Police Misconduct Catch All Thread

[Loren Pechtel]

If you had bothered to read the entire linked article you'd had seen

Jones asked lawyers for BLM to submit a motion for proposed sanctions by the end of next week.

. The article is dated December 7. So no decision on sanctions has occurred at this writing.

I know he asked for ideas. I'm questioning whether there is anything in his power that will actually address the problem.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

Federal judge holds SPD in contempt for use of pepper spray, blast balls during Black Lives Matter protests this fall

Idiotic decision. Police need these non-lethal tools in order to control violent mobs like the Portland rioters or the extremists who occupied territory in Seattle.

Except they are employing those tools with an accuracy approximating that of WWII bombers.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

Muhammad was sentenced to death and has already been executed. Malvo is serving multiple life sentences in prison.

So I take it you are with us in believing police should also be held accountable and sentenced accordingly for the murders they commit.

They were arrested while sleeping in their car, without incident. So sorry to poop on your narrative.

So sorry to poop on your disingenuous twisting of narrative. Cops murder people and are not held accountable. That is the issue. That is what we protest. That is what this thread is all about. You brought up two murderers who were held accountable. Yay for the cops who for once didn't kill them right in the street! Good for them, meeting the least expectations. But the murderers were held accountable. The cops who murdered those other people were not held accountable no matter how many instances you can pick out of cops not being murderous cunts.

If you want to accomplish something useful start by quit crying wolf. Protest the real problems, not every case involving a black person that isn't utterly obviously justified. As it stands now an awful lot of people consider BLM part of the problem rather than part of the solution.

 

[Angry Floof]

So sorry to poop on your disingenuous twisting of narrative. Cops murder people and are not held accountable. That is the issue. That is what we protest. That is what this thread is all about. You brought up two murderers who were held accountable. Yay for the cops who for once didn't kill them right in the street! Good for them, meeting the least expectations. But the murderers were held accountable. The cops who murdered those other people were not held accountable no matter how many instances you can pick out of cops not being murderous cunts.

If you want to accomplish something useful start by quit crying wolf. Protest the real problems, not every case involving a black person that isn't utterly obviously justified. As it stands now an awful lot of people consider BLM part of the problem rather than part of the solution.

If you want to accomplish something useful, stop replying to my posts with this drivel. You just pull whatever out of your ass and believe it's true because it's your ass you pull it out of. I damn will protest cops killing black people every fucking time they do it. Die mad about it. And as it stands now, an awful lot of people, a hell of a lot more people than there are right wing authoritarian bootlicking morons, consider misinformation, lies, twisting of the truth, and right wing bullshit like the above as part of the problem, if not the problem. No one's going to shut up to make people like you comfortable.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

Because ALL TOO OFTEN THEY DO brutalize or murder unarmed black people and peacefully arrest armed white mass murderers. No one said they kill black people at *every single interaction* with them. But again, it happens disproportionally and when it does, they need to be held accountable. Try to keep up, Trausti.

Reality check:

Police shooting rates vary by the location, but within a location we do not see a racial bias.

Likewise, when compared against the number of arrests whites are actually slightly (but below statistical significance) more likely to get shot.

The only racial pattern we see at all is more "unarmed" blacks getting shot--but this ignores the fact that trying to take the cop's weapon is a completely valid reason to shoot. (It would be a completely valid reason for a civilian to shoot as well.)

Quit defending the bad guys, focus on the real problems--the George Floyd's (police administering a bit of street justice) and the Breonna Taylor's (reckless behavior in pursuit of drugs) of the world. When you lump these in with the Michael Brown's you make the real problems look fake rather than make the fake problems look real.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

This makes no sense. Once a cop has been busted like this he's worthless in court.

Loren, your fundamental problem in all of these discussions is thinking that because you can "make sense" of something in some way reality must conform to that self-consistent picture in your head.

This makes a lot of sense - cops in America defend cops. They are more like a gang than anything else.

The cop testifies.

The defense brings up the prior lying on the stand and asks why he should be believed this time.

The defendant walks.

 

[Angry Floof]

>snip bootlicking bullshit<

Stop defending abusers of power. Stop expecting the most powerless among us to be the grownups while not expecting police with weapons and badges to behave any better than fucking baboons.

 

[Trausti]

Because ALL TOO OFTEN THEY DO brutalize or murder unarmed black people and peacefully arrest armed white mass murderers. No one said they kill black people at *every single interaction* with them. But again, it happens disproportionally and when it does, they need to be held accountable. Try to keep up, Trausti.

Reality check:

Police shooting rates vary by the location, but within a location we do not see a racial bias.

Likewise, when compared against the number of arrests whites are actually slightly (but below statistical significance) more likely to get shot.

The only racial pattern we see at all is more "unarmed" blacks getting shot--but this ignores the fact that trying to take the cop's weapon is a completely valid reason to shoot. (It would be a completely valid reason for a civilian to shoot as well.)

Quit defending the bad guys, focus on the real problems--the George Floyd's (police administering a bit of street justice) and the Breonna Taylor's (reckless behavior in pursuit of drugs) of the world. When you lump these in with the Michael Brown's you make the real problems look fake rather than make the fake problems look real.

Heh. Shoot out in D.C. Black guys. Cops arrest six. No one dies. (Not just due to poor marksmanship but also 'cause AF's narrative is bullshit.)



Wild shootout in Northeast DC captured on home surveillance video

 

[Derec]

So the key is to be heavily armed! [/Murrka]

No, the key is to be heavily armed while committing your crimes but to nicely surrender to the police. Not attack them.
Plenty of blacks, including those who shot at police, have been apprehended peacefully. And plenty of whites have been killed by police.
This idiotic meme is highly cherry-picked.

 

[Derec]

Except they are employing those tools with an accuracy approximating that of WWII bombers.

That's a separate issue, I think.
My point is that police is Seattle have been hamstrung so much that #BLMers managed to occupy and hold actual territory. For weeks!
If anything, Seattle police need to be more aggressive dealing with these "uprisings", not less.

 

[Derec]

Wow, Derec, come to find out you're not only a professional epidemiologist, you're also a forensic pathologist. Impressive!

I did not make it up. It was widely reported that he had meth and a lethal dose of fentanyl in his system, that he had a pulmonary edema (likely caused by fentanyl) and an enlarged heart.

Given all those facts, I fail to see how any unbiased jury could conclude that Chauvin caused Floyd's death even by preponderance of evidence, much less beyond a reasonable doubt.

 

[Derec]

Give us the facts then. How many cops who murder blacks are charged versus how many cops who murder white people are charged?

I would say vast majority of them. Cases like Michael Brown etc. are not murders and in cases where police really did commit crimes, for example Walter Scott, the officer was charged and convicted.

With black shootees some cops who did nothing wrong face politically motivated charges. Like the cop who shot Rayshard Brooks in Atlanta or the cop who shot Jamaica Hampton in San Francisco. Both officers were attacked by perps, both defended themselves and both are being railroaded in politically motivated prosecutions.

How many of those black people murdered by cops were armed and unarmed?

Killed by cops. Calling it "murder" prejudges a shooting as unjustified.
Vast majority of the people shot by police have been armed, regardless of race. Most had a gun. And most of the unarmed ones attacked the police (see Brown, Michael O.D.) Note that you call police shootings "murder" even when the perp is armed. That is a testament to your bias in this issue.

How many cops have expressed implicit or explicit racism against whites as compared to the widespread racist comments from police against black people?

What "widespread racist comments"?

 

[Derec]

That sounds to me to a thoughtful even-handed decision. The police had a previous injunction for their use of these weapons against peaceful protesters and were found to have violated that injunction. As any advocate of law and order would agree, violation of the law should require some sort of restraint or punishment.

"Peaceful protesters" don't occupy territory. Remember CHAZ aka "Seattle Soviet Republic"?

My point is that the police in Seattle and other left-leaning cities is hamstrung too much already and do not have the ability to go after rioters, looters etc.

 

[ZiprHead]

Black Mom Swarmed & Beaten by Philly Riot Police with Toddler in Car Demands Officers Be Fired

A Black mother who was attacked by a horde of Philadelphia police officers is speaking out about the harrowing experience. Rickia Young was driving an SUV with her 2-year-old son and teenage nephew on October 27 as the city was engulfed in protest over the police killing of Walter Wallace Jr. earlier that day. Officers descended on the vehicle, broke its windows, assaulted and arrested her and separated her from her child. Young’s arrest went viral due to a shocking video of the police swarming her vehicle, and after the National Fraternal Order of Police — the country’s largest police union — posted a photo of her 2-year-old on social media, falsely claiming he “was lost during the violent riots in Philadelphia, wandering around barefoot in an area that was experiencing complete lawlessness.” More than a month after the police attack, Rickia Young is demanding the officers involved be fired. “The police have not offered an explanation as to why they acted the way they did that night. They responded instead with a police investigation into Rickia,” says Kevin Mincey, Rickia Young’s attorney.

Video of the incident in the link.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

>snip bootlicking bullshit<

Stop defending abusers of power. Stop expecting the most powerless among us to be the grownups while not expecting police with weapons and badges to behave any better than fucking baboons.

How about addressing the facts rather than calling them bootlicking.

 

[Angry Floof]

>snip bootlicking bullshit<

Stop defending abusers of power. Stop expecting the most powerless among us to be the grownups while not expecting police with weapons and badges to behave any better than fucking baboons.

How about addressing the facts rather than calling them bootlicking.

Because the bootlicking is factual. You can't consistently take the side of law enforcement no matter what facts are available and pretend you're not a bootlicker. As has been said a million times here, those of us who are not bootlickers will err on the side of the powerless, those who do not have the state or the status quo at their back.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

Wow, Derec, come to find out you're not only a professional epidemiologist, you're also a forensic pathologist. Impressive!

I did not make it up. It was widely reported that he had meth and a lethal dose of fentanyl in his system, that he had a pulmonary edema (likely caused by fentanyl) and an enlarged heart.

Given all those facts, I fail to see how any unbiased jury could conclude that Chauvin caused Floyd's death even by preponderance of evidence, much less beyond a reasonable doubt.

It has been widely reported in right wing propaganda, that is. There are big problems with that theory, though:

1) "lethal dose". The problem is opioids do not have a lethal dose. That is not to say you can't overdose on them, it's that you can't reasonably define the point of overdose--what's a lethal dose to someone not habituated to them doesn't mean much to a regular user.

2) Opioid overdose is a quick thing. He's not going to walk into the store, then get hauled out of it, then die of an overdose.

All this really means is that he was a regular user of opioids. It very well might have some bearing on his death--that level of opioids is going to mess with your behavior and very well might have led to the police administering a bit of "justice", but it didn't cause his death.

Consider a local dispute about a police shooting. The guy had a "lethal dose" of an opioid, IIRC morphine but I'm not sure, in his blood at the time of death. It made him do stupid things in a store, he refused to leave when told to, the cops were called and it ended up with the police shooting him--the drugs "killed" him only to the extent that they made him not hand over his concealed gun when told to and then finally hand it over barrel first. (In hindsight he was handing it over, not trying to shoot the cops. The cops didn't realize the guy was handing over the gun in it's holster and just saw him draw a gun on them.)

 

[laughing dog]

That sounds to me to a thoughtful even-handed decision. The police had a previous injunction for their use of these weapons against peaceful protesters and were found to have violated that injunction. As any advocate of law and order would agree, violation of the law should require some sort of restraint or punishment.

"Peaceful protesters" don't occupy territory. Remember CHAZ aka "Seattle Soviet Republic"?

I think we are in agreement - neither one of us has a clue what you are talking about.

[
My point is that the police in Seattle and other left-leaning cities is hamstrung too much already and do not have the ability to go after rioters, looters etc.

That is simply delusional. The police are fully armed. The police are not enjoined against using appropriate force in appropriate circumstances.

It is inappropriate to use force against peaceful protesters. It really is that simple.

 

[laughing dog]

If you had bothered to read the entire linked article you'd had seen

Jones asked lawyers for BLM to submit a motion for proposed sanctions by the end of next week.

. The article is dated December 7. So no decision on sanctions has occurred at this writing.

I know he asked for ideas. I'm questioning whether there is anything in his power that will actually address the problem.

There are punitive measures for disobeying an injunction. or court order.

 

[ZiprHead]

Baltimore Police Lied About Almost Every Aspect of Its Spy Plane Program

For six months this year, a spy plane flew over Baltimore for hours every day conducting aerial surveillance of everything that happened in 90 percent of the city—an area that encompasses 32 square miles.

The Baltimore Police Department told the public and a federal appeals court that the surveillance images would only be stored for 45 days, that the planes would only be used for limited tracking of individuals to and from known crime scenes, and that the Aerial Investigation Research (AIR) program couldn’t be used to gather identifying information like license plate numbers.

The Baltimore Police Department was lying, according to an audit from independent evaluators hired by the city.

The ACLU and local activists are currently suing the BPD in an attempt to prevent the AIR program, which was a six-month pilot, from starting up again in Baltimore or anywhere else. In its court filings in that case, BPD made statements that “bear an insufficient resemblance to the reality of how AIR operates,” the auditors from New York University School of Law’s Policing Project wrote in an amicus brief to the court.

The Policing Project team also wrote that, prior to oral arguments before the federal appeals court in September, it pointed out the false statements in the department’s case filings to BPD’s lawyers “believing [BPD] counsel would correct the record, but counsel did not.”