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Roe v Wade is on deck

ZiprHead

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A Providence Police Officer was placed on administrative leave Saturday, after allegedly assaulting a woman who was among those protesting at the Rhode Island State House Friday night, the department announced.

The Boston Globe identified the woman who was assaulted as Jennifer Rourke, an organizer of the Providence protest and a candidate for a State Senate District 29 seat in Warwick. Rourke told the Globe the person who hit her was off-duty police officer Jeann Lugo, who is the Republican running against her. Lugo told the Globe he “stepped in to protect someone that a group of agitators was attacking.”
 

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Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez on Twitter: "Here’s how Dems can + must do more than wait for an election. …" / Twitter
Here’s how Dems can + must do more than wait for an election.

Let’s start w/ why:

- 7 of the 9 justices were appointed by a party that hasn’t won a popular vote more than once in 30 years
Irrelevant. The Supreme Court justices are nominated by a President and confirmed by a Senate. If that means the court is 'illegitimate' then the Congress that AOC sits in is illegitimate.


- Several lied to Congress to secure their appointment…
What is this statement based on? Where has AOC shown that Justices made:
* counterfactual statements
* that were intended to deceive
* in order to secure their appointments?

Even if the first were proved, what would make that counterfactual statement a lie and not a broken promise or merely an indication that they changed their mind?

- 1 justice’s family (Thomas) was paid by right wing groups for years and he never disclosed it, violating Federal law

- Same justice’s spouse participated in 1/6 and he used his SCOTUS seat to vote to keep potential info related to his wife from investigators in Congress…

- 2 justices stand very credibly accused of sexual assault

And that’s the tip of the iceberg.

Election or not, the Supreme Court has a legitimacy crisis and the public reaffirms it: 75% of the US public reports lacking confidence in SCOTUS, & those numbers were *pre-Roe ruling*

In a legitimacy crisis, the solution Biden + Dem leaders must offer can’t just be one of voting, but of statute & authority.

Compared to Exec + Leg branch, checks on Court overreach and misconduct are little to none. Leaders must share their plans for Roe AND a rogue court.

Past Presidents, from Lincoln to FDR, understood the dangerous stakes of allowing an unchecked Court overreach its authority and threaten our democracy.

Lincoln ignored the court to issue the emancipation proclamation.

FDR, in the plunges of the Great Depression, also sought to confront the Court’s structure (and core gerontocracy problem of lifetime appointments) via public appeal. While he did not succeed, that check came from the ppl & Congress, NOT scotus.

The ruling is Roe, but the crisis is democracy. Leaders must share specific plans for both

The President & Dem leaders can no longer get away with familiar tactics of “committees” and “studies” to avoid tackling our crises head-on anymore:

- Restrain judicial review
- Open clinics on federal lands
- Court expansion
- Expand Fed access/awareness of pill abortions
- etc

For the moments when we DO insist on elections, we must be PRECISE with what we need and we will do with that power:

How many seats does the party need to Codify Roe?
An interesting question. What does AOC mean? If she means 'make a federal law forbidding States from forbidding abortion' - I don't think that can be done Constitutionally speaking. But if it could, the first Congress that did not agree could change that law.

 

ZiprHead

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Metaphor said:
- 7 of the 9 justices were appointed by a party that hasn’t won a popular vote more than once in 30 years
Irrelevant. The Supreme Court justices are nominated by a President and confirmed by a Senate. If that means the court is 'illegitimate' then the Congress that AOC sits in is illegitimate.
It's not irrelevant. It means that those justices were nominated by presidents the people didn't want to be in position to make those nominations.
 

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It's not irrelevant. It means that those justices were nominated by presidents the people didn't want to be in position to make those nominations.

By Meta’s “logic” Trump should still be president. His right to overthrow the 2020 electoral results was conferred upon him by elected senators and representatives.
 

ZiprHead

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It's not irrelevant. It means that those justices were nominated by presidents the people didn't want to be in position to make those nominations.

By Meta’s “logic” Trump should still be president. His right to overthrow the 2020 electoral results was conferred upon him by elected senators and representatives.
Well, I don't think I'd go that far on Meta but it does show how fucked up our system of government is.
 

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Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez on Instagram: “Roe Overturned: Action items & where we go from here”
She did some fundraising for some abortion activists. She said that a lot of things that some political leaders are saying are messages that can make one feel helpless. She says that it's important to go out and vote, but that it is necessary but not sufficient. One should also become an activist. One also should not quit when one fails - one should try again with different methods.

Donating to abortion funds is good, even if not enough. If you have the money, then do that. One shouldn't donate if one is scrapped for cash. If one has a couch or a spare room, one can lend it out to some abortion refugee from a red state. But if you don't have that, then one shouldn't do it.

What talents do you have? What can one offer on a consistent basis? Like being an artist or writer or having digital skills. She says "consistent basis" because activists have to be in it on a long term, and that was the problem with the Black Lives Matter demonstrations of 2020 - those activists didn't stay active for long enough. That was also a problem for the Occupy Wall Street activists. Despite the original Zuccotti Park campers getting a lot of imitators, their camps lasted only a few months before being closed down by the local authorities, and the campers did not find new campsites.

With the overturning of RvW, the women that are worst off are poor and minority women. The overturning also effects what to do about ectopic pregnancy, something that even the richest women can suffer from. She suggests doing lots of small actions instead of wondering what big ones that one can do. That is much like the anti-abortion strategy of many red states, essentially trying to regulate it out of existence with TRAP laws and the like.

She says that her colleagues ought to donate some of their campaign funds to abortion funds, or else to frontline colleagues, those in vulnerable seats, to keep out the Republicans. Like Ohio and Georgia. For the latter state, she made a mistake, describing both its two Senators as vulnerable. It's Sen. Raphael Warnock who is up for re-election, and he's vulnerable. Sen. Jon Ossoff is safe in his seat until 2026. She think that Iowa may have a chance for a Democratic pickup, unseating long-time Republican incumbent Chuck Grassley. He's 88 years old and he's been in office for 42 years, 7 Senate terms.

She has tips for people in both blue and red areas. In a blue area, one should adopt a swing seat to help campaign in, and one should vote in the primaries -- and be sure to assess the candidates. Democrats aren't all alike, she says. Who is serving communities vs. who is coasting. Like some long-time incumbent who seems more preoccupied with DC power politics than their constituents. Like the one that AOC unseated.

She says that one should be concerned about local and state as well as about Congress, and she offers her endorsements for local and state elections.

She then gets into policy issues. What do our leaders plan to do? Other than wring their hands about how little they can do. She proposes opening abortion clinics on Federal lands in red states - national parks, military bases, etc. Then the Hyde Amendment. She then praises Ayanna Pressley for leading on repealing that amendment. Some people were cowardly on it, however. She recalls the Trump years, where Trump would go ahead with something even if others disapproved. Even getting something for a few months until a court strikes it down would be better than nothing.

Another thing is educating people about abortion pills. Then about Supreme Court Justice candidates lying about not overturning RvW. She says that letting that happen means the erosion of the confirmation process. She then talks about how unrepresentative the Court has become. Also the selectivity of the Court in its recent gun rulings.

She then noted Abraham Lincoln disregarding the Supreme Court to issue the Emancipation Proclamation, overriding the court's Dred Scott ruling. Then FDR threatening to pack the court to protect the New Deal. He failed, but the Court backed off.

She then recapped what she said earlier, noting that a lot of activists have been activists for a long time. Also about politicians, some have served too long while doing too little, some have taken money from the wrong places, etc. Does a candidate have an online presence? Like a website or a social-media page, something that makes that candidate easily researchable. Also, requesting funds is not enough. What will that money be for? What seats to try to pick up?

She grumbled about leaders who don't do much, saying that those who prefer supposed norms to action may end up not having their norms. Like Democrats who cherish the Senate filibuster losing it to the Republicans. She also described getting $3M for a local hospital's maternal-health wing.
 

lpetrich

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lpetrich

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Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez on Twitter: "Just a few months ago I literally had to explain to Republican members of Congress how periods work. Their complete and utter incompetence is now killing women and pregnant people across the US. There remains no legitimate grounding or basis to force birth in the United States." / Twitter
noting
NowThis on Twitter: "‘6 weeks pregnant means 2 weeks late for your period’ — Watch @AOC school Gov. Greg Abbott on the problems with Texas' new abortion law (vid link)" / Twitter


Josh Hawley says Roe v Wade will give the GOP an advantage | The Kansas City Star
U.S. Sen. Josh Hawley on Friday celebrated the U.S. Supreme court ruling eliminating the constitutional right to abortion, calling it a sweeping decision that would change the shape of American politics for the next decade.

“I really do think this is going to be a watershed moment in American politics,” Hawley, a Republican from Missouri, said on a call with reporters. “I think another period of transformative change in American politics is now upon us.”

...
He predicted that people will base where they live on whether abortion is allowed and that the decision will end up redrawing demographic lines across the country.

“I would predict that the effect is going to be that more and more red states are going to become more red, purple states are going to become red and the blue states are going to get a lot bluer,” Hawley said. “And I would look for Republicans as a result of this to extend their strength in the Electoral College. And that’s very good news.”
These red-state refugees may move to purple states instead, making them bluer. That's what's happened with blue-state refugees from big cities in those states. Relatively conservative ones may leave, but they end up relatively liberal in their new homes. People who don't like paying taxes, but who want marijuana legal, abortion accessible, and guns regulated.

How California Is Turning The Rest Of The West Blue : It's All Politics : NPR - from 2013
American Migration Patterns Should Terrify the GOP - The Atlantic - from 2019
Turning Colorado and Nevada blue.
 

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AOC mentioned this in a recent Instagram story:
Electronic Frontier Foundation on Instagram: “The law around abortion access is shifting: …”
The law around abortion access is shifting: so too should your digital privacy and security plan. A few quick tips for folks in the abortion access movement:

1. Compartmentalize more sensitive online activities away from your regular ones
2. Know when to restrict and/or turn off your phone.
3. Turn off Ad ID!
4. Have rules for your data, with yourself and others.

For more information, as well as walkthroughs on how to up your data hygiene plans, visit: https://www.eff.org/issues/reproductive-rights

#digitalsecurity #dobbs #roevwade
by Daly and Eva of the Electronic Freedom Foundation, talking about OPSEC: operational security

Eva's hair was dyed light purple (lavender), and she was wearing a low-cut top. EFF seems like a rather informal workplace, at least for some employees.

Mentioning "finsta" - fake Instagram account
Where one parks one's car at night

Separate e-mail, phone #, browser
One's smartphone: when to lock, turn off, leave at home. When to turn off location services
Ad ID can give away one's identity and location

Ask for consent before sharing data, pictures. Request that others do the same for you
Pictures can include landmarks, and in their EXIF data, location data

Seems rather cloak-and-dagger, I must concede.
 

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Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez on Twitter: "Just a few months ago I literally had to explain to Republican members of Congress how periods work. Their complete and utter incompetence is now killing women and pregnant people across the US. There remains no legitimate grounding or basis to force birth in the United States." / Twitter
noting
NowThis on Twitter: "‘6 weeks pregnant means 2 weeks late for your period’ — Watch @AOC school Gov. Greg Abbott on the problems with Texas' new abortion law (vid link)" / Twitter


Josh Hawley says Roe v Wade will give the GOP an advantage | The Kansas City Star
U.S. Sen. Josh Hawley on Friday celebrated the U.S. Supreme court ruling eliminating the constitutional right to abortion, calling it a sweeping decision that would change the shape of American politics for the next decade.

“I really do think this is going to be a watershed moment in American politics,” Hawley, a Republican from Missouri, said on a call with reporters. “I think another period of transformative change in American politics is now upon us.”

...
He predicted that people will base where they live on whether abortion is allowed and that the decision will end up redrawing demographic lines across the country.

“I would predict that the effect is going to be that more and more red states are going to become more red, purple states are going to become red and the blue states are going to get a lot bluer,” Hawley said. “And I would look for Republicans as a result of this to extend their strength in the Electoral College. And that’s very good news.”
These red-state refugees may move to purple states instead, making them bluer. That's what's happened with blue-state refugees from big cities in those states. Relatively conservative ones may leave, but they end up relatively liberal in their new homes. People who don't like paying taxes, but who want marijuana legal, abortion accessible, and guns regulated.

How California Is Turning The Rest Of The West Blue : It's All Politics : NPR - from 2013
American Migration Patterns Should Terrify the GOP - The Atlantic - from 2019
Turning Colorado and Nevada blue.
That's part of what happened to California actually; we used to be a Republican stronghold, but one that by cultural convention allowed for considerable diversity of opinion and generally respected the civil rights of the citizens to a much greater degree than the rest of the country was capable of, which along with our general economic prosperity encouraged internal migration from other states as well as mass immigration from abroad. As the new GOP began to embrace ever more conservative ideologies at the national level, they lost touch with much of our populace, many of whom had come here in part to flee the oppressive policies of other states and countries; they did far more than the Democrats themselves to turn this state into the sea of blue (albeit with brackish red shorelines) that it is today.
 

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Reproductive Justice | Electronic Frontier Foundation

What Companies Can Do Now to Protect Digital Rights In A Post-Roe World | Electronic Frontier Foundation
In a post-Roe world, service providers can expect a raft of subpoenas and warrants seeking user data that could be employed to prosecute abortion seekers, providers, and helpers. They can also expect pressure to aggressively police the use of their services to provide information that may be classified in many states as facilitating a crime.

Whatever your position on reproductive rights, this is a frightening prospect for data privacy and online expression. That’s the bad news.

The good news is there is a lot companies—from ISPs to app developers to platforms and beyond—can do right now to prepare for that future, and those steps will benefit all users. If your product or service might be used to target people seeking, offering, or facilitating abortion access, now is the time to minimize the harm that can be done.

That article had a lot to say about content moderation policies.
Such moderation, however well-intentioned, is often deeply flawed, confusing and inconsistent, particularly when it comes to material related to sexuality and sexual health. Take, for example, the attempt by companies to eradicate homophobic and transphobic speech. While that sounds like a worthy goal, these policies have resulted in LGBTQ users being censored for engaging in counterspeech or for using reclaimed terms like “dyke.”

Facebook bans ads it deems “overly suggestive or sexually provocative,” a practice that has had a chilling effect on women’s health startups, bra companies, a book whose title contains the word “uterus,” and even the National Campaign to Prevent Teen and Unwanted Pregnancy.

In addition, government and private actors can weaponize community standards policies, flagging speech they don’t like as violating community standards. Too often, the speaker won’t fight back, either because they don’t know how, or because they are intimidated.

Platforms should take another look at their speech policies, and consider carefully how they might be abused. For example, almost every major internet platform—Facebook, Google (owner of Blogger and YouTube), Twitter, and reddit—has some prohibition on “illegal” material, but their policies do not explain much further. Furthermore, most have some policy related to “local laws”—but they mean laws by country, not by state. This language leaves a large hole for individuals and governments to claim a user has violated the policy and get life-saving information removed.

Furthermore, as noted, Facebook has a terrible track record with its policy related to sex and sexual health. The company should review how its policy of labeling images associated with “birth-giving and after-birth giving moments, including both natural vaginal delivery and caesarean section,” might lead to confusion.

...
In general, many sites have language outlawing material that may lead to “serious physical or emotional harm.” Depending on how “harm” is construed, and by whom, this language too could be an excuse to excise important tools and information.
 

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Pass the "My Body, My Data" Act | Electronic Frontier Foundation
We are proud to join Planned Parenthood, NARAL, National Abortion Federation, URGE, National Partnership for Women & Families, and Feminist Majority in support of the bill.

In addition to the restrictions on company data processing, this bill also provides people with necessary rights to access and delete their reproductive health information. Companies must also publish a privacy policy, so that everyone can understand what information companies process and why. It also ensures that companies are held to public promises they make about data protection, and gives the Federal Trade Commission the authority to hold them to account if they break those promises.

The bill also lets people take on companies that violate their privacy with a strong private right of action. Empowering people to bring their own lawsuits not only places more control in the individual's hands, but also ensures that companies will not take these regulations lightly.

Finally, while Rep. Jacobs' bill establishes an important national privacy foundation for everyone, it also leaves room for states to pass stronger or complementary laws to protect the data privacy of those seeking reproductive health care.

Congresswoman Jacobs Announces My Body, My Data Act to Protect Reproductive Health Data | Congresswoman Sara Jacobs
The bill would create a new national standard to protect personal reproductive health data, enforced by the Federal Trade Commission. By minimizing the personal reproductive health data that is collected and retained, the bill would prevent this information from being disclosed or misused.

...
The My Body, My Data Act would:
  • Limit the personal reproductive and sexual health data that can be collected, retained, used, or disclosed to only what is needed to deliver a product or service.
  • Protect personal data collected by entities not currently covered under HIPAA, including data collected by apps, cell phones, and search engines.
  • Require regulated entities to develop and share a privacy policy outlining how they collect, retain, use, and disclose personal reproductive health information.
  • Direct the Federal Trade Commission (FTC) to enforce the law and to develop rules to implement the statute.
  • Create a private right of action to allow individuals to hold regulated entities accountable for violations.
  • Provide additional consumer protections, including the right of an individual to access or delete their personal data if they choose to.
  • Include a non-preemption clause that allows states to provide further protection for reproductive and sexual health privacy

H.R.8111 - 117th Congress (2021-2022): My Body, My Data Act of 2022 | Congress.gov | Library of Congress by Rep. Jacobs, Sara [D-CA-53] (Introduced 06/16/2022)

"To protect the privacy of personal reproductive or sexual health information, and for other purposes."

The bill now has 43 cosponsors, 36 original.
 

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Security and Privacy Tips for People Seeking An Abortion | Electronic Frontier Foundation
Choosing a separate browser with hardened privacy settings is an easy and free start. Browsers like Brave, Firefox, and DuckDuckGo on mobile are all easy-to-use options that come with hardened privacy settings out of the box. It's a good idea to look into the “preferences” menu of whichever browser you choose, and raise the privacy settings even further. It's also a good idea to turn off this browser's features to remember browsing history and site data/cookies.

...
If you are calling clinics or healthcare providers, consider keeping a secondary phone number like Google Voice (which is free), Hushed, or Burner (both Hushed and Burner are paid apps, but have significantly better privacy policies than Google Voice). Having a separate email address, especially one that is made with privacy and security in mind, is also a good idea. Some email services you might consider are Tutanota and Protonmail.
Then about using a burner phone.
 

ZiprHead

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That is the inevitable result of dismantling democratic institutions, yes. Give us a true vote, or get ready to duck.
I wrote this in the lounge:
The left in the US is only slightly left. Most of our positions are quite popular. But we win presidential popular votes but the other guy wins the elections. We get far more votes in states for representatives but due to gerrymandering the right gets more reps. The senate due to the unconstitutional filibuster is controlled by the right even though the left has the majority. Our positions on gun control, health care including abortion, the environment, etc., are all more popular with the citizenry but this fucked up system of government we are stuck with prevents us from prevailing.
 

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The death of Roe, and the three prongs that killed her - June 24 - "Dobbs decision day", discussing the leaked version of Alito's decision document
The first prong: ‘A particular right’

(Justice Alito) First, we [the Court] explain the standard that our cases have used in determining whether the Fourteenth Amendment’s reference to “liberty” protects a particular right.

Under this prong, Alito disparages the reasoning in the Roe and Casey decisions for their reliance on the constitutional right to privacy and the due process clause, rights for which he clearly has little regard.
and
Somehow, Alito found it wise to scold us for thinking that the “goal of preventing abortion” might not have pure intentions. That abortion bans do not by themself constitute any “invidiously discriminatory animus against women.” Meaning that it can not be established that people or politicians simply proposing barriers to abortion have unwarranted, unjust discriminatory hostility (or resentment) against pregnable persons.
Then
The second prong: ‘ordered liberty’

(Justice Alito) Second, we [the Court] examine whether the right at issue in this case is rooted in our Nation’s history and tradition and whether it is an essential component of what we have described as ‘ordered liberty.’

...
To argue that it is not “deeply rooted” Alito crafts a misrepresentation of some of the legal history of abortion, and points out that abortion wasn’t recognized as a constitutional right until the 1973 Roe decision.

...
Trying to bolster his claims that abortion is not a recognized fundamental right, Alito damages his own defense by invoking Sir Matthew Hale, an English jurist from the 1600s whose contributions to law included exonerating husbands from culpability for raping their wives and sentencing two women to death for witchcraft.

...
What I won’t put aside is that Hale’s stance on marital rape is that consent to marriage is equivalent to consent to sex, and that consent cannot be retracted. That a woman cannot exclude a certain man from her own body at her own discretion. That she has renounced and lost that prerogative by saying “I do.” This is the person that Alito wants to put forth as a trusted expert? One who should be relied upon to help ascertain if and whether courts ought to recognize that pregnable persons have a fundamental right to exclude embryos from their bodies? Hale seems to have given little to no consideration of pregnable persons, a position for which he has found a willing stablemate in Alito.

...
Historian Lauren MacIvor Thompson described herself as “shocked” at the reference to Hale in a case related to women’s rights, noting that even for his time, Hale is considered “particularly misogynistic.”

Yes, it is hard to find a man prior to the Civil War who was privileged enough to become a legal or ethical scholar who also supported equal rights of all persons. That is precisely why we shouldn’t look to them to help us interpret or ascertain what constitutes equal or fundamental rights.
If we handle the Second Amendment in the same way, we find that it only covers muzzleloader guns, guns loaded down their barrels from their front ends. Breechloader guns, guns loaded from the back ends of their barrels, were rare when the Founders composed the Constitution, though most present-day guns are breechloaders. Also rare were guns that hold more than one bullet, like revolvers, though such guns are also nowadays common. The only ones back then were multibarrel guns, while revolvers were invented in the mid 19th cy. Semiautomatic and fully automatic guns did not exist, as far as I can tell, and they also were invented in the mid 19th cy. A semiautomatic gun gets the next bullet in place after firing a bullet, while an automatic gun does that and fires it, repeating with the next bullet after that one.
The third prong: The appeal to precedent, or lack thereof

(Justice Alito) Finally, we [the Court] consider whether a right to obtain an abortion is supported by other precedents.

Under this prong, Alito expresses that only “ordered liberty” is protected by the Constitution, saying, “Ordered liberty sets limits and defines the differences between competing interests.”

...
The argument that there exists a right to privacy that underpins many court decisions besides Roe is again brushed aside by Alito.
Decisions supporting birth control, same-sex marriage, same-sex sexual relations, and interracial marriage. I mention the latter because Clarence Thomas has such a marriage.
Alito doesn’t seem to like the use of the concept of autonomy or liberty to support abortion rights. He argues that the pro-choice proponents uses those concepts at too high a level of generality, which could “license fundamental rights to illicit drug use, prostitution, and the like.” Oh no! I respond as I fumble for the fainting couch. Even if it did, so what? While those behaviors aren’t about exercising the bodily right to exclude, we really ought to reexamine the “success” and harms of the war on drugs, the criminalization of sex work, and other generally victimless crimes.
"Farcically, Alito argues that pregnable persons don’t need abortion for equality."

"Alito proceeds to gaslight us further. He said that if pregnable persons wanted to change this, they could do so at the state level."

Then his very selective respect of precedent.
 

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Katie Lannan on Twitter: "Under an executive order Gov. Baker signed today, Mass. "will not cooperate with extradition requests from other states pursuing criminal charges against individuals who received, assisted with, or performed reproductive health services that are legal in [MA]," per his office." / Twitter
noting
No. 600: Protecting Access to Reproductive Health Care Services in the Commonwealth | Mass.gov

Tracking Where Abortion Is Now Banned - The New York Times
  • Abortion outlawed immediately in AL, AR, KY, LA, MO, OK, SD, UT, WI
  • Abortion outlawed "within days" in MS, WY
  • Abortion outlawed after 30 days in ID, ND, TN, TX
  • Abortion may soon be outlawed in WV
  • Abortion only before 6 weeks: GA, NC, OH
  • Abortion only before 15 weeks: AZ, FL
  • Uncertain status: IA, IN, KS, MI, MT, NC, NE, PA, VA
  • Abortion protected: AK, CO, IL, MA, ME, MN, NH, NM, NV, RI
  • Abortion access expanded: CA, CT, DC, DE, HI, MD, NJ, NY, OR, VT, WA
I am pleased that someone posted that.

As I look around the political landscape I see some giving negative reactions because of a belief that this will outlaw all abortion, and others giving positive reactions because of a belief that this will outlaw all abortion. It actually just makes it a state matter.

I suppose congress could actually try to do something on the issue. Unlikely. Part of the problem with RvW was that it was done entirely by the SCOTUS and congress had no part.
 

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Danke Hillary!
WTF is that supposed to mean? If the Hillary haters had rubbed two sticks together to get a spark of insight and voted for Hillary over Phony Soprano none of this shit would be happening.

Or do you like what is happening?
It just means that any time Derec can invent a way to dig at a woman who is strong, intelligent, well educated and accomplished, he’ll give it a try.

And fail, of course.
Yeah, but this is Hillary instead.
 

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The court that decided RvW consisted of eight white men and one black man.

The court that reversed RvW consisted of five white men, one black man, two white women, and one hispanic woman.

Identity politics is an interesting thing.
 

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Supreme Court Justice Clarence Thomas told his law clerks he intended to serve on the highest court of the land to make the lives of liberals "miserable," according to a 1993 report from The New York Times.

Thomas, who was confirmed to the Supreme Court in 1991 amid contentious confirmation hearings, resented the media coverage surrounding his appointment. Central to the hearings were accusations and testimony about alleged sexual harassment of one of his subordinates, Anita Hill, who accused the justice of repeated, unwanted sexual advances and inappropriate conduct in the workplace.

He was ultimately confirmed in a 52-48 vote.
 

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Danke Hillary!
WTF is that supposed to mean? If the Hillary haters had rubbed two sticks together to get a spark of insight and voted for Hillary over Phony Soprano none of this shit would be happening.

Or do you like what is happening?
It just means that any time Derec can invent a way to dig at a woman who is strong, intelligent, well educated and accomplished, he’ll give it a try.

And fail, of course.
Yeah, but this is Hillary instead.
Hillary is among the most accomplished people in this country.

You may disagree with her politics. But you cannot deny that she rose to the top of USA political world before being female was an advantage. She is smart, ambitious, savvy and ruthless.

Pretending differently makes you look like an idiot.
Tom
 

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The court that decided RvW consisted of eight white men and one black man.

The court that reversed RvW consisted of five white men, one black man, two white women, and one hispanic woman.

Identity politics is an interesting thing.
Dude. You really think people don't know who voted for and against this decision?

"Identity politics" has shit-all to do with this.
 

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It's not irrelevant. It means that those justices were nominated by presidents the people didn't want to be in position to make those nominations.

By Meta’s “logic” Trump should still be president. His right to overthrow the 2020 electoral results was conferred upon him by elected senators and representatives.
Oh yes? I must have missed the part of the Constitution that gives the right of anyone who lost the electoral college to overthrow an election.
 

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Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez on Twitter: "Here’s how Dems can + must do more than wait for an election. …" / Twitter
Here’s how Dems can + must do more than wait for an election.

Let’s start w/ why:

- 7 of the 9 justices were appointed by a party that hasn’t won a popular vote more than once in 30 years
Irrelevant. The Supreme Court justices are nominated by a President and confirmed by a Senate. If that means the court is 'illegitimate' then the Congress that AOC sits in is illegitimate.


A correction: The legislative body of the US is bicameral, comprised of a Senate and. House of Representatives. AOC is a member of the House of Representatives, not a Senator. The Senate informs Supreme Court nominees.

Whether or not the current US Supreme Court is legitimate is not dependent on nor does it determine whether AOC legitimately holds her seat.
 

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Danke Hillary!
WTF is that supposed to mean? If the Hillary haters had rubbed two sticks together to get a spark of insight and voted for Hillary over Phony Soprano none of this shit would be happening.

Or do you like what is happening?
It just means that any time Derec can invent a way to dig at a woman who is strong, intelligent, well educated and accomplished, he’ll give it a try.

And fail, of course.
Yeah, but this is Hillary instead.
I understand that it gives you real, genuine pain to recognize or acknowledge that a woman can be so very accomplished as is Hillary Clinton and even more so if she differs from you politically.

But you’re being ridiculous here and it’s making you look really bad.
 

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Oh yes? I must have missed the part of the Constitution that gives the right of anyone who lost the electoral college to overthrow an election.
Actually, if you look at the 2nd Amendment, in the original context, squint a bit, and you will see that the purpose of including it in the Constitution was precisely to facilitate episodes like the Jan6 insurgency.
Tom
 

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I wonder what it would take to get Hillary Clinton to run for president in 2024?

I certainly don't agree with all her positions. But dayum, that bitch got things done.

I'd probably vote for her again.
Tom
 

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It's not irrelevant. It means that those justices were nominated by presidents the people didn't want to be in position to make those nominations.

By Meta’s “logic” Trump should still be president. His right to overthrow the 2020 electoral results was conferred upon him by elected senators and representatives.
Oh yes? I must have missed the part of the Constitution that gives the right of anyone who lost the electoral college to overthrow an election.
You and Donald Trump.
 

ZiprHead

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Oh yes? I must have missed the part of the Constitution that gives the right of anyone who lost the electoral college to overthrow an election.
Actually, if you look at the 2nd Amendment, in the original context, squint a bit, and you will see that the purpose of including it in the Constitution was precisely to facilitate episodes like the Jan6 insurgency.
Tom
It helps if you hold it at just the right angle too.
 

TomC

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Oh yes? I must have missed the part of the Constitution that gives the right of anyone who lost the electoral college to overthrow an election.
Actually, if you look at the 2nd Amendment, in the original context, squint a bit, and you will see that the purpose of including it in the Constitution was precisely to facilitate episodes like the Jan6 insurgency.
Tom
It helps if you hold it at just the right angle too.
That's also important.
I didn't include everything.

The Constitution rather resembles The Bible. It's some writing by primitive men that's not always applicable to modern situations. But anyone who wants to support a modern belief or ethical value can nearly always find a verse that does the trick.

If not, just point out that God/Founding Fathers didn't specify. Then go on to explain what they'd have said if they'd gotten around to saying specifically. It's easy to justify nearly anything when old writings from primitive cultures are your guide.
Tom
 

ZiprHead

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I had hoped, intensely, this wouldn’t actually come. But the Dobbs case has been handed down. Unvarnished. Lawless. Dishonest. Heedless of the damage that will now immediately ensue. Hideously ideological, unelected hacks have moved to inflict their politics and their religion on a non-consenting nation. Now we all reap the whirlwind.

The U.S. Supreme Court has informed the nation and the world that the American constitutional ideal of liberty protects guns but not a woman’s right to reproductive freedom. A huge majority of us don’t believe that. These right-wing statists have declared that doesn’t matter. They’ll force it on us anyway. Their preferences prevail. Human rights and democracy be damned. They seem oblivious to the fact that they have, this day, announced the death of the Supreme Court. It may come in a month, or in a couple years, but it’s coming. Self-inflicted.

Democrats and their friends must understand that the battle for the American democracy is now, presently, upon us. Not tomorrow, not if the Congress is lost, not if Trump gets elected again, but now. This day. The Supreme Court fired on Fort Sumter. And if they’ll do this, it’s childish to think they won’t do more. Government by angry minority is launched. It will not be voluntarily abandoned.

So, in Washington, Democrats must act. First, the party must clearly state the mission. It must demand, therefore, the enactment of legislation codifying Roe v. Wade. Now. The bill should be as clean and sparse as possible to build the broadest coalition. It’s not time for a Christmas tree. But it must move. And all Democrats, if they are to stay in the caucus, must fight for it. They cannot defer based on the filibuster, the desire to meet authoritarians halfway, or anything else. The line of engagement must be drawn. If we lose, we lose. But at least we’ll show we’re committed to the American promise. And if we lose at this moment, we serve notice we’ll fight again next week. And the week after. We’re finished surrendering without battle.

Then there’s the Supreme Court. It’s crucial to be clear-eyed. There is no judicial institution here to save. It’s gone. The only question is whether it takes the democracy with it. The elected branches of government must fight back. So next, as has occurred before in our history, the Congress should pass legislation postponing the next term of the Supreme Court. A quick and bold shot across the bow; declaring this will not stand. It will cause disruption and confusion. But anyone who doesn’t think Dobbs has brought disruption by the galaxy-full is dreaming.
 

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GOOGLE LASD GANGS on Twitter: "“My rights should not be a fundraising point for the Democrats.” 💯💯💯 (vid link)" / Twitter
Someone objecting that all too many Democrats use this as an opportunity to fundraise, despite having had plenty of opportunity to codify RvW into law.

Then
Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez on Twitter: "We have been sounding the alarm about this for a long time. ..." / Twitter
We have been sounding the alarm about this for a long time.

Some may want to go after the messenger, but we simply cannot make promises, hector people to vote, and then refuse to use our full power when they do.

We still have time to fix this and act. But we need to be brave.

And if you are a lawmaker who, in the time between the leak & ruling, spent more manpower on a fundraising plan than a policy response, then I highly recommend rethinking your priorities.

Our job right now is to protect people. Doing so will drive the vote more than browbeating.

- Restrain judicial review
- Expand the court
- Clinics on federal lands
- Expand education and access to Plan C
- Repeal Hyde
- Hold floor votes codifying Griswold, Obergefell, Lawrence, Loving, etc
- Vote on Escobar’s bill protecting clinics

We can do it!
We can at least TRY
 

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Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez on Twitter: "Forced pregnancy is a crime against humanity." / Twitter

I looked at the responses, and I found
Ricky J. Marc, J.D., M.S. on Twitter: "FYI: Forcing someone to carry a pregnancy to term is considered a CRIME AGAINST HUMANITY according to the International Criminal Court’s Rōme Statute, whose jurisdiction the U.S. has repeatedly refused for reasons.

Don’t believe me? Read for yourselves: (links)" / Twitter

noting
United Nations Office on Genocide Prevention and the Responsibility to Protect

The full statute: RS-Eng.pdf
"Forced pregnancy" means the unlawful confinement of a woman forcibly made pregnant, with the intent of affecting the ethnic composition of any population or carrying out other grave violations of international law. This definition shall not in any way be interpreted as affecting national laws relating to pregnancy;
So one could haggle over that.
 

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Danke Hillary!
WTF is that supposed to mean? If the Hillary haters had rubbed two sticks together to get a spark of insight and voted for Hillary over Phony Soprano none of this shit would be happening.

Or do you like what is happening?
It just means that any time Derec can invent a way to dig at a woman who is strong, intelligent, well educated and accomplished, he’ll give it a try.

And fail, of course.
Yeah, but this is Hillary instead.
I understand that it gives you real, genuine pain to recognize or acknowledge that a woman can be so very accomplished as is Hillary Clinton and even more so if she differs from you politically.
There are many very accomplished women out there. It is an insult to them to count Hillary in their number.
 

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Danke Hillary!
WTF is that supposed to mean? If the Hillary haters had rubbed two sticks together to get a spark of insight and voted for Hillary over Phony Soprano none of this shit would be happening.

Or do you like what is happening?
It just means that any time Derec can invent a way to dig at a woman who is strong, intelligent, well educated and accomplished, he’ll give it a try.

And fail, of course.
Yeah, but this is Hillary instead.
I understand that it gives you real, genuine pain to recognize or acknowledge that a woman can be so very accomplished as is Hillary Clinton and even more so if she differs from you politically.
There are many very accomplished women out there. It is an insult to them to count Hillary in their number.
Wow
 

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AOC appeared on Meet the Press:

Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez on Twitter: "We have a responsibility to protect our democracy. That includes holding those in power who violate the law accountable.
Without it, rule of law can slip through our hands like sand through loose fingers." / Twitter

noting
Sarah Reese Jones on Twitter: ".@AOC says Kavanaugh, Barrett, and Thomas committed impeachable offenses, " I believe lying under oath is an impeachable offense and violating federal law and not disclosing income from political organizations as Clarence Thomas did is also potentially an impeachable offense." (vid link)" / Twitter

Poor Susan Collins Is Very Sad Kavanaugh and Gorsuch Lied to Her
and
Did the conservative justices commit perjury? Here’s what they said under oath about Roe v. Wade - News @ Northeastern - News @ Northeastern
Yet statements made by the trio of justices during their respective confirmation hearings suggested that they would, if confirmed, honor precedent or not reconsider matters thought to be so-called settled law (and Roe is frequently cited as such).

...
But amid the fallout from the Supreme Court’s decision Friday overturning Roe, what many—including Sen. Susan Collins of Maine—interpreted then as reassurance from the justices that they would uphold settled law turned out to be careful lawyerspeak. In retrospect, it should have suggested they were poised to do the opposite, says Dan Urman, director of the Law and Public Policy Minor at Northeastern, who teaches courses on the Supreme Court.

“To me, their careful lawyerly phrasing was, itself, a demonstration that they were prepared to overturn Roe,” Urman says. “If they were not, then they could have given a more direct and less careful answer.”
noting
WATCH: What Conservative Justices Said About Roe v. Wade During Their Supreme Court Confirmations - YouTube

Clarence Thomas's statements about it were long ago, when he was confirmed in 1991. So that's plenty of time to change his mind. In any case, his wife is a known insurrectionist, and he has yet to address that conflict of interest.

But Neil Gorsuch was confirmed in 2017, Brett Kavanaugh in 2018, and Amy Coney Barrett in 2020, which is *much* less time.

Would it be too much to ask to impeach all four Justices? That would be nice to see, though the Democratic leadership will have to be much less feckless to do it.
 

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Meet the Press on Twitter: "WATCH: @RepAOC (D-N.Y.) responds to Gov. Asa Hutchinson (R-Ark.) and Arkansas’ abortion ban.
“This decision and this policy will kill people no matter what their spin and what their talking points are.” (vid link)" / Twitter


Noting that Arkansas is the 3rd worst state for maternal mortality, and that black women are 70%. Checking on U.S. Census Bureau QuickFacts: Arkansas black people are 16% of the population.

Meet the Press on Twitter: "WATCH: Democrats must realize that the implications of the Roe decision are "not just a crisis of Roe" but "a crisis of our democracy,” @AOC says. #MTP
“The Supreme Court has dramatically overreached its authority. … This is a crisis of legitimacy.” (vid link)" / Twitter

and
Aaron Rupar on Twitter: "AOC on Meet the Press: "What I believe that the president and the Democratic Party needs to come to terms with is that this is not just a crisis of Roe, this is a crisis of our democracy ... this is a crisis of legitimacy and President Biden must address that" (vid link)" / Twitter

She said that the Democratic Party should do things that will make that party worth voting for. Like opening abortion clinic on Federal lands in red states, as proposed by Sen. Elizabeth Warren and others: Senators Warren and Smith Call on Biden and Congress to Protect Abortion Access noting Opinion | Elizabeth Warren and Tina Smith: We’ve Seen What Will Happen Next to America’s Women - The New York Times noting Warren, Murray Lead Over 20 Senators Urging President Biden to Issue Executive Order to Defend Americans’ Right to an Abortion | U.S. Senator Elizabeth Warren of Massachusetts - 23 of them.
  1. Increasing access to medication abortion.
  2. Providing resources for individuals seeking abortion care in other states.
  3. Establishing a reproductive health ombudsman at the Department of Health and Humans Services (HHS).
  4. Enforcing “Free Choice of Provider” requirements.
  5. Clarifying protections for sensitive health and location data.
  6. Using federal property and resources to increase access to abortion.
That last one might have problems with the Hyde Amendment, but one could get around that by hosting private clinics. I confess that it can be fun to think like a sleazy lawyer.
 

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AOC appeared on Meet the Press:

Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez on Twitter: "We have a responsibility to protect our democracy. That includes holding those in power who violate the law accountable.
Without it, rule of law can slip through our hands like sand through loose fingers." / Twitter
noting
Sarah Reese Jones on Twitter: ".@AOC says Kavanaugh, Barrett, and Thomas committed impeachable offenses, " I believe lying under oath is an impeachable offense and violating federal law and not disclosing income from political organizations as Clarence Thomas did is also potentially an impeachable offense." (vid link)" / Twitter

Poor Susan Collins Is Very Sad Kavanaugh and Gorsuch Lied to Her
and
Did the conservative justices commit perjury? Here’s what they said under oath about Roe v. Wade - News @ Northeastern - News @ Northeastern
Yet statements made by the trio of justices during their respective confirmation hearings suggested that they would, if confirmed, honor precedent or not reconsider matters thought to be so-called settled law (and Roe is frequently cited as such).

...
But amid the fallout from the Supreme Court’s decision Friday overturning Roe, what many—including Sen. Susan Collins of Maine—interpreted then as reassurance from the justices that they would uphold settled law turned out to be careful lawyerspeak. In retrospect, it should have suggested they were poised to do the opposite, says Dan Urman, director of the Law and Public Policy Minor at Northeastern, who teaches courses on the Supreme Court.

“To me, their careful lawyerly phrasing was, itself, a demonstration that they were prepared to overturn Roe,” Urman says. “If they were not, then they could have given a more direct and less careful answer.”
noting
WATCH: What Conservative Justices Said About Roe v. Wade During Their Supreme Court Confirmations - YouTube

Clarence Thomas's statements about it were long ago, when he was confirmed in 1991. So that's plenty of time to change his mind. In any case, his wife is a known insurrectionist, and he has yet to address that conflict of interest.

But Neil Gorsuch was confirmed in 2017, Brett Kavanaugh in 2018, and Amy Coney Barrett in 2020, which is *much* less time.

So what? I've read the "case" that Kavanaugh "lied" about his views and intentions, in this thread. If that is the totality of the case demonstrating he "lied", the case is pathetic. He said nothing like "I respect Roe v Wade and I will not overturn it".

And there is less than no case at all against ACB.
Would it be too much to ask to impeach all four Justices? That would be nice to see, though the Democratic leadership will have to be much less feckless to do it.
Why would they be impeached?

You appear to believe four years is not enough to change your mind. Well, your mind can be changed overnight if you read the right argument.

I once firmly believed in God. Then I read a high school philosophy text book which laid out all the arguments for and against God. And I thought "oh, the evidence isn't really there, is it?"

So if you had asked me the day before whether I believed in God and there was good philosophical reasons to do so, I'd have said yes. And the next day, I'd have said "I believe in God but there's no good philosophical reason to do so". And a few years later my answer would be "I don't believe in God and there's no good reason to".
 

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Now that the decision has been issued overturning Roe, he are at the point where we have insurgencies at the homes of some of the Justices.
Oh no, do they feel their privacy has been violated?

:rolleyes:
No - having someone trying to kill you isn't a violation of your privacy.
That seems like a pretty serious violation of privacy to me, actually. But of course, no such murder attempt has occurred. The President even signed a special bill to make sure all the Justices are safe from the mean old protesters. Isn't that fucking sweet. Everyone is friends up at the top.
 

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Now that the decision has been issued overturning Roe, he are at the point where we have insurgencies at the homes of some of the Justices.
Oh no, do they feel their privacy has been violated?

:rolleyes:
No - having someone trying to kill you isn't a violation of your privacy.
That seems like a pretty serious violation of privacy to me, actually.
I don't know if you are trying to win a point here, but ...what?

A violation of my privacy is somebody installing a camera in my bathroom without me knowing and selling footage of it on the internet. A violation of my privacy is my GP going on television to discuss my medical conditions. I can think of many others.

But someone trying to murder me isn't violating my 'privacy'. They're violating my right to not be murdered.
 
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