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Russian Invasion of Ukraine - tactics and logistics

bilby said:
Elixir said:
Loren Pechtel said:
The only reason you still have a country is your nukes.
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I have a feeling we are going to find out if any of them still work.
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I have a feeling that the answer is mostly going to be 'no'.

Nuclear weapons are very difficult and complex devices. There are a lot more ways to not have them work than there are to make them work - if that weren't the case, the Manhattan Project would have taken a couple of weeks and cost a few thousand bucks.

These are not weapons that can be expected to work after years of neglect, and they contain components that can be profitably sold on the black market, so exposure to corruption is even more debilitating.

I would be quite surprised if as many as half of Russia's nuclear weapons were able to actually cause a nuclear explosion.

Sadly, half of a lot is still a lot. Even a hundredth, or a thousandth, of their nuclear arsenal could seriously fuck up your entire day.
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Very true, but it's a mute issue. We'll see their missiles in air. We'll retaliate before their missiles hit the ground. No more Russia. But also, no more world. I don't know. I'm pessimistic right now. Haven't had my coffee. But if the world can't 100% unite to stop an imperialist invader, maybe we deserve a nuclear fate.
 
Harry Bosch said:
bilby said:
Elixir said:
Loren Pechtel said:
The only reason you still have a country is your nukes.
Click to expand...

I have a feeling we are going to find out if any of them still work.
Click to expand...
I have a feeling that the answer is mostly going to be 'no'.

Nuclear weapons are very difficult and complex devices. There are a lot more ways to not have them work than there are to make them work - if that weren't the case, the Manhattan Project would have taken a couple of weeks and cost a few thousand bucks.

These are not weapons that can be expected to work after years of neglect, and they contain components that can be profitably sold on the black market, so exposure to corruption is even more debilitating.

I would be quite surprised if as many as half of Russia's nuclear weapons were able to actually cause a nuclear explosion.

Sadly, half of a lot is still a lot. Even a hundredth, or a thousandth, of their nuclear arsenal could seriously fuck up your entire day.
Click to expand...
Very true, but it's a mute issue. We'll see their missiles in air. We'll retaliate before their missiles hit the ground. No more Russia. But also, no more world. I don't know. I'm pessimistic right now. Haven't had my coffee. But if the world can't 100% unite to stop an imperialist invader, maybe we deserve a nuclear fate.
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I'd think Russia would need to enact a large scale nuclear attack for us to respond with nuclear. A small scale nuclear attack could be responded to with a conventional onslaught destroying Russia's oil/gas infrastructure.

Though, at that point, the gloves would already be off and Russia would just go bananas. Of course, we still have a potential military and/or Oligarch firewall to a Russian nuclear attack.
 
At least we’re not talking about Russian war crimes, right barbos?
 
Sweden's sweatin' Gotland. Time was they had a military that could handle a belligerent Soviet Union. Then they assumed (there's that word again) a major land war was unlikely and decided to turn their focus toward sex. Now look at 'em. They should lease Gotland to the US while they get their defensive shit in one sock.
 
ZiprHead said:

BRUSSELS — Russia warned Finland and Sweden on Thursday that if they join NATO, Moscow will reinforce the Baltic Sea region, including with nuclear weapons.
The threat came a day after Finnish officials suggested that their country could request to join the 30-member military alliance within weeks and as Sweden mulled making a similar move.
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Finland and Sweden need to take a lesson from the Snake Islanders.
 
Elixir said:
At least we’re not talking about Russian war crimes, right barbos?
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You mean, "glorious special military operation to liberate Ukraine from Jewish Nazis!"?

It's gotta suck being a Putin apologist. You put all your eggs in one KGB basket, and the guy not only completely FUBARs the invasion of a neighbor, but galvanizes support for NATO and the (greatly hated) West in the process, creates suffering for the Russian people from well-deserved sanctions, and causes the deaths of untold thousands of Russian soldiers. The nation that you admire and once was angling to become a world power again is revealed to be a weak, corrupt bag of incompetence, and you watch in real time as the geopolitical landscape shifts at previously unseen speeds, and a Europe that was beholden to Russian oil and gas finally says "actually...fuck you, Vlad."

And the kicker? The fearsome KGB guy is getting his ass kicked on the world stage by a comedian. Sucks to be you.
 
ZiprHead said:

BRUSSELS — Russia warned Finland and Sweden on Thursday that if they join NATO, Moscow will reinforce the Baltic Sea region, including with nuclear weapons.
The threat came a day after Finnish officials suggested that their country could request to join the 30-member military alliance within weeks and as Sweden mulled making a similar move.
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Russia already has nuclear weapons in Kaliningrad. :rolleyes:
 
Russian Naval Commander: Mr. Putin! I have good news and bad news!

Putin: Give me the good news first.

Commander: Flagship cruiser Moskva is no longer on fire.

Putin: Excellent work! And what's the bad news?

Commander: Eh... have you seen the American imperialist movie called "Titanic"?

* * *

Jokes aside, this is an amazing success for Ukraine. Although it doesn't help with the effort in Eastern Ukraine, it makes it less likely that Russia would be able to try to retake Odessa later. And it may make it easier to target other ships because Moskva's main function was air defense.

Most importantly, it's a huge propaganda victory. Only about 50 sailors were rescued, according to reports, so that means there could be over 400 casualties. I'm not happy about it but war is war.
 
Jayjay said:
Russian Naval Commander: Mr. Putin! I have good news and bad news!

Putin: Give me the good news first.

Commander: Flagship cruiser Moskva is no longer on fire.

Putin: Excellent work! And what's the bad news?

Commander: Eh... have you seen the American imperialist movie called "Titanic"?
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Flagship cruiser Moskva has been promoted to submarine! Soon to be conducting underwater operations in Black Sea! Glory to Russia!
 
The English version in RT of the sinking of "Moskva" mentions that Ukraine claimed to have sunk it with a missile but noted that the Pentagon would not confirm the claim. So far, Russia has not explicitly denied that a Ukrainian missile caused the ammunition explosion and fire. The Russian version in RT is shorter and does not mention the claim of a missile strike by Ukraine. I don't know whether that is deliberate, but I've noted before that the English versions of articles on RT look more balanced than the Russian ones sometimes.

Russian version (use Google Translate): Минобороны России: крейсер «Москва» затонул при буксировке

English version: Russian flagship sank – military
 
Copernicus said:
The English version in RT of the sinking of "Moskva" mentions that Ukraine claimed to have sunk it with a missile but noted that the Pentagon would not confirm the claim. So far, Russia has not explicitly denied that a Ukrainian missile caused the ammunition explosion and fire. The Russian version in RT is shorter and does not mention the claim of a missile strike by Ukraine. I don't know whether that is deliberate, but I've noted before that the English versions of articles on RT look more balanced than the Russian ones sometimes.

Russian version (use Google Translate): Минобороны России: крейсер «Москва» затонул при буксировке

English version: Russian flagship sank – military
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"Destroyers sink all the time! This is perfectly normal! Should captain of Moskva die unexpectedly, it must be accidental ingestion of Polonium. Just like ship sinking, many people accidentally ingest Polonium and die. What a crazy world we live in, right?" (official Russian communique)
 
Copernicus said:
The English version in RT of the sinking of "Moskva" mentions that Ukraine claimed to have sunk it with a missile but noted that the Pentagon would not confirm the claim. So far, Russia has not explicitly denied that a Ukrainian missile caused the ammunition explosion and fire. The Russian version in RT is shorter and does not mention the claim of a missile strike by Ukraine. I don't know whether that is deliberate, but I've noted before that the English versions of articles on RT look more balanced than the Russian ones sometimes.

Russian version (use Google Translate): Минобороны России: крейсер «Москва» затонул при буксировке

English version: Russian flagship sank – military
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It wll be interestng to see what Barbos thnks about this. How the story told to Russians is different than the story told elsewhere.
 
ZiprHead said:
Copernicus said:
The English version in RT of the sinking of "Moskva" mentions that Ukraine claimed to have sunk it with a missile but noted that the Pentagon would not confirm the claim. So far, Russia has not explicitly denied that a Ukrainian missile caused the ammunition explosion and fire. The Russian version in RT is shorter and does not mention the claim of a missile strike by Ukraine. I don't know whether that is deliberate, but I've noted before that the English versions of articles on RT look more balanced than the Russian ones sometimes.

Russian version (use Google Translate): Минобороны России: крейсер «Москва» затонул при буксировке

English version: Russian flagship sank – military
Click to expand...
It wll be interestng to see what Barbos thnks about this. How the story told to Russians is different than the story told elsewhere.
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There is no way to spin this in positive light. Either Russia set its own ship on fire, or it was destroyed by Ukraine. Both are bad. Instead, I think Russian propaganda will just downplay the incident and turn its attention to something else. Like the Moon.

www.themoscowtimes.com

Russia Will Restart Moon Landings, Says Putin - The Moscow Times

Russia will renew its lunar program with a new moon landing mission, President Vladimir Putin announced Tuesday. “We need to successfully stand up to the challenges of space exploration,” Putin said during a visit to the Vostochny Cosmodrome in Russia’s Far Eastern Amur region.
www.themoscowtimes.com www.themoscowtimes.com
 
From The Hill:
...
The U.S. and allies are working to send anti-ship missiles to Ukraine as it scrambles to bolster up Kyiv’s ability to defend itself against Russia’s invasion.

“We have started consulting with Allies on providing anti-ship missiles to Ukraine,” a senior administration official told reporters after President Biden attended a NATO summit.
...

Not a good year to be a Russian sailor.
 
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