Police Misconduct Catch All Thread

[ZiprHead]

Federal judge holds SPD in contempt for use of pepper spray, blast balls during Black Lives Matter protests this fall

Idiotic decision. Police need these non-lethal tools in order to control violent mobs like the Portland rioters or the extremists who occupied territory in Seattle.

Way to cut out the pertinent portion.

U.S. District Judge Richard Jones issued a 27-page order Monday in response to a motion by BLM Seattle-King County to find the police department in contempt of his earlier injunction preventing police from using force against peaceful protesters. Jones found a total of four “clear violations” of his order: one involving the use of pepper spray and the other three involving blast balls, a grenade-like device that explodes and spews pepper gas. It’s a weapon the judge says raises serious concerns for the court.

 

[laughing dog]

Federal judge holds SPD in contempt for use of pepper spray, blast balls during Black Lives Matter protests this fall

Idiotic decision. Police need these non-lethal tools in order to control violent mobs like the Portland rioters or the extremists who occupied territory in Seattle.

Perhaps you did not read the linked article. Here is a snippet

A federal judge has found the Seattle Police Department in contempt of court for the indiscriminate use of pepper-filled “blast balls” and pepper spray during Black Lives Matter protests this fall, but also cited instances where police were justified in using force against demonstrators.

U.S. District Judge Richard Jones issued a 27-page order Monday in response to a motion by BLM Seattle-King County to find the police department in contempt of his earlier injunction preventing police from using force against peaceful protesters. Jones found a total of four “clear violations” of the injunction: one involving the use of pepper spray and the other three involving blast balls, grenadelike devices that explode and spew pepper gas. It’s a weapon the judge says raises serious issues with the court.

“Of the less lethal weapons, the Court is most concerned about SPD’s use of blast balls, the most indiscriminate of the four” crowd-control weapons whose use he examined. “SPD has often hurled blast balls into crowds of protesters” when no immediate threat to the officers’ safety or public property could be identified, the judge found.

At the same time, Jones highlighted four instances where officers’ use of force complied with his order.

That sounds to me to a thoughtful even-handed decision. The police had a previous injunction for their use of these weapons against peaceful protesters and were found to have violated that injunction. As any advocate of law and order would agree, violation of the law should require some sort of restraint or punishment.

 

[Angry Floof]

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Just sayin' ...

John Lee Malvo and John Allen Muhammad.

Muhammad was sentenced to death and has already been executed. Malvo is serving multiple life sentences in prison.

So I take it you are with us in believing police should also be held accountable and sentenced accordingly for the murders they commit.

 

[Trausti]

View attachment 30689

Just sayin' ...

John Lee Malvo and John Allen Muhammad.

Muhammad was sentenced to death and has already been executed. Malvo is serving multiple life sentences in prison.

So I take it you are with us in believing police should also be held accountable and sentenced accordingly for the murders they commit.

They were arrested while sleeping in their car, without incident. So sorry to poop on your narrative.

 

[Angry Floof]

Muhammad was sentenced to death and has already been executed. Malvo is serving multiple life sentences in prison.

So I take it you are with us in believing police should also be held accountable and sentenced accordingly for the murders they commit.

They were arrested while sleeping in their car, without incident. So sorry to poop on your narrative.

So sorry to poop on your disingenuous twisting of narrative. Cops murder people and are not held accountable. That is the issue. That is what we protest. That is what this thread is all about. You brought up two murderers who were held accountable. Yay for the cops who for once didn't kill them right in the street! Good for them, meeting the least expectations. But the murderers were held accountable. The cops who murdered those other people were not held accountable no matter how many instances you can pick out of cops not being murderous cunts.

 

[Trausti]

Muhammad was sentenced to death and has already been executed. Malvo is serving multiple life sentences in prison.

So I take it you are with us in believing police should also be held accountable and sentenced accordingly for the murders they commit.

They were arrested while sleeping in their car, without incident. So sorry to poop on your narrative.

So sorry to poop on your disingenuous twisting of narrative. Cops murder people and are not held accountable. That is the issue. That is what we protest. That is what this thread is all about. You brought up two murderers who were held accountable. Yay for the cops who for once didn't kill them right in the street! Good for them, meeting the least expectations. But the murderers were held accountable. The cops who murdered those other people were not held accountable no matter how many instances you can pick out of cops not being murderous cunts.

Dude (or dudette), the picture posted by Elixer very obviously insinuates that police kill blacks but not whites when making an arrest. This is demonstratively not true. (Hello Colin Ferguson!)

 

[Angry Floof]

So sorry to poop on your disingenuous twisting of narrative. Cops murder people and are not held accountable. That is the issue. That is what we protest. That is what this thread is all about. You brought up two murderers who were held accountable. Yay for the cops who for once didn't kill them right in the street! Good for them, meeting the least expectations. But the murderers were held accountable. The cops who murdered those other people were not held accountable no matter how many instances you can pick out of cops not being murderous cunts.

Dude (or dudette), the picture posted by Elixer very obviously insinuates that police kill blacks but not whites when making an arrest. This is demonstratively not true. (Hello Colin Ferguson!)

Because ALL TOO OFTEN THEY DO brutalize or murder unarmed black people and peacefully arrest armed white mass murderers. No one said they kill black people at *every single interaction* with them. But again, it happens disproportionally and when it does, they need to be held accountable. Try to keep up, Trausti.

 

[Trausti]

So sorry to poop on your disingenuous twisting of narrative. Cops murder people and are not held accountable. That is the issue. That is what we protest. That is what this thread is all about. You brought up two murderers who were held accountable. Yay for the cops who for once didn't kill them right in the street! Good for them, meeting the least expectations. But the murderers were held accountable. The cops who murdered those other people were not held accountable no matter how many instances you can pick out of cops not being murderous cunts.

Dude (or dudette), the picture posted by Elixer very obviously insinuates that police kill blacks but not whites when making an arrest. This is demonstratively not true. (Hello Colin Ferguson!)

Because ALL TOO OFTEN THEY DO brutalize or murder unarmed black people and peacefully arrest armed white mass murderers. No one said they kill black people at *every single interaction* with them. But again, it happens disproportionally and when it does, they need to be held accountable. Try to keep up, Trausti.

I try, but your conspiracy theory just doesn't fit the data. Facts first, AF.

 

[Trausti]

It's open season on unarmed white guys taking the subway. SMH.

 

[Angry Floof]

Because ALL TOO OFTEN THEY DO brutalize or murder unarmed black people and peacefully arrest armed white mass murderers. No one said they kill black people at *every single interaction* with them. But again, it happens disproportionally and when it does, they need to be held accountable. Try to keep up, Trausti.

I try, but your conspiracy theory just doesn't fit the data. Facts first, AF.

Give us the facts then. How many cops who murder blacks are charged versus how many cops who murder white people are charged? How many of those black people murdered by cops were armed and unarmed? How many white people murdered by cops were armed and unarmed? Of all the cops who have actually been charged and tried for brutalizing or murdering people, how do their sentences compare regarding whether they brutalized or murdered black people or white people? How many cops have expressed implicit or explicit racism against whites as compared to the widespread racist comments from police against black people?

 

[Angry Floof]

It's open season on unarmed white guys taking the subway. SMH.

Yeah, "open season" on white guys being killed by black cops. That's the ticket! Suddenly the mountain of unarmed black bodies murdered by white cops without consequence just disappears!

 

[Jarhyn]

It's open season on unarmed white guys taking the subway. SMH.

Yeah, "open season" on white guys being killed by black cops. That's the ticket! Suddenly the mountain of unarmed black bodies murdered by white cops without consequence just disappears!

Or, argument by Tu Quoque. One bad doesn't make a pile of bad go away. They're both just cops murdering people with little consequences and it's disgusting.

 

[Angry Floof]

It's open season on unarmed white guys taking the subway. SMH.

Yeah, "open season" on white guys being killed by black cops. That's the ticket! Suddenly the mountain of unarmed black bodies murdered by white cops without consequence just disappears!

Or, argument by Tu Quoque. One bad doesn't make a pile of bad go away. They're both just cops murdering people with little consequences and it's disgusting.

Yep, it's clear that Trausti agrees that cops should not kill unarmed people and should be held accountable if they do, so I'm not sure why he always argues the other way around, though the fact that if the skin color were reversed, he would find these cops very easy to excuse and defend, so that's a clue as to why.

 

[J842P]

It's open season on unarmed white guys taking the subway. SMH.

Yeah, "open season" on white guys being killed by black cops. That's the ticket! Suddenly the mountain of unarmed black bodies murdered by white cops without consequence just disappears!

A mountain? Look your claim that "it's open season on black people" just doesn't hold up to any scrutiny.

Cops kill a disturbing amount of people in the US, white and black. Indeed, usually, more white men are killed by cops than any other demographic, although, the numbers of unarmed people killed are small and there are statistical variations each year.

Now, in raw numbers, this is still disproportionately affecting black people. But when you take contextual factors into account, it seems you are no more likely to get killed by a cop when you are black than when you are white.

However, it definitely seems that use of force is initiated more readibly against black and hispanic people in the US.

https://scholar.harvard.edu/fryer/p...-analysis-racial-differences-police-use-force

This fundamentally comes down to two things: Americans commit way more violent crime than you would expect given per-capita wealth (although, I would argue that is a misleading statistic). And, America is filled with guns, and police frequently encounter armed criminals.

I also think that a lot of the policing strategies are remnants from the 1980s, 1990s when crime, particularly violent crime, was much higher.

 

[J842P]

Because ALL TOO OFTEN THEY DO brutalize or murder unarmed black people and peacefully arrest armed white mass murderers. No one said they kill black people at *every single interaction* with them. But again, it happens disproportionally and when it does, they need to be held accountable. Try to keep up, Trausti.

I try, but your conspiracy theory just doesn't fit the data. Facts first, AF.

Give us the facts then. How many cops who murder blacks are charged versus how many cops who murder white people are charged? How many of those black people murdered by cops were armed and unarmed? How many white people murdered by cops were armed and unarmed? Of all the cops who have actually been charged and tried for brutalizing or murdering people, how do their sentences compare regarding whether they brutalized or murdered black people or white people? How many cops have expressed implicit or explicit racism against whites as compared to the widespread racist comments from police against black people?

Almost no cops that kill anyone are charged, except for the most egregious cases. Pretty much, for any high profile shooting of an unarmed black man, you can find something similar happening to a white guy. Hell, even Tamir Rice, for example, which was particularly egregious IMO, you have cases like this white kid:

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/georgia-cop-wont-be-charged-shooting-death-teen-n158306

He was shot because he answered the door holding a video game controller. The police weren't even charged with manslaughter or reckless endangerment. And there's some pretty crazy shit that happened there with the charges going to a second grand jury, that overturned the decision of the first.

 

[Angry Floof]

It's open season on unarmed white guys taking the subway. SMH.

Yeah, "open season" on white guys being killed by black cops. That's the ticket! Suddenly the mountain of unarmed black bodies murdered by white cops without consequence just disappears!

A mountain? Look your claim that "it's open season on black people" just doesn't hold up to any scrutiny.

Cops kill a disturbing amount of people in the US, white and black. Indeed, usually, more white men are killed by cops than any other demographic, although, the numbers of unarmed people killed are small and there are statistical variations each year.

Now, in raw numbers, this is still disproportionately affecting black people. But when you take contextual factors into account, it seems you are no more likely to get killed by a cop when you are black than when you are white.

However, it definitely seems that use of force is initiated more readibly against black and hispanic people in the US.

https://scholar.harvard.edu/fryer/p...-analysis-racial-differences-police-use-force

This fundamentally comes down to two things: Americans commit way more violent crime than you would expect given per-capita wealth (although, I would argue that is a misleading statistic). And, America is filled with guns, and police frequently encounter armed criminals.

I also think that a lot of the policing strategies are remnants from the 1980s, 1990s when crime, particularly violent crime, was much higher.

I'm not the one who said open season. I am, however the one who is asking how many cops who murder unarmed white people go to prison and how many who murder black people go to prison, and some other questions that are not too far down the page for you to find without me typing them all back in again.

We already know that black people who murder, brutalize, or rape white people get longer sentences (20% longer) than white people who murder, brutalize, or rape black people for the same crimes. The more serious the crime and harsher the sentence, the larger the disparity. We also know that murder, brutalization, and rape of black bodies carries a lighter sentence than the murder, brutalization, and rape of white bodies regardless of the skin color of the person who did it.

Is it different for cops, the group that is more overtly racist by the day and trained to dehumanize citizens and regard them as dangerous? Somehow they are not part of the systemic racism we see across the country?

https://www.aclu.org/sites/default/...achr_racial_disparities_aclu_submission_0.pdf

 

[J842P]

I'll start with this one.:

NYPD Officer Still Has A Job Even Though He Was Caught Planting Weed On Two Innocent Men In Separate Incidents

A New York Police Department officer is still roaming the streets after his own body camera captured him apparently planting drugs on innocent people twice.

The Intercept acquired bodycam footage reportedly showing Officer Kyle Erickson planting weed in a car during a traffic stop on March 13, 2018.

In the video, Erickson and his partner Elmer Pastran, pulled over a Staten Island driver who supposedly had a broken taillight. Jason Serrano was sitting in the passenger seat during the stop. Serrano, who was recovering from a stab wound, and his female friend were ordered out of the car after the cops claimed they smelled weed.

“I can barely move,” Serrano said while lifting his shirt to show the wound on his abdomen.

“I don’t want to see that,” Erickson replied. When the officers demanded to search Serrano’s jacket he kept protesting — “There’s nothing in there. … I’m not getting searched for no reason” — and was eventually thrown to the ground despite the severity of his injuries.

“They said I was resisting arrest, but I just didn’t want to hit the floor, the only thing I was thinking about was [the injury],” Serrano told The Intercept. “I still had staples in me. … I couldn’t even stand up straight.”

Erickson searched the car while Pastran searched Serrano’s jacket, but they didn’t find anything.

“We gotta find something,” Erickson can be heard telling Pastran.

Erickson goes back to the car for another search. His body camera shows him fiddling with a small nugget of weed before he dropped it in a cup holder. The officers exchange a look and asked each other if they were “good,” as if they were confirming Erickson’s plant.

This makes no sense. Once a cop has been busted like this he's worthless in court.

Loren, your fundamental problem in all of these discussions is thinking that because you can "make sense" of something in some way reality must conform to that self-consistent picture in your head.

This makes a lot of sense - cops in America defend cops. They are more like a gang than anything else.

 

[Worldtraveller]

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Just sayin' ...

So the key is to be heavily armed! [/Murrka]

 

[blastula]

George Floyd died because he put a lethal amount of fentanyl into his body - Chauvin should not have held him like that for minutes on end, but Floyd would have been fine had he not overdosed.

Wow, Derec, come to find out you're not only a professional epidemiologist, you're also a forensic pathologist. Impressive!

 

[Jarhyn]

This makes no sense. Once a cop has been busted like this he's worthless in court.

Loren, your fundamental problem in all of these discussions is thinking that because you can "make sense" of something in some way reality must conform to that self-consistent picture in your head.

This makes a lot of sense - cops in America defend cops. They are more like a gang than anything else.

And, LP assumes that the people he's "busting" can afford lawyers anyway, rather than just being over a barrel with a public defender who isn't going to know, or question, the officer.

If it works good enough often enough to keep bringing fines and arrests in, it doesn't matter so much if occasionally they can afford a lawyer with the time to argue against the plant. They are still out the money for the lawyer, and the cop just gets another vacation... Until he can move to a different jurisdiction where the judges don't know him.