Racism And Kamala Harris

[Jimmy Higgins]

what will you do if Trump ends up winning? Are you going to be okay with it?

Are you suffering from some memory problem?
Fuck no! I can’t speak for anyone else, but you seem to be all alone in being okay with a rapist conman felon fraudster being President.

Yes. Emily is obviously a supporter but doesn't have the guts to come right out and say it. She worries about guys in women's spaces but supports a guy who entered a women's dressing room and raped a woman.

I know you're the forum owner and all, but I would expect that you are still bound by the same forum rules, and thus shouldn't be making up lies about members.

I've no idea whether Emily is a Trump supporter, or simply part of the ignorant and gulled entourage of present-day Trump-supporting Republicans.

Emily Lake isn't a Trump supporter, but I'm near certain she'd vote in a manner that'd be beneficial for Trump and the Project 2025 movement.

Are you taking the position that any vote that isn't for Harris is beneficial to Trump?

I think I misspoke. What meant to say that on average of all your votes (not merely President), have likely had a beneficial impact for the right-wing. This is an empirical test, so you'll know if that is right or not.

These days, I don't actually vote *for* anyone. I end up sifting through the offal and trying to vote for whoever is most likely to do the least long-term damage. The problem is that the two parties (and their various candidates for various offices) stand to do extremely different types of damage in very different ways. So it's not like I'm trying to choose between the pineapple that's going to give me a migraine tomorrow and the apple that will have no effect at all. I'm trying to choose between the chicken in heavy cream that's going to increase my cholesterol but has lower carbs so is better for by blood sugar, and the pasta in primavera that is going to irritate my heartburn and has more carbs but also has some vegetables.

Yeah, and I don't think you are particularly good at choosing.

I'm seriously at a point where my greatest hope for US politics is a deadlock that gets nothing at all accomplished. Sure, it's cynical, I know that. But from my point of view, I'd rather have nothing get done that to risk that either side of this shit-show manages to pass things that I think are disastrous and wrongheaded.

Like I said above.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

just as *some* of the democratic party platform the elimination of the police and open borders.

Wrong. That is not anywhere in the Democratic party platform. There are a few extremists that say that sort of stupid shit but NOT the Democratic party. I bet you got that idea from right wing social media.

Extremists like... AOC, Rashida Tlaib, Kamala Harris, Cori Bush, and Joe Biden? All of whom expressed support for Defund the Police movements in 2020 and 2021. An idea I got from... the things they said and did.

Pointing out that the GOP wants to do stupid fucking things is fine - you're not telling me anything I don't already know. But it's not making me blind to the stupid fucking things that the Dems want to do.

Somewhere along the way, you (and others) seem to have jumped on board the train of thought that says anyone who points out the bad behavior of both parties is actually a closet racist-bigot-nazi-trumpster and that anything they say bad about the Reps is just some kind of special secret smokescreen to cover their inherent badness. You've completely lost sight of your own black and white view of the world, and you're blind to your own partisanship.

?? Biden has always been against defund the police. Harris made a couple statements where she stated that some resorces might be better on crime prevention in 2020. Nothing since then. And she's consistently supported Biden as he was very vocal supporter of the police. She was a prosecutor for gods sake!

https://www.cnn.com/2021/02/17/politics/defunding-police-biden-town-hall-trnd/index.html

Joe Biden is a middle of the road moderate. Kamala Harris was a former Attorney General, a role that rarely involves radicals. To stuff them together with Bush and Tailib just goes to show that Emily Lake doesn't know what she is talking about.

 

[laughing dog]

just as *some* of the democratic party platform the elimination of the police and open borders.

Wrong. That is not anywhere in the Democratic party platform. There are a few extremists that say that sort of stupid shit but NOT the Democratic party. I bet you got that idea from right wing social media.

Extremists like... AOC, Rashida Tlaib, Kamala Harris, Cori Bush, and Joe Biden? All of whom expressed support for Defund the Police movements in 2020 and 2021. An idea I got from... the things they said and did.

Pointing out that the GOP wants to do stupid fucking things is fine - you're not telling me anything I don't already know. But it's not making me blind to the stupid fucking things that the Dems want to do.

Somewhere along the way, you (and others) seem to have jumped on board the train of thought that says anyone who points out the bad behavior of both parties is actually a closet racist-bigot-nazi-trumpster and that anything they say bad about the Reps is just some kind of special secret smokescreen to cover their inherent badness. You've completely lost sight of your own black and white view of the world, and you're blind to your own partisanship.

?? Biden has always been against defund the police. Harris made a couple statements where she stated that some resorces might be better on crime prevention in 2020. Nothing since then. And she's consistently supported Biden as he was very vocal supporter of the police. She was a prosecutor for gods sake!

https://www.cnn.com/2021/02/17/politics/defunding-police-biden-town-hall-trnd/index.html

Joe Biden is a middle of the road moderate. Kamala Harris was a former Attorney General, a role that rarely involves radicals. To stuff them together with Bush and Tailib just goes to show that Emily Lake doesn't know what she is talking about.

I agree that neither Mr. Biden nor Ms Harris are radical leftists. I think it is rather delusional to think so. But I also think that many people, (especially ones who are extremely vexed or frustrated) nowadays tend to more hyperbolic rhetoric. While I may be wrong - and Emily Lake can (and will, if I am wrong) correct me, but I think that is her situation.

 

[Elixir]

Joe Biden is a middle of the road moderate. Kamala Harris was a former Attorney General, a role that rarely involves radicals. To stuff them together with Bush and Tailib just goes to show that Emily Lake doesn't know what she is talking about.

Worse, Biden, Harris, Tailib and Bush are crammed together with Trump, Vance, Empty Gee, Boebert...
Some of these things are not like the others because they want to destroy America. Certain people's failure to educate themselves leaves them distraught over the very existence of partisanship. They seem to think both sides contribute to the strife, so they must be equal.
It's a stupid and dangerous approach that might very well enable fascists to take over this Country. But if you tell them that they will scream that you're just as bad, and can't see how one-sided you are, yourself.
Whether such people totally understand what's gong on and are in favor of fascism, or are simply too uncomprehending of the current situation to respond rationally, DOESN'T MATTER.
We need to drive the turnout votes of people who DO understand the stakes in the coming election. If we don't, "bothsidesism" - whether malicious or well intended - is going to kill us. The "both sides" noisemakers are not going to determine the outcome this fall.

Yeah, I'm one sided. I know it, and resent having been forced into that corner by the death threat to democracy that has been adopted by one of our major political parties.

 

[pood]

The Democratic Party might represent inclusion and compassion on paper... but its supporters don't seem even remotely shy about wearing their hatred on their sleeves.

Seriously, are you feeling alright? While we don’t often agree, these bizarre generalizations seem out of character for you to me.

I'm actually fed up with the hatred I see coming from people I used to view as reasoned liberals. I'm absolutely floored by the number of self-styled progressives who have no problem at all supporting pro-hamas demonstrations in the US, and who make up shallow excuses to support the harassment and intimidation of US citizens who are jewish.

Then you are floored by a straw man of your own making, since the vast majority of those protesters are not supporting Hamas but protesting against Israel’s genocide against Palestine, and I think very few of them at best support the harassment and intimidation of U.S. citizens who are Jewish. And I feel pretty confident in saying NO ONE on THIS FORUM is pro-Hamas or supports the harassment and intimidation of U.S. citizens who are Jewish.

I'm absolutely at the end of patience for the volumes of idiots who insist that they are liberals while simultaneously feeling justified in trampling all over free speech, hounding and threatening those who don't adopt their view, and somehow feel that it's just fine to refer to half the goddamned country as being bigots and racists and nazis and fascists.

Who exactly is trampling over free speech, and how exactly are they doing it? I just noticed you are spewing your dumb opinions all over this forum, and no one has stopped you yet, or trampled you in any way. As to half the country, by their votes ye shall know them. Not one single goddamn person in this country has any excuse to vote for Donald Trump.

I'm not a republican, I never have been. There are some topics on which I'm somewhat conservative, but there are plenty of topics on which I'm borderline socialist. But I NEVER get conservatives telling me that I'm evil, insisting that I'm a secret racist, or even going so far as to call me a pink-commie or anything even remotely close to that for my views on education funding, health care delivery, and the like.

But it’s perfectly OK for that half of the country that intends to vote for Trump to characterize the rest of us as baby killers, commie socialists, fags, fag hags, childless cat ladies condemned to be miserable, to call for military tribunals for people who disagree or oppose them, as Trump has done, to spew racist and misogynistic bullshit, to call for immigrants to be rounded up and put in camps or deported, and on and on and on and on. Is that it? But you know what, after a time the target of all that right-wing invective, which has been going on for decades now, begin to fight the fuck back.

I’ll deal with the rest of your spew later.

 

[thebeave]

just as *some* of the democratic party platform the elimination of the police and open borders.

Wrong. That is not anywhere in the Democratic party platform. There are a few extremists that say that sort of stupid shit but NOT the Democratic party. I bet you got that idea from right wing social media.

Extremists like... AOC, Rashida Tlaib, Kamala Harris, Cori Bush, and Joe Biden? All of whom expressed support for Defund the Police movements in 2020 and 2021. An idea I got from... the things they said and did.

Pointing out that the GOP wants to do stupid fucking things is fine - you're not telling me anything I don't already know. But it's not making me blind to the stupid fucking things that the Dems want to do.

Somewhere along the way, you (and others) seem to have jumped on board the train of thought that says anyone who points out the bad behavior of both parties is actually a closet racist-bigot-nazi-trumpster and that anything they say bad about the Reps is just some kind of special secret smokescreen to cover their inherent badness. You've completely lost sight of your own black and white view of the world, and you're blind to your own partisanship.

?? Biden has always been against defund the police. Harris made a couple statements where she stated that some resorces might be better on crime prevention in 2020. Nothing since then. And she's consistently supported Biden as he was very vocal supporter of the police. She was a prosecutor for gods sake!

https://www.cnn.com/2021/02/17/politics/defunding-police-biden-town-hall-trnd/index.html

Joe Biden is a middle of the road moderate. Kamala Harris was a former Attorney General, a role that rarely involves radicals. To stuff them together with Bush and Tailib just goes to show that Emily Lake doesn't know what she is talking about.

I guess it depends on how you define "radical". If "radical" means at the extreme ends of the political ideologies, then certainly KH has met that definition during the whole time she was a Senator. Only surpassed by Elizabeth Warren, who occupies the #1 spot:

https://voteview.com/person/41701/kamala-devi-harris

Check out the ideology score in the uppper right corner of the webpage.

But if by radical, you mean just plain kind of batshit crazy, then yes I would agree that KH is certainly not at Talib or Bush's level.

 

[Elixir]

"I NEVER get conservatives telling me that I'm evil"

If you find yourself saying that, it's time to try to figure out why.
It just might be that it's because your wants and wishes, the people you call idiots (liberals), the people you defend...
MAYBE they are all the same wants and wishes that fascist conservatives harbor, MAYBE you are insulting the same people they insult and MAYBE you are defending the same people they defend.
That WILL get you the kid glove treatment from conservatives, while simultaneously raising the ire of liberals. Explains everything.

If the shoe fits, wear it.

 

[Elixir]

If "radical" means at the extreme ends of the political ideologies, then certainly KH has met that definition during the whole time she was a Senator. Only surpassed by Elizabeth Warren, who occupies the #1 spot:

I gotta disagree. KH or Warren are nowhere near AOC or Tailib, Well, maybe Liz Warren is somewhere near them, but not quite IMHO.
There's a LOT of room to the left of Kami Harris, believe me. Think about it; She's a PROSECUTOR. Almost by definition a redneck conservative, by the yardstick that was in play 40 years ago. Things HAVE moved to the right since then, but no so much as to leave Harris stranded on the left bank, as you imply.

 

[Harry Bosch]

just as *some* of the democratic party platform the elimination of the police and open borders.

Wrong. That is not anywhere in the Democratic party platform. There are a few extremists that say that sort of stupid shit but NOT the Democratic party. I bet you got that idea from right wing social media.

Extremists like... AOC, Rashida Tlaib, Kamala Harris, Cori Bush, and Joe Biden? All of whom expressed support for Defund the Police movements in 2020 and 2021. An idea I got from... the things they said and did.

Pointing out that the GOP wants to do stupid fucking things is fine - you're not telling me anything I don't already know. But it's not making me blind to the stupid fucking things that the Dems want to do.

Somewhere along the way, you (and others) seem to have jumped on board the train of thought that says anyone who points out the bad behavior of both parties is actually a closet racist-bigot-nazi-trumpster and that anything they say bad about the Reps is just some kind of special secret smokescreen to cover their inherent badness. You've completely lost sight of your own black and white view of the world, and you're blind to your own partisanship.

?? Biden has always been against defund the police. Harris made a couple statements where she stated that some resorces might be better on crime prevention in 2020. Nothing since then. And she's consistently supported Biden as he was very vocal supporter of the police. She was a prosecutor for gods sake!

https://www.cnn.com/2021/02/17/politics/defunding-police-biden-town-hall-trnd/index.html

Joe Biden is a middle of the road moderate. Kamala Harris was a former Attorney General, a role that rarely involves radicals. To stuff them together with Bush and Tailib just goes to show that Emily Lake doesn't know what she is talking about.

I guess it depends on how you define "radical". If "radical" means at the extreme ends of the political ideologies, then certainly KH has met that definition during the whole time she was a Senator. Only surpassed by Elizabeth Warren, who occupies the #1 spot:

https://voteview.com/person/41701/kamala-devi-harris

Check out the ideology score in the uppper right corner of the webpage.

But if by radical, you mean just plain kind of batshit crazy, then yes I would agree that KH is certainly not at Talib or Bush's level.

Well, would you agree that a couple years in the senate, as a brand new senator, from a liberal state, is a relatively small sample set? I think that it's more important to judge her positions based on today (and her positions over the last four years). I'm not seeing a radical here. She's close to picking a VP (Shaperio and/or Kelly) who are clearly not radicals. From what I see, she's just left of middle (close maybe); similar to Nikki Hailey being just right of middle.

 

[thebeave]

If "radical" means at the extreme ends of the political ideologies, then certainly KH has met that definition during the whole time she was a Senator. Only surpassed by Elizabeth Warren, who occupies the #1 spot:

I gotta disagree. KH or Warren are nowhere near AOC or Tailib, Well, maybe Liz Warren is somewhere near them, but not quite IMHO.
There's a LOT of room to the left of Kami Harris, believe me. Think about it; She's a PROSECUTOR. Almost by definition a redneck conservative, by the yardstick that was in play 40 years ago. Things HAVE moved to the right since then, but no so much as to leave Harris stranded on the left bank, as you imply.

You seem to have missed the last sentence in my post:

But if by radical, you mean just plain kind of batshit crazy, then yes I would agree that KH is certainly not at Talib or Bush's level.

To be honest, she's a bit of an enigma, and I haven't quite figured her out. On the one hand, her voting record is there in black-and-white, and compared to her fellow senators, she is clearly at the far left during her whole role as a senator. I don't see how you can dispute that. But at the same time, like you say, she has done some things back in her CA prosecutor & AG days that put her kind of in a right wing authouratian camp. I certainly don't have a problem with someone who has both liberal and conservative values in moderate doses (that's how I am), but at the two extremes in a close span of time is...as she would say...really weird.

 

[Elixir]

You seem to have missed the last sentence in my post:

Pretty much, yeah.

I certainly don't have a problem with someone who has both liberal and conservative values in moderate doses (that's how I am), but at the two extremes in a close span of time is...as she would say...really weird.

I don't see her violating any principles she has evinced in the past. Haven't made a study of it though.
I REALLY liked the way she held some RW liars to task in Senate hearings; she gots skilz that should serve her well as an executive.
I am cautiously optimistic that she could be a great President.

I am also 100% confident that if Harris is elected, there will be a Presidential election in 2028, and regardless of outcome at that time, she will NOT try to stay in office for the rest of her life, try to destroy representative government, corrupt the judiciary or "weaponize" the DOJ to go after political opponents. DJT will CERTAINLY do all of those things if he is elected or manages to steal the office via subterfuge and political violence, as he plans.
If Harris' political opponents happen to be career criminal mobsters, rapists and fraudsters that Grand Juries have found to likely have committed crimes, though, I don't think she'll take steps to make prosecutions of such people go away. Certainly not if they are all of those things. And Trump will pardon all such people who support him, just like he did last time, as well as the treasonous thugs of Jan 6.

The choice is clear: THERE IS NO CHOICE if you want to go forward with a democratic republic.

 

[thebeave]

just as *some* of the democratic party platform the elimination of the police and open borders.

Wrong. That is not anywhere in the Democratic party platform. There are a few extremists that say that sort of stupid shit but NOT the Democratic party. I bet you got that idea from right wing social media.

Extremists like... AOC, Rashida Tlaib, Kamala Harris, Cori Bush, and Joe Biden? All of whom expressed support for Defund the Police movements in 2020 and 2021. An idea I got from... the things they said and did.

Pointing out that the GOP wants to do stupid fucking things is fine - you're not telling me anything I don't already know. But it's not making me blind to the stupid fucking things that the Dems want to do.

Somewhere along the way, you (and others) seem to have jumped on board the train of thought that says anyone who points out the bad behavior of both parties is actually a closet racist-bigot-nazi-trumpster and that anything they say bad about the Reps is just some kind of special secret smokescreen to cover their inherent badness. You've completely lost sight of your own black and white view of the world, and you're blind to your own partisanship.

?? Biden has always been against defund the police. Harris made a couple statements where she stated that some resorces might be better on crime prevention in 2020. Nothing since then. And she's consistently supported Biden as he was very vocal supporter of the police. She was a prosecutor for gods sake!

https://www.cnn.com/2021/02/17/politics/defunding-police-biden-town-hall-trnd/index.html

Joe Biden is a middle of the road moderate. Kamala Harris was a former Attorney General, a role that rarely involves radicals. To stuff them together with Bush and Tailib just goes to show that Emily Lake doesn't know what she is talking about.

I guess it depends on how you define "radical". If "radical" means at the extreme ends of the political ideologies, then certainly KH has met that definition during the whole time she was a Senator. Only surpassed by Elizabeth Warren, who occupies the #1 spot:

https://voteview.com/person/41701/kamala-devi-harris

Check out the ideology score in the uppper right corner of the webpage.

But if by radical, you mean just plain kind of batshit crazy, then yes I would agree that KH is certainly not at Talib or Bush's level.

Well, would you agree that a couple years in the senate, as a brand new senator, from a liberal state, is a relatively small sample set? I think that it's more important to judge her positions based on today (and her positions over the last four years). I'm not seeing a radical here. She's close to picking a VP (Shaperio and/or Kelly) who are clearly not radicals. From what I see, she's just left of middle (close maybe); similar to Hailey being just left of middle.

I certainly don't mind someone's views evolving over time, if its because they've educated themselves, got more realistic, etc. When it appears to be done for purposes of pandering to get votes, I get a little annoyed. I'm not sure its not the latter in KH's case. And as far as her positions, do we really know whether they have evolved since becoming VP? She really has not been all that vocal on her positions the last 3.5 years has she?

 

[pood]

By the way, Emily, were you getting ready to tell us finally which parts of the Democratic Party platform, which has not been written yet mind, favor open border and elimination of the police, as you have baselessly charged? Post proof or retract, please.

 

[pood]

Also, Emily, in addition to the fact that the Democratic Party has NEVER favored “open borders,” I draw your attention to the fact that a couple of months ago, Democrats and Republicans reached a bi-partisan deal to fund more border patrol agents and tighten asylum rules, only to have the Republicans back out of the deal when their Dear Leader Donald ORDERED them to, because he feared losing an issue he could use against Biden. Did Fox News forget to tell you about that?

 

[laughing dog]

I guess it depends on how you define "radical". If "radical" means at the extreme ends of the political ideologies, then certainly KH has met that definition during the whole time she was a Senator. Only surpassed by Elizabeth Warren, who occupies the #1 spot:

https://voteview.com/person/41701/kamala-devi-harris

Check out the ideology score in the uppper right corner of the webpage.

But if by radical, you mean just plain kind of batshit crazy, then yes I would agree that KH is certainly not at Talib or Bush's level.

Ms Warren is not part of the radical left by centrist standards. So, your analysis about Ms Hartis is unconvincing .

 

[pood]

I hope everyone realizes that when you make a reply, you can delete all the text prior to the line or lines to which you are specifically replying. Sometimes we can these long walls of text with nested quotes with only one or two lines in reply to a single sentence at the end of that long text wall. It’d be easier on the eyes if everyone would practice deleting inessential stuff.

 

[Emily Lake]

You've completely lost sight of your own black and white view of the world, and you're blind to your own partisanship.

Seriously? I have just perused a few of your comments. The anger and hyperbole doesn't lend itself to a debate.

Sure sure, and the hyperbole and anger of posters you agree with somehow fosters good discussion? Or are you merely blind to the anger and hyperbole of others?

It's just lashing out. Especially when you simply rehash all the tropes you have heard on Fox and the like. Not exactly original thinking. Just sayin'

I don't watch Fox or the like. So perhaps try not just making shit up so you have a just-so excuse to demean others.

 

[Elixir]

I don't watch Fox or the like.

Iirc you said IIDB is your main source of news. Gotta keep reminding myself.
Where did you read that Democrats favor open borders?

 

[RamblingFool]

So perhaps try not just making shit up so you have a just-so excuse to demean others.

Agreed, making shit up and demeaning others is not something I would want to emulate from you.

 

[Emily Lake]

If you are truly a not a Trump supporter, I apologize. However, you constsantly state that both sides are bad yet only criticize the progressive side. So you should be able to see how the confusion arises.

Give this some thinking, please. I criticize progressive policies, but not liberal policies. There is a distinction. I'm quite liberal, but I'm pretty clearly not progressive. I generally think that the motivations for progressive ideals are good motivations... but the execution and the application are frequently abhorrent to me, and they almost always have easily foreseeable negative consequences that progressives willfully ignore.

I'm not a Trump supporter. On the other hand... 19 out of every 20 posts that touches on US politics has something viciously negative to say about conservatives in general. Not just disagreements with positions, but outright name-calling hate-fueled shit-flinging nastiness. If it were limited solely to Trump, or even to explicit supporters of Trump, it would be more tolerable albeit still exhausting. But it's not limited. That same level of vitriol gets leveled at anyone who is not progressive, and it gets smeared with abandon to people who challenge progressive ideologies. I've lost track of the number of times I've been told that being an Independent makes me just as bad as the most rabid evil trumpsucker maggat fascist nazi to ever breathe.

On this site, in the discussions we have here... both sides are NOT equally bad. It is by far the progressives posting here who exhibit the most unhinged, antisocial, and vitriolic behavior. But such behavior is accepted and supported because it's the view shared by the majority of active posters in politics.

Politically, I view both sides as bad for entirely different and unrelated reasons. That said, the Republicans already get beaten to a pulp, dropped into a blender, then set on fire pretty much daily.

Do you feel that I am required to join in the two minutes of hate in order to prove my virtue to progressive posters here?