Russian Invasion of Ukraine - tactics and logistics

[Jayjay]

In other news:
Ukrainians have tried few evacuation attempts of someone from Mariupol.
One using helicopters (shot down), other one sent to help downed helicopter was shot down too.
Then they tried to do it by sea using large civilian ship, was captured too.

People are speculating who are they trying to evacuate. Obvious answer is Azov commanders. But some say it could be more than that - some NATO VIPs who were coordinating this.

I read that claim about NATO personnel too. I think it's just typical Russian propaganda, they see NATO boogiemen everywhere. The US intelligence was right about Russia starting the war, and withdrew its own diplomats away well in advance. I doubt they would've left their own people behind in Mariupol, one of the most obvious places where Russia was going to attack.

Nazis or not, it's impressive how long the Azov dudes have been able to survive. They tied up Russian forces in Mariupol and brought valuable time for Ukraine elsewhere.

Next decisive battles are going to be near Izyum it seems.

 

[barbos]

I read that claim about NATO personnel too. I think it's just typical Russian propaganda, they see NATO boogiemen everywhere

First, it's not russian propaganda, it's coming from ordinary people on the net I know, not from TV. They just speculate.
Second of all, it (not this specifically) comes from your own damn people from the west. They speak english with american/british accents.
Third of all, it's coming from your own damn governments. They proudly proclaim all kind of support for "Ukraine"

.The US intelligence was right about Russia starting the war, and withdrew its own diplomats away well in advance.

Who speculates they are stuck there by accident? It could be NATO guys who were responsible for relaying real time intelligence to ukro-nazis. Russians taking that guy alive would be very unfortunate for you. Fleeing Mariupol by pretending to be russian/ukrainian is obviously not possible, so....

Nazis or not, it's impressive how long the Azov dudes have been able to survive. They tied up Russian forces in Mariupol and brought valuable time for Ukraine elsewhere.

There is not whole lot of "elsewhere". And it's a question who is tying who there.
Nazi battalions are the only real "military" (really terrorists) force Ukraine has, once they are exterminated it's game over. Not all nazis of course are in Mariupol, just a huge lot.

 

[Jayjay]

So NATO is coordinating with Nazis. I honestly don't know what to say about that.

Why not? You were coordinating with them before. You were coordinating with ISIS, soviet era mujahideens, etc. You were coordinating with all kind of scam.
And as I said before, BBC now admits it, so why?

One has to understand that for Russia, everyone is a Nazi. Just now they think Latvia is a Nazi country because they dedicated May 9th to remember the victims of the Ukraine war. Good for them.

The reality is that "nazis" in Ukraine are a marginal group. In Russia, they lead the country.

 

[Jayjay]

I read that claim about NATO personnel too. I think it's just typical Russian propaganda, they see NATO boogiemen everywhere

First, it's not russian propaganda, it's coming from ordinary people on the net I know, not from TV. They just speculate.
Second of all, it (not this specifically) comes from your own damn people from the west. They speak english with american/british accents.
Third of all, it's coming from your own damn governments. They proudly proclaim all kind of support for "Ukraine"

.The US intelligence was right about Russia starting the war, and withdrew its own diplomats away well in advance.

Who speculates they are stuck there by accident? It could be NATO guys who were responsible for relaying real time intelligence to ukro-nazis. Russians taking that guy alive would be very unfortunate for you. Fleeing Mariupol by pretending to be russian/ukrainian is obviously not possible, so....

Does that mean you will admit you were wrong when that guy is not taken alive (or dead), after the final mop up is done? It seems like they don't have many days left, so then we'll know. My money is on it being utter bullshit.

Nazis or not, it's impressive how long the Azov dudes have been able to survive. They tied up Russian forces in Mariupol and brought valuable time for Ukraine elsewhere.

There is not whole lot of "elsewhere". And it's a question who is tying who there.
Nazi battalions are the only real "military" (really terrorists) force Ukraine has, once they are exterminated it's game over. Not all nazis of course are in Mariupol, just a huge lot.

Azov has maybe less than 1000 members, less now that many have probably died.

But even if you were right, then it would be even more amazing that a few hundred people can destroy almost a quarter of Russian military power.

 

[barbos]

Azov has maybe less than 1000 members,

You must be confused by their designation as "battalion".
First of all, there are other "battalions"
Second, "battalion" is a historical name for them, in reality their numbers are much bigger than 1000.
There was another battalion called "Tornado" it was too nazi even for ordinary nazy, they disbanded it couple of years ago. They basically were just a bunch of criminals, rapists/etc. There is battalion called Dnepr, there is whole bunch of them. I can't name all of them. It was popular occupation for all kind of criminal scam.

Does that mean you will admit you were wrong when that guy is not taken alive (or dead), after the final mop up is done?

Do you know the meaning of the word "speculation" ?

It seems like they don't have many days left, so then we'll know. My money is on it being utter bullshit.

You have a weird tendency to stick to irrelevant details as if it's most important thing in the universe.

It's not. It was just a speculation which I found mildly interesting. And second, Western governments admitted providing all kinds of millitary support for these scambags.
Yes, I call ukrainian army and government scumbags and war criminal.

 

[barbos]

But even if you were right, then it would be even more amazing that a few hundred people can destroy almost a quarter of Russian military power.

Last number is 1500 men. Let's make it 3K by now.
That's not a quarter. And more importantly rate of the loss is much lower now for russians.
And ukrainian millitary losses according to pro-russian but western analysts is 30K.

 

[Hermit]

One has to understand that for Russia, everyone is a Nazi.

 

[barbos]

One has to understand that for Russia, everyone is a Nazi.

Funny you mention it. US is trying to build nazi coalition and so far only western countries are in it (except Hungary and Serbia). The rest of the world is like "Thanks, we'll pass"

Latest scandal is Serbia who voted for expelling Russia from Human rights council or something and then flat out blurted why they did so. I don't think US expected that

Sorry guys, your anti-russia coalition is very very thin and could break at any moment.

 

[Elixir]

US is trying to build nazi coalition

Does your lower case "nazi" refer to the Russian Newspeak definition of Nazi, where no Nazi beliefs are necessary, just opposition to Russian dictatorship? I hear that y'all had to make up that new definition because Pootey kept using the word to refer to a Jewish dude who shows no signs whatsoever of adhering to any actual Nazi ideology.

Sorry guys, your anti-russia coalition is very very thin and could break at any moment.

That was exactly what you were saying before your failed invasion attempt even began.
How's that working out for you, six weeks and 15-20,000 dead Russians later?

(HINT: Syria is not a critical part of the global coalition that opposes Pootey)

And ukrainian millitary losses according to pro-russian but western analysts is 30K.

You mean Tucker Carlson?

 

[DrZoidberg]

So NATO is coordinating with Nazis. I honestly don't know what to say about that.

Why not? You were coordinating with them before. You were coordinating with ISIS, soviet era mujahideens, etc. You were coordinating with all kind of scam.
And as I said before, BBC now admits it, so why?

The BBC admits it? Let's hear your arguments for it?

I think the idea that Nazis have any power in Ukraine or has ever been a threat to anyone is complete bullshit. Nazis waving flags on camera is not the same thing as they being a problem. The Azov regiment isn't a regiment. It's a bunch of pathetic dweebs.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

But even if you were right, then it would be even more amazing that a few hundred people can destroy almost a quarter of Russian military power.

Last number is 1500 men. Let's make it 3K by now.
That's not a quarter. And more importantly rate of the loss is much lower now for russians.
And ukrainian millitary losses according to pro-russian but western analysts is 30K.

If Ukrainian military losses were 30k, the show would be over and Russian troops in Kviv.

Instead, the Russians retreated from the Kviv front to concentrate on the lesser defended eastern front... and Putin has been adjusting the upper leadership of the Russian military... which isn't common when one is the winning side. Or when other military higher ups were getting killed on the front line, a place those types don't typically hang out.

Now Putin put the guy in charge of the Eastern front (read much less defended front) in charge of the entire military.... presuming past results indicate future gains. Russia and Putin have not been acting like they are the ones who are where they wanted to be at this point.

 

[bilby]

First, it's not russian propaganda, it's coming from ordinary people on the net I know, not from TV. They just speculate

That's the modern way to pass propaganda - fake grass roots commentators JAQing off.

It's the propaganda equivalent of the laundry detergent or life insurance advertisement, where two actors pretend to be friends having a chat, while the audience listens in.

Marketing is a multibillion dollar business, and they have spent two centuries trying to work out how to get their ideas into people's heads in such a way that the recipients don't even notice that the ideas weren't their own.

Viral advertising is the next level, where people who have been duped into thinking that they're spreading their own opinions persuade a whole tier of further dupes, who are able to say "this didn't come from an advertising agency, I heard it from my own friends!".

Selling wartime propaganda has never been any different from selling laundry soap.

I bet The Gruen Transfer never got aired in Russia.

 

[Harry Bosch]

But even if you were right, then it would be even more amazing that a few hundred people can destroy almost a quarter of Russian military power.

Last number is 1500 men. Let's make it 3K by now.
That's not a quarter. And more importantly rate of the loss is much lower now for russians.
And ukrainian millitary losses according to pro-russian but western analysts is 30K.

If Ukrainian military losses were 30k, the show would be over and Russian troops in Kviv.

Instead, the Russians retreated from the Kviv front to concentrate on the lesser defended eastern front... and Putin has been adjusting the upper leadership of the Russian military... which isn't common when one is the winning side. Or when other military higher ups were getting killed on the front line, a place those types don't typically hang out.

Now Putin put the guy in charge of the Eastern front (read much less defended front) in charge of the entire military.... presuming past results indicate future gains. Russia and Putin have not been acting like they are the ones who are where they wanted to be at this point.

The Russians didn't retreat from Kyiv. They got their asses kicked out of the Kyiv area.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

I read that claim about NATO personnel too. I think it's just typical Russian propaganda, they see NATO boogiemen everywhere. The US intelligence was right about Russia starting the war, and withdrew its own diplomats away well in advance. I doubt they would've left their own people behind in Mariupol, one of the most obvious places where Russia was going to attack.

Nazis or not, it's impressive how long the Azov dudes have been able to survive. They tied up Russian forces in Mariupol and brought valuable time for Ukraine elsewhere.

Next decisive battles are going to be near Izyum it seems.

This. There were no NATO people in Ukraine, thus it's clearly not NATO VIPs. We saw the war coming, foreigners would have left.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

There is not whole lot of "elsewhere". And it's a question who is tying who there.
Nazi battalions are the only real "military" (really terrorists) force Ukraine has, once they are exterminated it's game over. Not all nazis of course are in Mariupol, just a huge lot.

Your country is engaging in genocide--killing all military-age males in the areas they control. The only reason you still have a country is your nukes.

 

[Copernicus]

There is not whole lot of "elsewhere". And it's a question who is tying who there.
Nazi battalions are the only real "military" (really terrorists) force Ukraine has, once they are exterminated it's game over. Not all nazis of course are in Mariupol, just a huge lot.

Your country is engaging in genocide--killing all military-age males in the areas they control. The only reason you still have a country is your nukes.

And the reason for calling it genocide is that the Russian military has blocked safe corridors for civilians to evacuate and then continued to target civilians. There is now a report that Russia has used chemical weapons on civilians, just as they did in Syria.

Ukraine accuses Russia of chemical weapons attack in Mariupol

 

[TV and credit cards]

Who doesn’t like trucks? They are handy. Home repair and improvement, schlepping the conscripts and ammo, gardening, towing, and they tend to fair a bit better on less than ideal road conditions.
Russian trucks suck. Poor maintenance, poorly trained conscripts, corruption.
Well what did you expect?

Trucks

 

[Elixir]

The only reason you still have a country is your nukes.

I have a feeling we are going to find out if any of them still work.

 

[bilby]

The only reason you still have a country is your nukes.

I have a feeling we are going to find out if any of them still work.

I have a feeling that the answer is mostly going to be 'no'.

Nuclear weapons are very difficult and complex devices. There are a lot more ways to not have them work than there are to make them work - if that weren't the case, the Manhattan Project would have taken a couple of weeks and cost a few thousand bucks.

These are not weapons that can be expected to work after years of neglect, and they contain components that can be profitably sold on the black market, so exposure to corruption is even more debilitating.

I would be quite surprised if as many as half of Russia's nuclear weapons were able to actually cause a nuclear explosion.

Sadly, half of a lot is still a lot. Even a hundredth, or a thousandth, of their nuclear arsenal could seriously fuck up your entire day.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

There is not whole lot of "elsewhere". And it's a question who is tying who there.
Nazi battalions are the only real "military" (really terrorists) force Ukraine has, once they are exterminated it's game over. Not all nazis of course are in Mariupol, just a huge lot.

Your country is engaging in genocide--killing all military-age males in the areas they control. The only reason you still have a country is your nukes.

And the reason for calling it genocide is that the Russian military has blocked safe corridors for civilians to evacuate and then continued to target civilians. There is now a report that Russia has used chemical weapons on civilians, just as they did in Syria.

Ukraine accuses Russia of chemical weapons attack in Mariupol

Genocide or not genocide... Russia is committing egregious war crimes via indiscriminate and discriminate shelling. And we haven't gotten to the executing and/or rape of civilians accusation. (Though for the record, executing and raping soldiers is also a war crime)