Studies on vaccines

[tupac chopra]

Does anyone have any links to good studies on vaccines to show their effectiveness. Particularly whooping cough and maybe measles.

Thanks

 

[DBT]

Have you tried Google Scholar?

 

[J842P]

Does anyone have any links to good studies on vaccines to show their effectiveness. Particularly whooping cough and maybe measles.

Thanks

Seriously? What better evidence do you need than the almost utter eradication of the measles, pertussis, and rubella among populations following regular vaccination against these diseases during the middle of the 20th century? These diseases formerly infected millions and killed thousands a year, and the only places were we do see outbreaks are among populations that don't vaccinate. In America, among the Amish for example, or among the West Coast upper-income anti-vaccination lunatics.

You can always use pubmed if you want to look for current studies, but they will likely be in the context of identifying genetic variants where you see poor efficacy, or effectiveness against strains of these diseases in developing countries. Also, you likely will need to understand the difference between immunity on a patient-by-patient basis, and effectiveness overall at eradicating disease when you immunize a sufficient proportion of the population to confer herd immunity.

 

[Will Wiley]

Does anyone have any links to good studies on vaccines to show their effectiveness. Particularly whooping cough and maybe measles.

Thanks

Seriously? What better evidence do you need than the almost utter eradication of the measles, pertussis, and rubella among populations following regular vaccination against these diseases during the middle of the 20th century? These diseases formerly infected millions and killed thousands a year, and the only places were we do see outbreaks are among populations that don't vaccinate.

There seems to be limited incidence of outbreaks amongst vaccinated groups. Perhaps due to some who don't respond well to vaccinations, possibly for genetic reasons.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/23264672

Largest measles epidemic in North America in a decade--Quebec, Canada, 2011: contribution of susceptibility, serendipity, and superspreading events.
De Serres G1, Markowski F, Toth E, Landry M, Auger D, Mercier M, Bélanger P, Turmel B, Arruda H, Boulianne N, Ward BJ, Skowronski DM.
Author information
Abstract
BACKGROUND:

The largest measles epidemic in North America in the last decade, occurred in 2011 in Quebec, Canada, where rates of 1- and 2-dose vaccine coverage among children 3 years of age were 95%-97% and 90%, respectively, with 3%-5% unvaccinated.
METHODS:

Case patients identified through passive surveillance and outbreak investigation were contacted to determine clinical course, vaccination status, and possible source of infection.
RESULTS:

There were 21 measles importations and 725 cases. A superspreading event triggered by 1 importation resulted in sustained transmission and 678 cases. The overall incidence was 9.1 per 100,000; the highest incidence was in adolescents 12-17 years old (75.6 per 100,000), who comprised 56% of case patients. Among adolescents, 22% had received 2 vaccine doses. Outbreak investigation showed this proportion to have been an underestimate; active case finding identified 130% more cases among 2-dose recipients. Two-dose recipients had milder illness and a significantly lower risk of hospitalization than those who were unvaccinated or single-dose recipients.
CONCLUSIONS:

A chance superspreading event revealed an overall level of immunity barely above the elimination threshold when unexpected vulnerability in 2-dose recipients was taken into account. Unvaccinated individuals remain the immunization priority, but a better understanding of susceptibility in 2-dose recipients is needed to define effective interventions if elimination is to be achieved.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/24585562

Outbreak of measles among persons with prior evidence of immunity, New York City, 2011.
Rosen JB1, Rota JS, Hickman CJ, Sowers SB, Mercader S, Rota PA, Bellini WJ, Huang AJ, Doll MK, Zucker JR, Zimmerman CM.
Author information
Abstract
BACKGROUND:

Measles was eliminated in the United States through high vaccination coverage and a public health system able to rapidly respond to measles. Measles may occur among vaccinated individuals, but secondary transmission from such individuals has not been documented.
METHODS:

Suspected patients and contacts exposed during a measles outbreak in New York City in 2011 were investigated. Medical histories and immunization records were obtained. Cases were confirmed by detection of measles-specific immunoglobulin M and/or RNA. Tests for measles immunoglobulin G (IgG), IgG avidity, measurement of measles neutralizing antibody titers, and genotyping were performed to characterize the cases.
RESULTS:

The index patient had 2 doses of measles-containing vaccine; of 88 contacts, 4 secondary patients were confirmed who had either 2 doses of measles-containing vaccine or a past positive measles IgG antibody. All patients had laboratory confirmation of measles infection, clinical symptoms consistent with measles, and high-avidity IgG antibody characteristic of a secondary immune response. Neutralizing antibody titers of secondary patients reached >80 000 mIU/mL 3-4 days after rash onset and that of the index was <500 mIU/mL 9 days after rash onset. No additional cases of measles occurred among 231 contacts of secondary patients.
CONCLUSIONS:

This is the first report of measles transmission from a twice-vaccinated individual with documented secondary vaccine failure. The clinical presentation and laboratory data of the index patient were typical of measles in a naive individual. Secondary patients had robust anamnestic antibody responses. No tertiary cases occurred despite numerous contacts. This outbreak underscores the need for thorough epidemiologic and laboratory investigation of suspected cases of measles regardless of vaccination status.

 

[rousseau]

Vaccines are, for the most part, pretty bullet-proof technology. The reason they work is because it's not the vaccines themselves that protect you, but your own immune system, stimulated by the vaccines. The immune response your body would give if it was exposed to live virus, is triggered by inactive virii or compounds, which confers immunity to the live virus for some length of time.

So there is literally no other possible method that could be more effective at resisting virii than vaccines, because it's actually just your innate immunity. The only time they might not work is if you have a weak immune system, or if you've taken a flu vaccine which is only taking a stab at a virus that mutates.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

Seriously? What better evidence do you need than the almost utter eradication of the measles, pertussis, and rubella among populations following regular vaccination against these diseases during the middle of the 20th century? These diseases formerly infected millions and killed thousands a year, and the only places were we do see outbreaks are among populations that don't vaccinate.

There seems to be limited incidence of outbreaks amongst vaccinated groups. Perhaps due to some who don't respond well to vaccinations, possibly for genetic reasons.

The fact that for decades that outbreaks among the unvaccinated in the US would definitely speak well to the vaccinations. We've only just been seeing outbreaks amongst the unvaccinated because more and more people are reckless, ignorant fuckers and not vaccinating their children.

 

[bilby]

This might help.

 

[Toni]

There seems to be limited incidence of outbreaks amongst vaccinated groups. Perhaps due to some who don't respond well to vaccinations, possibly for genetic reasons.

The fact that for decades that outbreaks among the unvaccinated in the US would definitely speak well to the vaccinations. We've only just been seeing outbreaks amongst the unvaccinated because more and more people are reckless, ignorant fuckers and not vaccinating their children.

Current outbreak in Minnesota seems to be fueled by intense fear. With anti-vaxxers lighting and throwing on the match, and adding fuel, then walking away saying it's not their fault.

 

[rousseau]

It's a weird problem because studies have shown that presenting anti-vaxxers with evidence they're wrong often entrenches their beliefs even further. You can literally stand there and say something like: "1000 studies have shown that you are irrefutably incorrect about your beliefs", and it won't change their mind, and may even make the problem worse.

So what do we do when presenting someone with evidence doesn't work? What do we do when whatever neural mechanisms people have in place literally make them resistant to understanding reality? What do we do when there are forces (financial incentives) in play that exploit this fact? How do people that are a force for good actually make an impact?

 

[J842P]

Seriously? What better evidence do you need than the almost utter eradication of the measles, pertussis, and rubella among populations following regular vaccination against these diseases during the middle of the 20th century? These diseases formerly infected millions and killed thousands a year, and the only places were we do see outbreaks are among populations that don't vaccinate.

There seems to be limited incidence of outbreaks amongst vaccinated groups. Perhaps due to some who don't respond well to vaccinations, possibly for genetic reasons.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/23264672

Largest measles epidemic in North America in a decade--Quebec, Canada, 2011: contribution of susceptibility, serendipity, and superspreading events.
De Serres G1, Markowski F, Toth E, Landry M, Auger D, Mercier M, Bélanger P, Turmel B, Arruda H, Boulianne N, Ward BJ, Skowronski DM.
Author information
Abstract
BACKGROUND:

The largest measles epidemic in North America in the last decade, occurred in 2011 in Quebec, Canada, where rates of 1- and 2-dose vaccine coverage among children 3 years of age were 95%-97% and 90%, respectively, with 3%-5% unvaccinated.
METHODS:

Case patients identified through passive surveillance and outbreak investigation were contacted to determine clinical course, vaccination status, and possible source of infection.
RESULTS:

There were 21 measles importations and 725 cases. A superspreading event triggered by 1 importation resulted in sustained transmission and 678 cases. The overall incidence was 9.1 per 100,000; the highest incidence was in adolescents 12-17 years old (75.6 per 100,000), who comprised 56% of case patients. Among adolescents, 22% had received 2 vaccine doses. Outbreak investigation showed this proportion to have been an underestimate; active case finding identified 130% more cases among 2-dose recipients. Two-dose recipients had milder illness and a significantly lower risk of hospitalization than those who were unvaccinated or single-dose recipients.
CONCLUSIONS:

A chance superspreading event revealed an overall level of immunity barely above the elimination threshold when unexpected vulnerability in 2-dose recipients was taken into account. Unvaccinated individuals remain the immunization priority, but a better understanding of susceptibility in 2-dose recipients is needed to define effective interventions if elimination is to be achieved.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/24585562

Outbreak of measles among persons with prior evidence of immunity, New York City, 2011.
Rosen JB1, Rota JS, Hickman CJ, Sowers SB, Mercader S, Rota PA, Bellini WJ, Huang AJ, Doll MK, Zucker JR, Zimmerman CM.
Author information
Abstract
BACKGROUND:

Measles was eliminated in the United States through high vaccination coverage and a public health system able to rapidly respond to measles. Measles may occur among vaccinated individuals, but secondary transmission from such individuals has not been documented.
METHODS:

Suspected patients and contacts exposed during a measles outbreak in New York City in 2011 were investigated. Medical histories and immunization records were obtained. Cases were confirmed by detection of measles-specific immunoglobulin M and/or RNA. Tests for measles immunoglobulin G (IgG), IgG avidity, measurement of measles neutralizing antibody titers, and genotyping were performed to characterize the cases.
RESULTS:

The index patient had 2 doses of measles-containing vaccine; of 88 contacts, 4 secondary patients were confirmed who had either 2 doses of measles-containing vaccine or a past positive measles IgG antibody. All patients had laboratory confirmation of measles infection, clinical symptoms consistent with measles, and high-avidity IgG antibody characteristic of a secondary immune response. Neutralizing antibody titers of secondary patients reached >80 000 mIU/mL 3-4 days after rash onset and that of the index was <500 mIU/mL 9 days after rash onset. No additional cases of measles occurred among 231 contacts of secondary patients.
CONCLUSIONS:

This is the first report of measles transmission from a twice-vaccinated individual with documented secondary vaccine failure. The clinical presentation and laboratory data of the index patient were typical of measles in a naive individual. Secondary patients had robust anamnestic antibody responses. No tertiary cases occurred despite numerous contacts. This outbreak underscores the need for thorough epidemiologic and laboratory investigation of suspected cases of measles regardless of vaccination status.

Yes. Adaptive immunity is essentially a subsystem evolved to evolve to give the immune system the capacity to respond to rapidly evolving pathogens (whose evolution occurs at the same scale of our individual lifetimes). It is a miracle* that it works at all. Immunization is not effective in all cases. Thankfully, mass vaccination can confer enough immunity at the population level that pathogens cannot maintain their own populations. Indeed, for some diseases this has effectively meant eradication. For others, it keeps outbreaks isolated and rare.


*Not to take away from the wonder of it all, but not to give ammunition to the creationists, we actually understand the mechanisms that our immune system uses in pretty good detail.

 

[Treedbear]

It's a weird problem because studies have shown that presenting anti-vaxxers with evidence they're wrong often entrenches their beliefs even further. You can literally stand there and say something like: "1000 studies have shown that you are irrefutably incorrect about your beliefs", and it won't change their mind, and may even make the problem worse.

So what do we do when presenting someone with evidence doesn't work? What do we do when whatever neural mechanisms people have in place literally make them resistant to understanding reality? What do we do when there are forces (financial incentives) in play that exploit this fact? How do people that are a force for good actually make an impact?

... Thankfully, mass vaccination can confer enough immunity at the population level that pathogens cannot maintain their own populations. Indeed, for some diseases this has effectively meant eradication. For others, it keeps outbreaks isolated and rare. ...

This is what anti-vac'sers should be made away of. They're free-loaders. It's not so obvious that they haven't contracted polio or smallpox because their friends and neighbors have had the vaccine. They narrow-mindedly look at their own situation and find the probability of getting the disease as very low, so it carries little weight in the attitude they choose to take. Basically it's the only way they can justify their choice without appearing selfish.

 

[bilby]

... Thankfully, mass vaccination can confer enough immunity at the population level that pathogens cannot maintain their own populations. Indeed, for some diseases this has effectively meant eradication. For others, it keeps outbreaks isolated and rare. ...

This is what anti-vac'sers should be made away of. They're free-loaders. It's not so obvious that they haven't contracted polio or smallpox because their friends and neighbors have had the vaccine. They narrow-mindedly look at their own situation and find the probability of getting the disease as very low, so it carries little weight in the attitude they choose to take. Basically it's the only way they can justify their choice without appearing selfish.

^This.

In a pre-industrial society, they would be the ones sitting around eating bread and saying "There's plenty of food in the village; Why should I or my children accept the (small but real) risks inherent in growing and milling grain?". And then when the famine arrives, it's totally not their fault "Well if growing grain prevents famines, how come YOU are starving too?".

Fucking freeloading cunts.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

Vaccines are, for the most part, pretty bullet-proof technology. The reason they work is because it's not the vaccines themselves that protect you, but your own immune system, stimulated by the vaccines. The immune response your body would give if it was exposed to live virus, is triggered by inactive virii or compounds, which confers immunity to the live virus for some length of time.

So there is literally no other possible method that could be more effective at resisting virii than vaccines, because it's actually just your innate immunity. The only time they might not work is if you have a weak immune system, or if you've taken a flu vaccine which is only taking a stab at a virus that mutates.

Whooping cough only gives about 90% protection. It's the herd immunity that really matters. So long as you can keep the infection rate per patient below 1 the disease burns out, the only cases you get are due to imports and those they infect.

We also see the fact that birds of a feather flock together--the anti-vaxxers tend to associate with other anti-vaxxers. Thus when there is an introduction the disease can burn through the non-immune group before being stopped by the overall herd immunity.

 

[fromderinside]

Damn. I so liked Marin county.

 

[thebeave]

Damn. I so liked Marin county.

So, you know about Marin County and their resident lefty-loonie anti-vaxxers? There's a pretty big group of them living in Bolinas who claim that one of the ingredients in vaccines is monkey vomit.

 

[Will Wiley]

... Thankfully, mass vaccination can confer enough immunity at the population level that pathogens cannot maintain their own populations. Indeed, for some diseases this has effectively meant eradication. For others, it keeps outbreaks isolated and rare. ...

This is what anti-vac'sers should be made away of. They're free-loaders. It's not so obvious that they haven't contracted polio or smallpox because their friends and neighbors have had the vaccine. They narrow-mindedly look at their own situation and find the probability of getting the disease as very low, so it carries little weight in the attitude they choose to tak.

On the contrary whooping cough is common enough in an area with a lot of non vaxers. I live in an area with a larger number of anti vaxxers and whooping cough is common

 

[Rayschism]

Anti vaccine people are not entirely stupid people, they are simply scared over something they don't fully understand. What is driving that fear are the con artists that want to make money off of the capitalistic conspiracy books.

They see a positive correlation of something that harms their children, and that is the core of their fear.

 

[J842P]

Anti vaccine people are not entirely stupid people, they are simply scared over something they don't fully understand. What is driving that fear are the con artists that want to make money off of the capitalistic conspiracy books.

They see a positive correlation of something that harms their children, and that is the core of their fear.

Fundamentally I think you are right. One can't hold it against some housewife in Marin that they are afraid of some medical technology they don't understand, and I wouldn't expect someone busy living their life to really take the time to understand.

The fear of the unknown is perfectly normal and makes a lot of sense as a heuristic.

There is another contingent, the chronically conspiratorial, who actually have the opposite problem: they have all the time in the world to worry about it, but they spend that time reading conspiracy blogs.

 

[rousseau]

Yea, villifying and calling ignorant people stupid is ironic, because it's a fundamentally ignorant position. I'm unsure the concept of 'willful ignorance' actually exists. Most people who are ignorant are that way because nothing has allowed them to accept the facts yet, nobody decides 'hey, I'm going to think this way even though I know it's wrong".

The problem is when you start 'othering' these people who are so obviously idiots, you actually make the problem worse, and entrench their beliefs further. So if you're actually interested in making an impact on the problem that has to be kept in mind.

I'm of the opinion, though, that there's always going to be a subset of the population who just doesn't have the ability to really understand the world we're living in, and so this and similar problems are actually biological, and not social. Some people not only don't understand, but are thoroughly resistant to changing their own world-views, to the point that one just can't get through to them.

 

[Will Wiley]

Here is a recent study that probably has some mothers concerned. Particularly if that is all they read

http://www.cmsri.org/wp-content/uploads/2017/05/MawsonStudyHealthOutcomes5.8.2017.pdf