The DNC is the problem. Or is it?

[Jolly_Penguin]

We see you. Very clearly.

We see you very clearly. You are a case study in learned helplessness, privilege, and comfort rotting the mind.

 

[Jolly_Penguin]

Typical Canadian humility at it's best!

When you poke the moose, expect the antlers.

 

[Harry Bosch]

We see you. Very clearly.

We see you very clearly. You are a case study in learned helplessness, privilege, and comfort rotting the mind.

You're humble and a gentlemen! Great combo!

 

[Toni]

No, just general bigotry and non-sequitur. Granted what makes racism wrong is bigotry and non-sequitur.

I'm not the one projecting general bigotry. JP does not let his lack of knowledge about US institutions, history and social contexts prevent him from making ignorant pronouncements about the US whihc makes his foreignness relevant.

All this smattering about my lack of knowledge. And yet the only basis of such lack of knowledge is that I have said things that disagree with you and your fellow conservative Democrats and Republicans. And yes, I could indeed be quite ignorant of your political system, and so could you. But that's entirely irrelevant, as I don't claim any superior knowledge. And none of this does or should prevent me from supporting your people striving for more progressive policies.

Or let me put this in terms of your own politics: You live in a shit hole country (as your president would put it). I do live in a country that has better for its people. You yourself may not deserve or want better, you may be blinded by learned helplesness, but your fellow citizens deserve better. And I support them in that struggle.

Lololololol.

 

[Toni]

Typical Canadian humility at it's best!

When you poke the moose, expect the antlers.

Then why are we only getting the shit?

 

[ZiprHead]

There are several countries that call their UHC Medicare, Australia for one. What it's called is the least of the issues.

Yeah, but I've dealt with US Medicare here enough that I get really nervous about Medicare for All.

I've probably got much more experience with Medicare than anyone here. I've spent well more than the last twenty years of my working life analyzing insurance reimbursement statements from Medicare, Blue Cross, Health Plus and others for the largest hospital system in the region. I've assisted in Medicare audits numerous times. They are not the boogeymen some try to make them out to be.

 

[ZiprHead]

Right. That’s why I wrote—as I’ve written and spoken before, many times, that I think that EVERYONE should have the same level of health care coverage that I enjoy or BETTER.

But that's exactly what Sander's M4A plan is. That is Bernie's goal. It would not be Bernie's fault if that wasn't achieved. It would be the fault of those against implementation of that plan. So I guess I'm saying I really don't understand your objections.

 

[Toni]

There are several countries that call their UHC Medicare, Australia for one. What it's called is the least of the issues.

Yeah, but I've dealt with US Medicare here enough that I get really nervous about Medicare for All.

I've probably got much more experience with Medicare than anyone here. I've spent well more than the last twenty years of my working life analyzing insurance reimbursement statements from Medicare, Blue Cross, Health Plus and others for the largest hospital system in the region. I've assisted in Medicare audits numerous times. They are not the boogeymen some try to make them out to be.

When I worked in the business section of a medical clinic 20 something years ago, the people who dealt with insurance claims and Medicaid and Medicare claims were really adamant about how low the reimbursements were. It was pretty accepted that Medicaid reimbursements were a loss. Medicare was barely covering costs in the best cases and covered less than cost in other cases. Add in that other insurance carriers base their reimbursement rates on what Medicare deems usual and customary—so I’d Medicare doesn’t cover costs then no one will. It’s obviously unsustainable.

I’ve also worked in other aspects of medical care and have helped with implementation of cost savings measures. Medical centers are very cost conscious and look to create efficiencies andvontrol cost wherever possible.

I’ve also made more than one ‘spontaneous’ 500 mile (one way) trip to arrange transition care and even 24/7 care for a patient (ie loved one) who was being released from the hospital with 24 hr time frame to find such arrangements. Some Medicare rules work against patients best interests.

 

[ZiprHead]

I've probably got much more experience with Medicare than anyone here. I've spent well more than the last twenty years of my working life analyzing insurance reimbursement statements from Medicare, Blue Cross, Health Plus and others for the largest hospital system in the region. I've assisted in Medicare audits numerous times. They are not the boogeymen some try to make them out to be.

When I worked in the business section of a medical clinic 20 something years ago, the people who dealt with insurance claims and Medicaid and Medicare claims were really adamant about how low the reimbursements were. It was pretty accepted that Medicaid reimbursements were a loss. Medicare was barely covering costs in the best cases and covered less than cost in other cases. Add in that other insurance carriers base their reimbursement rates on what Medicare deems usual and customary—so I’d Medicare doesn’t cover costs then no one will. It’s obviously unsustainable.

I’ve also worked in other aspects of medical care and have helped with implementation of cost savings measures. Medical centers are very cost conscious and look to create efficiencies andvontrol cost wherever possible.

I’ve also made more than one ‘spontaneous’ 500 mile (one way) trip to arrange transition care and even 24/7 care for a patient (ie loved one) who was being released from the hospital with 24 hr time frame to find such arrangements. Some Medicare rules work against patients best interests.

Thank you for that response.

Medicaid reimbursement is poor, yes. But there would be no more Medicaid under M4A. And I am fairly certain that reimbursement rates would be increased under M4A.

As for the patient transitioning. did you try commercial private insurance?

No, of course you did not because no commercial insurance would touch such a patient.

And you fail to realize these issues are addressed in the Sander's plan.

 

[Rhea]

But, on topic - none of this is the fault of the DNC.
This is a choice by voters - what they will accept and what they need to be talked into.

 

[laughing dog]

No, just general bigotry and non-sequitur. Granted what makes racism wrong is bigotry and non-sequitur.

I'm not the one projecting general bigotry. JP does not let his lack of knowledge about US institutions, history and social contexts prevent him from making ignorant pronouncements about the US whihc makes his foreignness relevant.

All this smattering about my lack of knowledge. And yet the only basis of such lack of knowledge is that I have said things that disagree with you and your fellow conservative Democrats and Republicans. And yes, I could indeed be quite ignorant of your political system, and so could you.

There is no could about it - you are ignorant of our political system.

But that's entirely irrelevant, as I don't claim any superior knowledge.

No, your ignorance is not irrelevant because it helps to form your "support".

Or let me put this in terms of your own politics: You live in a shit hole country (as your president would put it). I do live in a country that has better for its people. You yourself may not deserve or want better, you may be blinded by learned helplesness, but your fellow citizens deserve better. And I support them in that struggle.

Or I can see what is possible now because my head is not up my ass.

 

[Toni]

I've probably got much more experience with Medicare than anyone here. I've spent well more than the last twenty years of my working life analyzing insurance reimbursement statements from Medicare, Blue Cross, Health Plus and others for the largest hospital system in the region. I've assisted in Medicare audits numerous times. They are not the boogeymen some try to make them out to be.

When I worked in the business section of a medical clinic 20 something years ago, the people who dealt with insurance claims and Medicaid and Medicare claims were really adamant about how low the reimbursements were. It was pretty accepted that Medicaid reimbursements were a loss. Medicare was barely covering costs in the best cases and covered less than cost in other cases. Add in that other insurance carriers base their reimbursement rates on what Medicare deems usual and customary—so I’d Medicare doesn’t cover costs then no one will. It’s obviously unsustainable.

I’ve also worked in other aspects of medical care and have helped with implementation of cost savings measures. Medical centers are very cost conscious and look to create efficiencies andvontrol cost wherever possible.

I’ve also made more than one ‘spontaneous’ 500 mile (one way) trip to arrange transition care and even 24/7 care for a patient (ie loved one) who was being released from the hospital with 24 hr time frame to find such arrangements. Some Medicare rules work against patients best interests.

Thank you for that response.

Medicaid reimbursement is poor, yes. But there would be no more Medicaid under M4A. And I am fairly certain that reimbursement rates would be increased under M4A.

As for the patient transitioning. did you try commercial private insurance?

No, of course you did not because no commercial insurance would touch such a patient.

And you fail to realize these issues are addressed in the Sander's plan.

Both patients were on Medicare, with supplemental private insurance.

One of this patients was my mother, after a knee replacement many years after she suffered a traumatic brain injury that nearly claimed her life—and in many ways did claim her life. She was covered by insurance through my father’s employer. She was very much closer to death and/or permanent disability that would have left her institutionalized for life if her medical team and her own strength and will, she recovered far more than ever expected. She transitioned to a rehab center but not on a emergency—we’re releasing her in 24 hrs basis as what happened decades later when she had a knee replacement and was released while unable to walk or bear any weight, with a UTI which exacerbated her dementia, as a UTI is wont to do in any elderly patient. She was treated better under the rules of her private insurance than under Medicare rules. Her supplemental insurance was Medicaid at that point. It is extremely difficult to find a decent rehab center on short notice, period. Full stop. It is much, much, much harder to find a bed if you are on Medicaid as well.

I think everybody deserves the level of health insurance that I enjoy now—or better. That is not Medicare or Medicaid or any combination of them. Medicare and Medicaid rules and regulations that endanger the well being of vulnerable patients is the reason I get really nervous when I hear “Medicare for All.” Attaching Bernie Sanders’ name and assurances does not reassure.

 

[Jolly_Penguin]

Typical Canadian humility at it's best!

When you poke the moose, expect the antlers.

Then why are we only getting the shit?

Because you as usual are staring into the mirror and claiming others are what you actually are yourself.

 

[Jolly_Penguin]

But, on topic - none of this is the fault of the DNC.
This is a choice by voters - what they will accept and what they need to be talked into.

Nobody said this is the fault of the DNC. The fault of the DNC is that it has allowed itself to become corrupt, opaque and non-Democratic. And that can change. There is nothing whatsoever wrong with calling for that change.

 

[Toni]

Then why are we only getting the shit?

Because you as usual are staring into the mirror and claiming others are what you actually are yourself.

Nope. Your offered the metaphor: you got to live with the obvious conclusion.

You really should make better choices, Jolly. Consequences can be really shitty if you don’t.

 

[Toni]

But, on topic - none of this is the fault of the DNC.
This is a choice by voters - what they will accept and what they need to be talked into.

Nobody said this is the fault of the DNC. The fault of the DNC is that it has allowed itself to become corrupt, opaque and non-Democratic. And that can change. There is nothing whatsoever wrong with calling for that change.

Why do you keep trying to insert yourself into discussions about another country’s political system as if you were a participant?

 

[Jolly_Penguin]

Then why are we only getting the shit?

Because you as usual are staring into the mirror and claiming others are what you actually are yourself.

Nope. Your offered the metaphor: you got to live with the obvious conclusion.

You really should make better choices, Jolly. Consequences can be really shitty if you don’t.

Your belicose attitude and lack of intelligence and civility is not my issue. You go ahead and continue to be shit.

 

[Jolly_Penguin]

But, on topic - none of this is the fault of the DNC.
This is a choice by voters - what they will accept and what they need to be talked into.

Nobody said this is the fault of the DNC. The fault of the DNC is that it has allowed itself to become corrupt, opaque and non-Democratic. And that can change. There is nothing whatsoever wrong with calling for that change.

Why do you keep trying to insert yourself into discussions about another country’s political system as if you were a participant?

I don't. Did I say that I will change it? No. I did not. That you oppose my saying you can and should do away with corruption, lack of transparency, and lack of Democracy does speak volumes however. Ultimately the choice is that of you and your fellow citizens. If you want to stand for corruption and lack of transparency and democracy, that's on you.

 

[Rhea]

The whole purpose of this thread is an exploration of the comments made by people on this board about how the DNC is the problem behind why we can’t have nice things.

You (Jolly) are, indeed, one of the people who complains about the DNC being “corrupt and opaque,” while failing to support how that is interfering with the progress of progressives in your neighboring country, or even what this corruption is. People respond to your complaints with facts about how the process works in America, and you ignore that first-hand information and instead keep repeating the accusation over and over again as if that will make it true and negate the direct experience of people who are actually participating in the process.

Others on this board who are Americans, have said similar complaints, that the DNC “is the problem” with why Bernie doesn’t get elected, why ultra progressive things don’t get passed, etc. And again, we respond with actual information about experiences in America of how it is voters who are driving this, not some cabal.

That is the exploration of this thread. That is the topic.

If you want to deny anyone every said that, then, fine we heard you, and now you have nothing more to offer in the discussion. Thank you for your input, and you do not need to repeat it any more times, we can see what has been written quite clearly thankyouverymuch.

 

[Jarhyn]

The whole purpose of this thread is an exploration of the comments made by people on this board about how the DNC is the problem behind why we can’t have nice things.

You (Jolly) are, indeed, one of the people who complains about the DNC being “corrupt and opaque,” while failing to support how that is interfering with the progress of progressives in your neighboring country, or even what this corruption is. People respond to your complaints with facts about how the process works in America, and you ignore that first-hand information and instead keep repeating the accusation over and over again as if that will make it true and negate the direct experience of people who are actually participating in the process.

Others on this board who are Americans, have said similar complaints, that the DNC “is the problem” with why Bernie doesn’t get elected, why ultra progressive things don’t get passed, etc. And again, we respond with actual information about experiences in America of how it is voters who are driving this, not some cabal.

That is the exploration of this thread. That is the topic.

If you want to deny anyone every said that, then, fine we heard you, and now you have nothing more to offer in the discussion. Thank you for your input, and you do not need to repeat it any more times, we can see what has been written quite clearly thankyouverymuch.

We're not the ones ignoring evidence. You are. Clearly. By ignoring the fact that voters vote based on the information they get from the sources they have, and that corruption seen takes the form of manipulating who, what, when and where people can access information.

Who is the problem in a car dealership, the person who buys the lemon or the dealer who sells it as a reliable car?

Caveat emptor? That's bullshit.

It's not "some cabal". Bloomberg bought his way into an election, and (albeit rather foolishly) onto a debate stage. That was 100% the DNC.

Hillary Clinton bailed on debates, and the DNC denied access to the voter rolls for a primary candidate. Then when debates DID happen, they were scheduled to happen when nobody would be viewing them. That was also the DNC.

It is blocking debates on widely demanded topics because some candidates with establishment support are weak on them.

It is giving over debate moderation to biased organizations, and setting up rules that don't actually foster debates (even if they do foster some delicious roastings at times).

It is people with more loyalty to the status quo than to people who will seek positive change in the basis of the needs and desires of the constituency.

It is the appointment of establishment friendly campaign insiders to pivotal roles in both 2016 and 2020 elections and giving conflict-of-interest laden sweetheart deals on party appointments.

It doesn't take a cabal for people... Well, people clearly like you who disdain progressives... To want to block a progressive from getting the power to reform their positions away. That's just good old fashioned zeitgeist. It's the corruption of a thousand small parts for self-interest that don't necessarily need to work in concert, but can.

You don't need to be an American to watch all that happening just like you don't need a Brit to see how Tories ratfucked their country right in the Brexit.

If you don't see how campaign interference DRIVES those 'voter decisions' that's just willful ignorance the likes of which I would expect more from Half-life.