Tara Reade is a person who exists

[Derec]

I'm interested in why you think the secretary's actions towards you were not sexual assault but the co-worker's actions towards the secretary were.

Just like only whites can be racist, only men can be sexual assaulters. Try to keep up with social justice! </progressoauthoritarian>

 

[Derec]

My favorite was/is Elizabeth Warren and although she's significantly younger than Biden or Sanders or Trump, she's older than I like.

She is a fellow septuagenarean and therefore not significantly younger. She is only 3 years younger than Trump for example.

There were other candidates I liked and thought would be good. But nope. The People prefer doddering old men to accomplished women.

Are you trying to say Biden was not accomplished? Or that only female candidates running in 2020 were?

 

[Ford]

For example, the receptionist at work that was very flirty with me and then at a company function sat on my lap and kissed me on the cheek (even though I was married then)? Wrong on her part, but not assault.

When another male co-worker tried to corner her in the parking garage and kiss her? Yeah, that's an attempted sexual assault. (I only heard that story later when we were all comparing notes after the douche bag was fired for another reason)

I'm interested in why you think the secretary's actions towards you were not sexual assault but the co-worker's actions towards the secretary were.

Toni has done a very good job answering, but allow me to pile on...

First off, receptionist, not secretary. Second, she was not being threatening. She was a little drunk, and honestly if I were not married I would have been more than happy to reciprocate. All she did was made me feel a little awkward.

The guy who cornered her in the garage was a solid-gold asshole. Not long after he moved to town, he hooked up with a married woman, had his own divorce lawyer help her extricate herself from the marriage, and then cheated on her within weeks of their own wedding. I was in the studio once when another employee (the married sister in law of another co-worker) walked in and he began aggressively hitting on her. I went back to her office after the incident and apologized on behalf of all men.

And again, it's a pattern of behavior. The receptionist was young and tipsy at a party once. The asshole was sober, aggressive, and clearly felt entitled to whatever he wanted from her because that behavior had worked for him in the past.

Note the difference. That's what seems to be at work here. We've got one so far unconfirmed account of sexual assault from a Presidential candidate who has admittedly been a little too "hands on" at times vs two dozen accounts of sexual harassment/assault from a Presidential candidate who has literally bragged about his actions on tape. Repeatedly.

Let's take this one carefully, but keep it in context.

 

[Jarhyn]

For example, the receptionist at work that was very flirty with me and then at a company function sat on my lap and kissed me on the cheek (even though I was married then)? Wrong on her part, but not assault.

When another male co-worker tried to corner her in the parking garage and kiss her? Yeah, that's an attempted sexual assault. (I only heard that story later when we were all comparing notes after the douche bag was fired for another reason)

I'm interested in why you think the secretary's actions towards you were not sexual assault but the co-worker's actions towards the secretary were.

Toni has done a very good job answering, but allow me to pile on...

First off, receptionist, not secretary. Second, she was not being threatening. She was a little drunk, and honestly if I were not married I would have been more than happy to reciprocate. All she did was made me feel a little awkward.

The guy who cornered her in the garage was a solid-gold asshole. Not long after he moved to town, he hooked up with a married woman, had his own divorce lawyer help her extricate herself from the marriage, and then cheated on her within weeks of their own wedding. I was in the studio once when another employee (the married sister in law of another co-worker) walked in and he began aggressively hitting on her. I went back to her office after the incident and apologized on behalf of all men.

And again, it's a pattern of behavior. The receptionist was young and tipsy at a party once. The asshole was sober, aggressive, and clearly felt entitled to whatever he wanted from her because that behavior had worked for him in the past.

Note the difference. That's what seems to be at work here. We've got one so far unconfirmed account of sexual assault from a Presidential candidate who has admittedly been a little too "hands on" at times vs two dozen accounts of sexual harassment/assault from a Presidential candidate who has literally bragged about his actions on tape. Repeatedly.

Let's take this one carefully, but keep it in context.

Honestly, even if Biden had a laundry list of allegations and behavior, sexually speaking, as long as Trump (he doesnt), he doesn't come with the baggage of mafia ties, fucking over contractors, bad loans, money laundering, fraud, and foreign money.

We are, yet again, artificially stuck between a douche and a turd. I don't like the fact that we had a chance to have the choice between a real human being who cares about everything a real human SHOULD care about and the aforementioned turd. We got the fucking douche instead and I fucking blame all of the complete fucking cunts that would deign to argue about how old or "electable" people are as if they are t creating a self-fulfilling prophecy in saying that. But again, here we are.

Hopefully, we can leverage a prog VP and hope this creepy old guy gets impeached or just plain goes toes up. At the very least we get a Supreme Court nomination remotely worthy of following up The Notorious RBG.

Elections have consequences. Yes, Biden is a drooling dementia patient who has and probably will continue to creep on women. Is that worse somehow than a drooling dementia patient who raped a 14 year old girl dressed up to look like his daughter and who is beholden entirely to Russia?

So yeah, I'm voting for Biden.

 

[Metaphor]

First off, receptionist, not secretary. Second, she was not being threatening. She was a little drunk, and honestly if I were not married I would have been more than happy to reciprocate. All she did was made me feel a little awkward.

The guy who cornered her in the garage was a solid-gold asshole. Not long after he moved to town, he hooked up with a married woman, had his own divorce lawyer help her extricate herself from the marriage, and then cheated on her within weeks of their own wedding. I was in the studio once when another employee (the married sister in law of another co-worker) walked in and he began aggressively hitting on her. I went back to her office after the incident and apologized on behalf of all men.

And again, it's a pattern of behavior. The receptionist was young and tipsy at a party once. The asshole was sober, aggressive, and clearly felt entitled to whatever he wanted from her because that behavior had worked for him in the past.

Why do you consider sobriety a mitigating factor? If the co-worker had been drunk, would you consider that a mitigating factor for him?

Why do you bring up his repeated infidelities and "solid gold asshole" status? Didn't the receptionist not care whether you committed an infidelity?

Finally, why would you apologise on behalf of all men? Did all men commit the crime, and did you get moral authority to represent them?

 

[Metaphor]

My favorite was/is Elizabeth Warren and although she's significantly younger than Biden or Sanders or Trump, she's older than I like.

She is a fellow septuagenarean and therefore not significantly younger. She is only 3 years younger than Trump for example.

There were other candidates I liked and thought would be good. But nope. The People prefer doddering old men to accomplished women.

Are you trying to say Biden was not accomplished? Or that only female candidates running in 2020 were?

Well, yes - she's quite clearly saying Biden (and possibly Bernie and Pete, etc) are doddering, and Elizabeth Warren is accomplished and not doddering.

Toni is also accusing Democrat voters of being misogynists (but not ageists). Ageism is okay, see.

 

[Toni]

My favorite was/is Elizabeth Warren and although she's significantly younger than Biden or Sanders or Trump, she's older than I like.

She is a fellow septuagenarean and therefore not significantly younger. She is only 3 years younger than Trump for example.

There were other candidates I liked and thought would be good. But nope. The People prefer doddering old men to accomplished women.

Are you trying to say Biden was not accomplished? Or that only female candidates running in 2020 were?

Warren certainly seems much younger than Trump or Sanders or Biden. She has not had a major health event nor is she a known substance abuser. Her BMI appears to be in a very healthy range and she is energetic, intellectually intact and mentally spry. She seems at least a decade younger than Trump and is significantly younger than Biden or Sanders. Those few years really count in your 70’s or 80’s.

Of course I did not suggest that Biden isn’t quite accomplished. But the Democrats has a very full field of candidates who are mostly very well qualified and not knocking on heaven’s door. Some were women; some were persons of color. But instead: doddering old white guy.

Hell the GOP didn’t gave the guts—or the field to even allow states to entertain the notion of someone other than an addlepated doddering old white guy. Courage is as much not their game as are integrity, morals, or competence.

 

[Ford]

First off, receptionist, not secretary. Second, she was not being threatening. She was a little drunk, and honestly if I were not married I would have been more than happy to reciprocate. All she did was made me feel a little awkward.

The guy who cornered her in the garage was a solid-gold asshole. Not long after he moved to town, he hooked up with a married woman, had his own divorce lawyer help her extricate herself from the marriage, and then cheated on her within weeks of their own wedding. I was in the studio once when another employee (the married sister in law of another co-worker) walked in and he began aggressively hitting on her. I went back to her office after the incident and apologized on behalf of all men.

And again, it's a pattern of behavior. The receptionist was young and tipsy at a party once. The asshole was sober, aggressive, and clearly felt entitled to whatever he wanted from her because that behavior had worked for him in the past.

Why do you consider sobriety a mitigating factor? If the co-worker had been drunk, would you consider that a mitigating factor for him?

Why do you bring up his repeated infidelities and "solid gold asshole" status? Didn't the receptionist not care whether you committed an infidelity?

Finally, why would you apologise on behalf of all men? Did all men commit the crime, and did you get moral authority to represent them?

First question...in late 2016, I was involved in a 7 car accident caused by an inebriated driver which totaled my vehicle, sent 3 people to the hospital, caused two car fires and shut a major freeway down for 3 hours. So yeah, I consider sobriety to be a mitigating factor. The receptionist (weird you called her a "secretary." Is that how you think of all women employees?) had slightly lowered inhibitions that led her to extend innocent flirting to a more forward action. Had the co-worker been drunk at the time he cornered the receptionist in the parking garage, that would have meant he'd been drinking in the office, which would make it even worse.

Second question...because - again - pattern of behavior. Just to remind you, the larger conversation here is about Joe Biden vs Donald Trump. The former married his second wife five years after his first wife died in an horrific car accident, the latter left his first wife for his mistress, left that wife for his next mistress, and then cheated on his third wife with a porn star to whom he paid hush money. I can forgive the receptionist for her actions because of her slight inebriation. She didn't crash her truck into me like the idiot a few years back. She just was enjoying herself a bit too much at a company function and - jeez do we have to cover this once more? - didn't actually assault me.

Final question...I felt bad for the woman who had suffered an indignity from a sexist asshole, and was looking for a way to comfort her. She appreciated my effort and said so. If you want to dig deeper, I was not seeking to represent all men, but rather what I felt should be the ideal of a man. A man should not take advantage of a position of power to impose himself upon a subordinate. Not in a parking garage with physicality, or in an office with obvious douchebaggery.

Do you?

Follow-up...a few years ago I got a call from a friend who mentioned that a former boss had hired the solid-gold asshole as an assistant. I cringed, thinking that if I'd been in a position to give my former boss advice, I'd have said "this guy is a sexual harassment lawsuit waiting to happen," but it was too late.

So to recap, we've got a couple situations. One where a flirty, tipsy woman was a bit too flirty with me, and one where a sober man tried to sexually assault the same woman. I'm at a loss to understand why you fail to see the difference.

 

[Metaphor]

The receptionist (weird you called her a "secretary." Is that how you think of all women employees?)

Okay, you've made this correction twice now, even though in my response to you I used 'receptionist'.

What is weird is that you think I think of all female employees as 'secretary', as if that were the exemplar of female employment, as if 'receptionist' were somehow less gendered as female.

No, I don't think of all female employees as secretaries, or receptionists. However, I do think of receptionists as similar to secretaries, but then in high school the secretaries were also the receptionists.

But hey: I'm sorry I called a receptionist a secretary. I've got my cilice ready.

 

[Metaphor]

First question...in late 2016, I was involved in a 7 car accident caused by an inebriated driver which totaled my vehicle, sent 3 people to the hospital, caused two car fires and shut a major freeway down for 3 hours. So yeah, I consider sobriety to be a mitigating factor.

...what? Do you think the inebriated driver was somehow less culpable because he was inebriated?? The law doesn't.

The receptionist (weird you called her a "secretary." Is that how you think of all women employees?) had slightly lowered inhibitions that led her to extend innocent flirting to a more forward action. Had the co-worker been drunk at the time he cornered the receptionist in the parking garage, that would have meant he'd been drinking in the office, which would make it even worse.

So, drunkenness excuses your receptionist's actions, but would have made the co-worker's actions worse???

Second question...because - again - pattern of behavior. Just to remind you, the larger conversation here is about Joe Biden vs Donald Trump. The former married his second wife five years after his first wife died in an horrific car accident, the latter left his first wife for his mistress, left that wife for his next mistress, and then cheated on his third wife with a porn star to whom he paid hush money. I can forgive the receptionist for her actions because of her slight inebriation. She didn't crash her truck into me like the idiot a few years back. She just was enjoying herself a bit too much at a company function and - jeez do we have to cover this once more? - didn't actually assault me.

Final question...I felt bad for the woman who had suffered an indignity from a sexist asshole, and was looking for a way to comfort her. She appreciated my effort and said so. If you want to dig deeper, I was not seeking to represent all men, but rather what I felt should be the ideal of a man. A man should not take advantage of a position of power to impose himself upon a subordinate. Not in a parking garage with physicality, or in an office with obvious douchebaggery.

Do you?

Do I what? Think people should impose themselves on others? No. The receptionist ought not have done that to you.

So to recap, we've got a couple situations. One where a flirty, tipsy woman was a bit too flirty with me, and one where a sober man tried to sexually assault the same woman. I'm at a loss to understand why you fail to see the difference.

I can see the difference. When of the people assaulted somebody (the receptionist) and the other didn't.

 

[Derec]

...what? Do you think the inebriated driver was somehow less culpable because he was inebriated?? The law doesn't.

You used "sobriety" when you meant "inebriation" so you two have been talking past each other a bit.

 

[Metaphor]

...what? Do you think the inebriated driver was somehow less culpable because he was inebriated?? The law doesn't.

You used "sobriety" when you meant "inebriation" so you two have been talking past each other a bit.

Well I'm certainly confused by Ford's answers.

The best I can make out is that...sobriety makes actions worse than the same action taken when tipsy. So sexual assaults are worse if the person doing the assaulting is sober, and causing car carnage is worse if you were sober when you did it.

 

[Ford]

...what? Do you think the inebriated driver was somehow less culpable because he was inebriated?? The law doesn't.

Wow. Way to miss the point completely.

You seemed to make the argument that inebriation in any capacity was irrelevant. Drunk or sober, the woman sitting on my lap and kissing me and the asshole trying to force himself on her are equivalent. They're not.

So, drunkenness excuses your receptionist's actions, but would have made the co-worker's actions worse???

You might want to go back and read what I wrote. Do you want me to spell it out for you? It looks like that's necessary. A person who has had a couple drinks after work and gets a little too forward is an entirely different thing than someone who tries to sexually assault a co-worker. If that someone has been drinking on the job, then yes, it is worse. Good non-existent god why is this so hard for you to grasp?

Do I what? Think people should impose themselves on others? No. The receptionist ought not have done that to you.

Whoosh. As I have said over and over again, she did not "impose" herself on me. I was not in any way a victim. When Captain Ass cornered her in the garage, he tried to force himself upon her.

When of the people assaulted somebody (the receptionist) and the other didn't.

You'll have to clarify what, exactly, the fuck you're trying to say here.

I'm saying that I was not assaulted by the receptionist. I didn't ask for her advances, but she wasn't trying to force herself upon me. She was being a bit over zealous in expressing her affections, but I never felt threatened.

The receptionist was absolutely assaulted in the parking garage. When a woman (or anyone for that matter) has to physically fight off their attacker and run away, that's assault.


I thought this shit was simple, but apparently people don't understand the difference between "hey, you wanna go back to my place and have some fun?" and "get in the car, bitch, and shut up."


Wow.

 

[Metaphor]

Wow. Way to miss the point completely.

You seemed to make the argument that inebriation in any capacity was irrelevant. Drunk or sober, the woman sitting on my lap and kissing me and the asshole trying to force himself on her are equivalent. They're not.

If you didn't think inebriation was relevant, why did you bring it up?

You might want to go back and read what I wrote. Do you want me to spell it out for you? It looks like that's necessary. A person who has had a couple drinks after work and gets a little too forward is an entirely different thing than someone who tries to sexually assault a co-worker. If that someone has been drinking on the job, then yes, it is worse. Good non-existent god why is this so hard for you to grasp?

I'm trying to understand why you brought up drinking at all.

Whoosh. As I have said over and over again, she did not "impose" herself on me. I was not in any way a victim. When Captain Ass cornered her in the garage, he tried to force himself upon her.

Then you're not telling the story very well. You said 'attempted' sexual assault. So, he didn't actually assault her. Why did his attempt fail?

Could it be that it was an unwelcome sexual advance and not an attempted sexual assault?

What the receptionist did was certainly an unwelcome sexual advance, wasn't it? Except she was more successful than 'Captain Ass'.

You'll have to clarify what, exactly, the fuck you're trying to say here.

I'm saying that I was not assaulted by the receptionist. I didn't ask for her advances, but she wasn't trying to force herself upon me. She was being a bit over zealous in expressing her affections, but I never felt threatened.

So, your personal feelings, but not her actions, is what counts? Is that right?

The receptionist was absolutely assaulted in the parking garage. When a woman (or anyone for that matter) has to physically fight off their attacker and run away, that's assault.

You need to be better in your narrative. You wrote:

When another male co-worker tried to corner her in the parking garage and kiss her? Yeah, that's an attempted sexual assault.

So earlier, it was attempted sexual assault. Now, it's actual assault, and you've added details that she had to physically fight him off.

Well, which is it, and why are you so upset that I took your earlier words for what they were?

I thought this shit was simple, but apparently people don't understand the difference between "hey, you wanna go back to my place and have some fun?" and "get in the car, bitch, and shut up."


Wow.

Yes, indeed.

Wow.

 

[Ford]

Could it be that it was an unwelcome sexual advance and not an attempted sexual assault?

You're really not grasping the difference, are you? I guess I have to dumb it way, way down...

If a woman comes up to you in a bar, flirts with you, sits on your lap and gives you a kiss...

Do you understand how that is different than a man twice her size cornering her by her car in a parking garage and trying to force her to kiss him?



If not, then I would advise women of any type to run when they see you coming.

 

[Metaphor]

You're really not grasping the difference, are you? I guess I have to dumb it way, way down...

If a woman comes up to you in a bar, flirts with you, sits on your lap and gives you a kiss...

Do you understand how that is different than a man twice her size cornering her by her car in a parking garage and trying to force her to kiss him?

Well, yes. The woman sexually assaulted you, and the man didn't.

 

[Arctish]

You're really not grasping the difference, are you? I guess I have to dumb it way, way down...

If a woman comes up to you in a bar, flirts with you, sits on your lap and gives you a kiss...

Do you understand how that is different than a man twice her size cornering her by her car in a parking garage and trying to force her to kiss him?

Well, yes. The woman sexually assaulted you, and the man didn't.

Is that the only difference you see, or is that the only difference that matters to you?

 

[angelo]

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/...sconduct-karen-johnson-how-many-a9149216.html

Yep. Looks like this election will be one for the books. We can call it "Battle of the Pussy Grabbers".

It's most certainly looking that way. But only one of them can be somewhat classified as a pedo!



Those two little Asian girls in the middle top of the image look very uncomfortable with Creepy all over them!

 

[fromderinside]

You're really not grasping the difference, are you? I guess I have to dumb it way, way down...

If a woman comes up to you in a bar, flirts with you, sits on your lap and gives you a kiss...

Do you understand how that is different than a man twice her size cornering her by her car in a parking garage and trying to force her to kiss him?

Well, yes. The woman sexually assaulted you, and the man didn't.

Is that the only difference you see, or is that the only difference that matters to you?

No.

The female is taking advantage of social norms and male proclivities while the male is only taking advantage of his relative strength.

None of these should be allowed to exist in the social environment without sanction.

Hand off thigh, lips off mouth, butt off lap, maintain social distance, don't intimidate with potential force, respect other's space, territory, and dignity at all times, follow social norms in male-female interactions in the work and social place, and be a friend rather than a potential conquest of victim.

I'm not even sure that a woman putting a man's hand on her thigh in a public setting isn't harassment, certainly not the other way around.

 

[Patooka]

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/...sconduct-karen-johnson-how-many-a9149216.html

Yep. Looks like this election will be one for the books. We can call it "Battle of the Pussy Grabbers".

It's most certainly looking that way. But only one of them can be somewhat classified as a pedo!

Jesus Christ, your arguments are pathetic.