Police Misconduct Catch All Thread

[laughing dog]

I'm saying "unarmed" includes people trying to grab the officer's stuff. (I won't say gun because we do have a case where the cop shot because the guy got his taser.) I am not saying all unarmed cases are trying to grab the officer's stuff, just that many are.

If someone is grabbing for a weapon they are unarmed at the time. If they are called, then the officer is armed and may have time to take nonlethal measures.
So your argument is pretty flimsy as an excuse.

Officer grabs his taser, perp grabs his gun. Officer is dead.

Your imaginary scenario is missing a few intermediate steps and ignores a crucisl caveat which makes your response moot.

 

[laughing dog]

The police lied to get their warrant. Which technically makes the warrant illegal, which means they were committing a crime even by entering. Hence Walker had every right to shoot at them (his charges were dismissed with prejudice). Since Ms. Taylor's death occurred while the police were engaged in criminal behavior, they should have been charged with felony murder. Hmmm.

You are treating "police" as if it was one entity, instead of different people who did different things.

Those detectives who lied on the warrant were prosecuted for that. But that does not mean the officers who executed the warrant, entered the residence and returned fire did anything wrong, much less criminal. They had a warrant signed by a judge.

The warrant was obtained illegally. That means they had no legal right to enter the house. So they did plenty wrong, including killing Ms Taylor because of their lousy aim.

 

[laughing dog]

For the record, of course the police claim they announced themselves. Wouldn’t you make that claim? It may or may not be true. We will never actually know. But imagine you are awakeNed in the middle of the night by an intruder. You may or may not hear the intruder announce themselves. And you may or may not be awake enough to grasp that it is the police. And you may or may not perceive that they are not a danger to you. Perhaps less if you are not white. BTW, this is one of my arguments against gun ownership: unintentionally shooting an intruder who is actually a family member or someone else who was not a threat. And yes, I’ve encountered someone unexpected in my home in the middle of the night and been very grateful I did not have a gun.

What would I have done had I been the officers? I don’t know. But firing my weapon would not be an automatic response.

Yes, we do have a problem with how searches are conducted.

I would presume it's true--but note that if someone is awakened by "Police! Search Warrant!" that there's a good chance they do not hear the words. You awaken to the noise and only then become aware of words.

But note the situation: felon in possession. And clearly living a life of crime in that he thought it was rivals.

And that justifues Ms Taylor’s death by police because….?

The point is she put herself in harm's way by living with an armed felon. Take stupid risks, sometimes something bad happens.

You are seriously arguing that police are justified in killing unarmed civilians because who they live with? Do you realize how sociopathic that sounds?

 

[laughing dog]

No, YOU note the actual situation: Police were looking for a felon who did not live at that address and had not lived there for some time. The felon was in custody. The police fucked up. Someone who was not a police officer died. Note: this happens MUCH more frequently than police being shot by their suspect or some other person.

The police lied to get their warrant. Which technically makes the warrant illegal, which means they were committing a crime even by entering. Hence Walker had every right to shoot at them (his charges were dismissed with prejudice). Since Ms. Taylor's death occurred while the police were engaged in criminal behavior, they should have been charged with felony murder. Hmmm.

Got some evidence as to those numbers?

. What numbers do you refer to?

And while they lied to get their warrant that's not a felony. You need a felony for felony murder, not merely a crime.

Illegally entering a hone us a felony.

 

[Toni]

For the record, of course the police claim they announced themselves. Wouldn’t you make that claim? It may or may not be true. We will never actually know. But imagine you are awakeNed in the middle of the night by an intruder. You may or may not hear the intruder announce themselves. And you may or may not be awake enough to grasp that it is the police. And you may or may not perceive that they are not a danger to you. Perhaps less if you are not white. BTW, this is one of my arguments against gun ownership: unintentionally shooting an intruder who is actually a family member or someone else who was not a threat. And yes, I’ve encountered someone unexpected in my home in the middle of the night and been very grateful I did not have a gun.

What would I have done had I been the officers? I don’t know. But firing my weapon would not be an automatic response.

Yes, we do have a problem with how searches are conducted.

I would presume it's true--but note that if someone is awakened by "Police! Search Warrant!" that there's a good chance they do not hear the words. You awaken to the noise and only then become aware of words.

But note the situation: felon in possession. And clearly living a life of crime in that he thought it was rivals.

And that justifues Ms Taylor’s death by police because….?

The point is she put herself in harm's way by living with an armed felon. Take stupid risks, sometimes something bad happens.

You are seriously arguing that police are justified in killing unarmed civilians because who they live with? Do you realize how sociopathic that sounds?

It’s worse: He’s arguing that you can be killed while sleeping in your own bed based on who you USED to live with!

Pretty sure that only applies to black women tho.

 

[TV and credit cards]

White Sulphur hires Timothy Loehmann, officer involved in fatal shooting of 12-year old

By Stephen Baldwin, RealWV The White Sulphur Springs police department has hired Timothy Loehmann. City Administrator Linda Coleman confirmed the hiring to R

therealwv.com

And he's done.

Officer involved in Tamir Rice shooting resigns from latest job, says city official

The former Cleveland police officer who shot and killed 12-year-old Tamir Rice has resigned from his latest job as a police officer in White Sulphur Springs, West Virginia.

www.yahoo.com

Councilman Ryan Lockhart said Loehmann had been employed and working for the city for “some time” before he and other’s learned about the officer’s past.

I reckon White Sulphur Springs, West Virginny don't get much news bout negro kids being shot by the police.

 

[laughing dog]

White Sulphur hires Timothy Loehmann, officer involved in fatal shooting of 12-year old

By Stephen Baldwin, RealWV The White Sulphur Springs police department has hired Timothy Loehmann. City Administrator Linda Coleman confirmed the hiring to R

therealwv.com

And he's done.

Officer involved in Tamir Rice shooting resigns from latest job, says city official

The former Cleveland police officer who shot and killed 12-year-old Tamir Rice has resigned from his latest job as a police officer in White Sulphur Springs, West Virginia.

www.yahoo.com

Councilman Ryan Lockhart said Loehmann had been employed and working for the city for “some time” before he and other’s learned about the officer’s past.

I reckon White Sulphur Springs, West Virginny don't get much news bout negro kids being shot by the police.

Thanks for the update. Nice catch.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

The point is she put herself in harm's way by living with an armed felon. Take stupid risks, sometimes something bad happens.

Oh ffs: she broke up with the felon. Booted him out long before she was murdered in her own bed. Neither of us have a timeline for their relationship so as far as either of us know, he appeared to be a stand up guy when they got together and she dumped him as soon as she smelled a rat.

Besides which, you are ignoring the FACT that the police lied to get their warrant had the suspect in custody at the time. Or the fact that incompetent and dishonest police

practices would have put into danger the lives of any subsequent tenant in that apartment and any neighbor of that apartment—as they put into danger the lives of neighbors that night.

All of whuch I’ve typed out before. You just cannot get over your hard on for defeusing police and for killing unarmed black people—double points if they are women and black.

Yeah, but note the status of the guy she was with.

I have a big problem with how warrants are handled, but she's nothing like innocent.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

And the good guys can always shoot the gun out of the bad guy's hands, so why don't police do that? /s

I know it's sarcasm but there's actually a good reason for it. When you shoot a gun out of somebody's hands it tends to go off. That's why sharpshooters don't take such shots anymore.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

Florida deputy was logged into sheriff's office Wi-Fi while watching child porn videos: PCSO

A Pinellas County deputy resigned after being arrested for watching and sharing child porn videos while working at the jail, according to the sheriff's office.

www.fox13news.com

CLEARWATER, Fla. - A Pinellas County deputy resigned after being arrested for watching and sharing child porn videos while working at the jail, according to the sheriff's office.

Detectives assigned to the Crimes Against Children Unit (CAC) arrested 33-year-old Trevor Scott Willis, a Pinellas County Sheriff's Office Detention Deputy, after receiving information that child porn was being accessed and shared online.

Tack on a year just for being an idiot.

I would say that stupidity isn't a crime, but thinking about it it probably should be considered an aggravating factor. If you can't control yourself enough to avoid utter stupidity you're probably not going to control yourself very well when you come back out, either.

 

[bilby]

When you shoot a gun out of somebody's hands...

...you are in a show with a fairly decent special effects budget.

FFS, could you please at least try to pretend that you know something about guns that you didn't learn from TV or movies?

 

[Loren Pechtel]

I'm saying "unarmed" includes people trying to grab the officer's stuff. (I won't say gun because we do have a case where the cop shot because the guy got his taser.) I am not saying all unarmed cases are trying to grab the officer's stuff, just that many are.

If someone is grabbing for a weapon they are unarmed at the time. If they are called, then the officer is armed and may have time to take nonlethal measures.
So your argument is pretty flimsy as an excuse.

Officer grabs his taser, perp grabs his gun. Officer is dead.

Your imaginary scenario is missing a few intermediate steps and ignores a crucisl caveat which makes your response moot.

What steps? If the cop goes for his taser that is basically relinquishing control of the gun the guy was going for.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

The police lied to get their warrant. Which technically makes the warrant illegal, which means they were committing a crime even by entering. Hence Walker had every right to shoot at them (his charges were dismissed with prejudice). Since Ms. Taylor's death occurred while the police were engaged in criminal behavior, they should have been charged with felony murder. Hmmm.

You are treating "police" as if it was one entity, instead of different people who did different things.

Those detectives who lied on the warrant were prosecuted for that. But that does not mean the officers who executed the warrant, entered the residence and returned fire did anything wrong, much less criminal. They had a warrant signed by a judge.

The warrant was obtained illegally. That means they had no legal right to enter the house. So they did plenty wrong, including killing Ms Taylor because of their lousy aim.

Doesn't matter. Use of force decisions always come down to the reference frame of the person using the force.

 

[bilby]

Yeah, but note the status of the guy she was with.

I have a big problem with how warrants are handled, but she's nothing like innocent.

She was asleep; The cops knew exactly nothing about her, and were in the wrong apartment.

How, exactly, did they gain the information that "she's nothing like innocent", before they shot her; And why would that information justify shooting someone asleep in their own bed, even if their psychic powers had imparted the foreknowledge to them?

As far as they could possibly know, she was absolutely and completely innocent; And their duty in law would be to presume her innocence, given that she was neither known to them in any way, nor posing any kind of threat to anybody.

As far as the cops could ever posdibly know, she was more innocent than YOU. Because you are a bigger threat, just by dint of being awake.

 

[bilby]

she's nothing like innocent.

Doesn't matter. Use of force decisions always come down to the reference frame of the person using the force.

Well said. It really doesn't matter.

And in the reference frame of the cop who shot her dead, she was as innocent as it is possible for anyone to be.

 

[laughing dog]

I'm saying "unarmed" includes people trying to grab the officer's stuff. (I won't say gun because we do have a case where the cop shot because the guy got his taser.) I am not saying all unarmed cases are trying to grab the officer's stuff, just that many are.

If someone is grabbing for a weapon they are unarmed at the time. If they are called, then the officer is armed and may have time to take nonlethal measures.
So your argument is pretty flimsy as an excuse.

Officer grabs his taser, perp grabs his gun. Officer is dead.

Your imaginary scenario is missing a few intermediate steps and ignores a crucisl caveat which makes your response moot.

What steps? If the cop goes for his taser that is basically relinquishing control of the gun the guy was going for.

Why do you feel that the only course of action when a suspect is grabbing for a gun is for the officer to go for a taser?

 

[laughing dog]

The police lied to get their warrant. Which technically makes the warrant illegal, which means they were committing a crime even by entering. Hence Walker had every right to shoot at them (his charges were dismissed with prejudice). Since Ms. Taylor's death occurred while the police were engaged in criminal behavior, they should have been charged with felony murder. Hmmm.

You are treating "police" as if it was one entity, instead of different people who did different things.

Those detectives who lied on the warrant were prosecuted for that. But that does not mean the officers who executed the warrant, entered the residence and returned fire did anything wrong, much less criminal. They had a warrant signed by a judge.

The warrant was obtained illegally. That means they had no legal right to enter the house. So they did plenty wrong, including killing Ms Taylor because of their lousy aim.

Doesn't matter. Use of force decisions always come down to the reference frame of the person using the force.

It doesn’t matter to you. But it shows the police had no legal business to be there. They were the functional equivalent of home invaders.

They fucked up big time. Ms Taylor paid for their poor police work and markmenship. They kept their jobs and you blame her for their shittiness.

 

[Shadowy Man]

As far as the cops could ever posdibly know, she was more innocent than YOU. Because you are a bigger threat, just by dint of being awake.

sleepwalkers could try to grab a cop’s gun

 

[laughing dog]

As far as the cops could ever posdibly know, she was more innocent than YOU. Because you are a bigger threat, just by dint of being awake.

sleepwalkers could try to grab a cop’s gun

Don’t forget that people can look aggressive with closed eyes.

 

[Toni]

The point is she put herself in harm's way by living with an armed felon. Take stupid risks, sometimes something bad happens.

Oh ffs: she broke up with the felon. Booted him out long before she was murdered in her own bed. Neither of us have a timeline for their relationship so as far as either of us know, he appeared to be a stand up guy when they got together and she dumped him as soon as she smelled a rat.

Besides which, you are ignoring the FACT that the police lied to get their warrant had the suspect in custody at the time. Or the fact that incompetent and dishonest police

practices would have put into danger the lives of any subsequent tenant in that apartment and any neighbor of that apartment—as they put into danger the lives of neighbors that night.

All of whuch I’ve typed out before. You just cannot get over your hard on for defeusing police and for killing unarmed black people—double points if they are women and black.

Yeah, but note the status of the guy she was with.

I have a big problem with how warrants are handled, but she's nothing like innocent.

OH MY GOD: A person dates someone who turns out to be not so great. They break up.
She deserves death.

WTF