shot at the point where she could have made a grab for the officer's gun.

 

[marc]

The details are blurred out but she's shot at the point where she could have made a grab for the officer's gun.

Think you need to get your eyes checked, and possible hearing. The girl was at least 20ft away from the officer.. who was repeatedly calling to her to come to him.

I know, it is so much easier to insert ‘reaching for his gun’ into any situation where an unarmed person is shot and killed, rather than actually deal with what happened.

 

[bilby]

probably far from innocent

... as are we all. So the police can justifiably shoot anyone and everyone.

I fucking hate this weak and craven inference that a victim probably deserved their fate.

Even if someone isn't perfectly innocent, that's probably far from justification, for someone whose job is the protection of the public, to shoot them dead.

Probably.

 

[ZiprHead]

Yet more good reason for cops to have only low-lethality weapons like Tasers most of the time.

You realize this situation had already gone to bullets before this happened?

And this is the Guardian and even it notes that they weren't sure if the girl had shot at them. If the Guardian is going to admit that she's probably far from innocent in this. The details are blurred out but she's shot at the point where she could have made a grab for the officer's gun.

JFC! They knew the girl was the victim of a kidnapping. That's why they were pursuing the father's vehicle in the first place,

 

[Loren Pechtel]

Yet more good reason for cops to have only low-lethality weapons like Tasers most of the time.

You realize this situation had already gone to bullets before this happened?

And this is the Guardian and even it notes that they weren't sure if the girl had shot at them. If the Guardian is going to admit that she's probably far from innocent in this. The details are blurred out but she's shot at the point where she could have made a grab for the officer's gun.

JFC! They knew the girl was the victim of a kidnapping. That's why they were pursuing the father's vehicle in the first place,

We don't know she was the victim of a kidnapping. We know she was with him.

 

[Worldtraveller]

The first part of the article:

Newly released law enforcement footage captures the moment California police fatally shot an unarmed 15-year-old girl who was a reported kidnapping victim.

On 27 September 2022, San Bernardino county sheriff’s deputies were searching for Savannah Graziano, who was feared abducted by her father Anthony Graziano after he had fatally shot her mother the day before.

You seem to always aim your skepticism at the victims here, and never at the police.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

The first part of the article:

Newly released law enforcement footage captures the moment California police fatally shot an unarmed 15-year-old girl who was a reported kidnapping victim.

On 27 September 2022, San Bernardino county sheriff’s deputies were searching for Savannah Graziano, who was feared abducted by her father Anthony Graziano after he had fatally shot her mother the day before.

You seem to always aim your skepticism at the victims here, and never at the police.

"Feared abducted" means they don't know.

 

[marc]

The first part of the article:

Newly released law enforcement footage captures the moment California police fatally shot an unarmed 15-year-old girl who was a reported kidnapping victim.

On 27 September 2022, San Bernardino county sheriff’s deputies were searching for Savannah Graziano, who was feared abducted by her father Anthony Graziano after he had fatally shot her mother the day before.

You seem to always aim your skepticism at the victims here, and never at the police.

"Feared abducted" means they don't know.

Which is all the more reason to NOT shoot. If you were one of the cops, would your reasoning really be "I think that girl might be a victim, but lets shoot her anyway just in case she isn't"?

And will you at least admit that the girl couldn't 'grab his gun' from 20 feet away?

 

[Shadowy Man]

The first part of the article:

Newly released law enforcement footage captures the moment California police fatally shot an unarmed 15-year-old girl who was a reported kidnapping victim.

On 27 September 2022, San Bernardino county sheriff’s deputies were searching for Savannah Graziano, who was feared abducted by her father Anthony Graziano after he had fatally shot her mother the day before.

You seem to always aim your skepticism at the victims here, and never at the police.

"Feared abducted" means they don't know.

Which is all the more reason to NOT shoot. If you were one of the cops, would your reasoning really be "I think that girl might be a victim, but lets shoot her anyway just in case she isn't"?

And will you at least admit that the girl couldn't 'grab his gun' from 20 feet away?

Just outside the zone of “grabbing my gun” is the zone of “fearing for my life”.

 

[Worldtraveller]

The first part of the article:

Newly released law enforcement footage captures the moment California police fatally shot an unarmed 15-year-old girl who was a reported kidnapping victim.

On 27 September 2022, San Bernardino county sheriff’s deputies were searching for Savannah Graziano, who was feared abducted by her father Anthony Graziano after he had fatally shot her mother the day before.

You seem to always aim your skepticism at the victims here, and never at the police.

"Feared abducted" means they don't know.

Jeesus fucking christ. You need help.

 

[laughing dog]

The first part of the article:

Newly released law enforcement footage captures the moment California police fatally shot an unarmed 15-year-old girl who was a reported kidnapping victim.

On 27 September 2022, San Bernardino county sheriff’s deputies were searching for Savannah Graziano, who was feared abducted by her father Anthony Graziano after he had fatally shot her mother the day before.

You seem to always aim your skepticism at the victims here, and never at the police.

"Feared abducted" means they don't know.

Let me get this straight. A unarmed girl is reportedly kidnapped by her father who is a suspect in the shooting death of her mother and who is 20 feet away from the officers is gunned down the police. Yet you think the police did not have enough information at the time to give her the benefit of the doubt that she was not an immediate threat to them?

 

[ZiprHead]

Florida sheriff deputies burst into wrong apartment and fatally shot U.S. airman, attorney says

Florida sheriff deputies burst into the wrong apartment and fatally shot Senior Airman Roger Fortson, Civil rights attorney Ben Crump said.

www.cbsnews.com

Deputies responding to a disturbance call at a Florida apartment complex burst into the wrong unit and fatally shot a Black U.S. Air Force airman who was home alone when they saw he was armed with a gun, an attorney for the man's family said Wednesday.

Senior Airman Roger Fortson, 23, who was based at the Special Operations Wing at Hurlburt Field, was at his home at Chez Elan Apartments, around five miles from the air base, when he was killed.

Civil rights attorney Ben Crump said in a statement that Fortson was on a Facetime call with a woman at the time of the encounter.

According to Crump, the woman, whom Crump didn't identify, said Fortson was alone in his apartment when he heard a knock at the door. He asked who was there but didn't get a response. A few minutes later, there was a very aggressive knock on the door, Crump said in a statement, but Fortson didn't see anyone when he looked out the peephole.

The woman said Fortson was concerned and went to retrieve his gun, which Crump said was legally owned.

As Fortson walked back through his living room, deputies burst through the door, saw that Fortson was armed and shot him six times, according to Crump's statement. Fortson was on the ground, saying, "I can't breathe," after he was shot, Crump said.

Fortson died at a hospital, officials said. The deputy involved in the shooting was placed on administrative leave pending an investigation.

I've seen the video but I have not located it to post here. The airman has the gun in his hand at his side. The cop yells "Step Back", then immediately pumps six bullets into the airman. The cop gave an incorrect demand and absolutely did not give the victim time to carry out any command.

Not to mention the cop was at the wrong apartment.

 

[Derec]

I've seen the video but I have not located it to post here. The airman has the gun in his hand at his side.

Who answers the door with a gun? Especially when the knocker identifies himself as being from the Sheriff's office.

The cop yells "Step Back", then immediately pumps six bullets into the airman. The cop gave an incorrect demand and absolutely did not give the victim time to carry out any command.

He was hasty, that's sure, but at the same time Fortson acted stupidly by opening the door for police while holding a gun.

Not to mention the cop was at the wrong apartment.

Not the deputy's fault. He was given the wrong number by the apartment office.
From the article:

According to Crump,

That alone should make one suspicious. That hearse chaser is not at all trustworthy.

the woman, whom Crump didn't identify, said Fortson was alone in his apartment when he heard a knock at the door. He asked who was there but didn't get a response.

Which contradicts the video.

A few minutes later, there was a very aggressive knock on the door, Crump said in a statement, but Fortson didn't see anyone when he looked out the peephole.

A few minutes later? The time from the first knock to Fortson opening the door was <30 s.
And how come he was not able to hear "sheriff's office"?

The woman said Fortson was concerned and went to retrieve his gun, which Crump said was legally owned.

Was he expecting trouble, I wonder?

 

[bilby]

...the right to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed, unless you are a black man in his own home, seeking to defend it from intruders, in which case your summary execution by law enforcement officers is perfectly OK, if you are bearing (or they are frightened that you might be bearing) arms.

- Second Amendment to the United States Constitution, Florida Edition.

 

[Derec]

...the right to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed, unless you are a black man in his own home, seeking to defend it from intruders, in which case your summary execution by law enforcement officers is perfectly OK, if you are bearing (or they are frightened that you might be bearing) arms.

A white teenager was shot by a cop in Georgia a few years ago for answering his door holding a white wii controller. The cop was not prosecuted.
This guy answered the door holding a firearm even though the deputy identified himself twice. He was not an intruder.
There is no reason to assume that this shooting had anything to do with race, your kneejerk judgment of the matter notwithstanding. Or that 2nd Amendment is invalidated because of this case.

Also, that CBS News writer should be ashamed of himself. The deputy did not "burst" into the apartment. Wtf?

 

[robnisch]

...the right to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed, unless you are a black man in his own home, seeking to defend it from intruders, in which case your summary execution by law enforcement officers is perfectly OK, if you are bearing (or they are frightened that you might be bearing) arms.

A white teenager was shot by a cop in Georgia a few years ago for answering his door holding a white wii controller. The cop was not prosecuted.
This guy answered the door holding a firearm even though the deputy identified himself twice. He was not an intruder.
There is no reason to assume that this shooting had anything to do with race, your kneejerk judgment of the matter notwithstanding. Or that 2nd Amendment is invalidated because of this case.

Also, that CBS News writer should be ashamed of himself. The deputy did not "burst" into the apartment. Wtf?

I guess in Floridah the police have drawn guns for a noise violation. WTF indeed.

 

[Derec]

I guess in Floridah the police have drawn guns for a noise violation. WTF indeed.

You guess wrong. Did you even see the video?

It is clear that the deputy did not draw the gun until Fortson opened the door holding his.

 

[bilby]

...the right to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed, unless you are a black man in his own home, seeking to defend it from intruders, in which case your summary execution by law enforcement officers is perfectly OK, if you are bearing (or they are frightened that you might be bearing) arms.

A white teenager was shot by a cop in Georgia a few years ago for answering his door holding a white wii controller. The cop was not prosecuted.
This guy answered the door holding a firearm even though the deputy identified himself twice. He was not an intruder.
There is no reason to assume that this shooting had anything to do with race, your kneejerk judgment of the matter notwithstanding. Or that 2nd Amendment is invalidated because of this case.

Also, that CBS News writer should be ashamed of himself. The deputy did not "burst" into the apartment. Wtf?

If it's OK for cops to shoot someone because they believe that person to be armed, then people do NOT have the right to bear arms.

The 2nd amendment was invalidated the very first time a police officer shot someone, with their being armed as his excuse.

IF the second amendment is valid, THEN the police are NEVER justified in taking ANY action (much less using lethal force) on the basis that a citizen is armed - they should expect any and all citizens to be armed at any time, and consider it no more an excuse to act than the wearing of a hat, or pants. Indeed, US citizens do NOT have an explicit constitutional right to wear hats, so police shooting a guy and then saying "I thought he was wearing a hat!" is actually more acceptable than police shooting a guy and saying "I thought he had a gun!"

Is a US citizen allowed to have a gun? If so, how does noting that he has one justify any action at all by police? How?

Of course, it may be that the second amendment is simply NOT valid. In which case, there's zero legal basis to oppose bans on firearm ownership.

"You are allowed a gun, but if you have one the cops might kill you" isn't distinct from "You are not allowed a gun", in any meaningful sense.