The universe is proof of god!

[FinBack]

Big bang is an ongoing process

I never said i believe there was a beginning.!! Quite the opposite.! Steady state theory has it's problems but i think it solves more problems than it creates.

Yeah you just asked the "age old" question while rejecting expansion
If steady state no change, beginning is a big change and steady state excludes that to some degree maybe totally

The Big bang theory is just that, a theory...it's only an on-going process if you believe it is true. I don't.

I mentioned the 'Age old question'..i didn't ask it.

There would be no point in asking that question if there was a 'Big Bang'. The 'Big Bang theory' covers a lot of stuff.

 

[none]

Big bang is an ongoing process

I never said i believe there was a beginning.!! Quite the opposite.! Steady state theory has it's problems but i think it solves more problems than it creates.

Yeah you just asked the "age old" question while rejecting expansion
If steady state no change, beginning is a big change and steady state excludes that to some degree maybe totally

The Big bang theory is just that, a theory...it's only an on-going process if you believe it is true. I don't.

Red shift indicates expansion, observation of red shift is observation of the evidence of expansion

I mentioned the 'Age old question'..i didn't ask it.

Oh you mentioned it, you really didn't want to devote any time to the subject you just thought it was cute to mention it

There would be no point in asking that question if there was a 'Big Bang'. The 'Big Bang theory' covers a lot of stuff.

Well I honestly don't think you have any understanding of physics
Care to mention what you think the big bang theory is because I'm seriously doubting you have any clue about it or an understanding of it

 

[Speakpigeon]

P1: God is defined as a being who creates universes.
P2: The universe exists.
C1: Therefore, God exists.

It's practically a tautology, isn't it?

No, it's definitely not a tautology. Certainly not a logical tautology. It's just bad logic. You get there whenever you really want to believe in fairy tales.

Like, that the Moon is made of space goat cheese.
EB

 

[FinBack]

The Big bang theory is just that, a theory...it's only an on-going process if you believe it is true. I don't.

Red shift indicates expansion, observation of red shift is observation of the evidence of expansion

I mentioned the 'Age old question'..i didn't ask it.

Oh you mentioned it, you really didn't want to devote any time to the subject you just thought it was cute to mention it

There would be no point in asking that question if there was a 'Big Bang'. The 'Big Bang theory' covers a lot of stuff.

Well I honestly don't think you have any understanding of physics
Care to mention what you think the big bang theory is because I'm seriously doubting you have any clue about it or an understanding of it

I understand Physics alright..That's not the problem here.

I understand the Big Bang Theory..It's a Theory...

 

[James Brown]

I understand the Big Bang Theory..It's a Theory...

So is gravity, music, and plate tectonics.

 

[Rhea]

I understand the Big Bang Theory..It's a Theory...

Okay. So what's the theory? Can you demonstrate understanding such that we can use your understanding as the background for the discussion?

 

[skepticalbip]

Red shift indicates expansion, observation of red shift is observation of the evidence of expansion

Oh you mentioned it, you really didn't want to devote any time to the subject you just thought it was cute to mention it

There would be no point in asking that question if there was a 'Big Bang'. The 'Big Bang theory' covers a lot of stuff.

Well I honestly don't think you have any understanding of physics
Care to mention what you think the big bang theory is because I'm seriously doubting you have any clue about it or an understanding of it

I understand Physics alright..That's not the problem here.

Oh good. Now you only need to know the results from the observations of distant galaxies that astronomers have made and apply the Doppler effect from the physics that you know to understand what the universe is doing.

I understand the Big Bang Theory..It's a Theory...

Right, it is a theory just like the theory of gravity is a theory so you understand that theories are damned well founded.

 

[Keith&Co.]

Have you or anyone seen or noticed on any record(s) : the decay?

Heh.
Yeah. I actually teach this. Part of the presentation is the actual numbers about how much the day is slowing, but why the slowin gof the day is NOT the reason for the leap second.
While we're on that topic, we discuss the actual length of a year and the variation in that.

Once again, you appear to know JUST enough about the topic to be confident, but not enough to look knowledgable.

 

[Learner]

Have you or anyone seen or noticed on any record(s) : the decay?

Heh.
Yeah. I actually teach this. Part of the presentation is the actual numbers about how much the day is slowing, but why the slowin gof the day is NOT the reason for the leap second.
While we're on that topic, we discuss the actual length of a year and the variation in that.

Once again, you appear to know JUST enough about the topic to be confident, but not enough to look knowledgable.

lol ..ok......But what does it mean? Do you mean it doesn't fit the "conventional calender" as there is a difference ,just as there is between Gregorian and Julian formats?

Regardless of the day is longer (and proportionate to the night being shorter i.e. same 24 hours between) both the sun and moon mark time! Lunar months (biblical)

I suppose this can answer Skeps and bilby's post too. Its still 356 days in a year ...ALL you really are highlighting is a need for "Calibration" via a second(s). After all its not much of a drastic difference really ...is it.... when comparing previous records?

But true ...I do need to look into it (and gain a little more knowledge).

 

[bilby]

Have you or anyone seen or noticed on any record(s) : the decay?

Heh.
Yeah. I actually teach this. Part of the presentation is the actual numbers about how much the day is slowing, but why the slowin gof the day is NOT the reason for the leap second.
While we're on that topic, we discuss the actual length of a year and the variation in that.

Once again, you appear to know JUST enough about the topic to be confident, but not enough to look knowledgable.

lol ..ok......But what does it mean? Do you mean it doesn't fit the "conventional calender" as there is a difference ,just as there is between Gregorian and Julian formats?

Regardless of the day is longer (and proportionate to the night being shorter i.e. same 24 hours between) both the sun and moon mark time! Lunar months (biblical)

I suppose this can answer Skeps and bilby's post too. Its still 356 days in a year ...ALL you really are highlighting is a need for "Calibration" via a second(s). After all its not much of a drastic difference really ...is it.... when comparing previous records?

But true ...I do need to look into it (and gain a little more knowledge).

Whether it's a 'drastic' difference depends on what you want to do with the information, and over what timescale your 'previous records' span. Between today and the start of the Common Era with the early church's guesstimate of the timing of their legends, the effects causing the leap second have made a difference of about 1,260 seconds, or 21 minutes. Since the construction of Stonehenge, the difference is almost an hour.

That may not seem like much, but if you are trying to send supplies to the ISS, getting your timing wrong by a just few seconds means missing the space station completely, leaving the astronauts to starve.

If the GPS satellite clocks were wrong by even a few milliseconds, the whole satellite navigation thing wouldn't work at all.

Accurate timekeeping has real world implications; And the rotations and orbits of various celestial bodies (including the Earth) simply are not accurate enough for many modern purposes.

If it ain't good enough for Garmin, it sure as shit can't be good enough for a God who is alleged to be in the habit of perfection.

 

[Keith&Co.]

lol ..ok......But what does it mean? Do you mean it doesn't fit the "conventional calender" as there is a difference ,just as there is between Gregorian and Julian formats?

it means the 'year' is not a perfect and permanent time reference.

Regardless of the day is longer (and proportionate to the night being shorter i.e. same 24 hours between)

Noooooooooooooooooooooo, I mean that the nominally 24-hour period is NOT a perfect 86,400 seconds. It varies EVERY SINGLE DAY, almost never being an exact 24-hour day (using 'day' to mean one full rotation, from sun overhead to sun overhead.

both the sun and moon mark time! Lunar months (biblical)

So, the moon is full every month on the same day, that's your understanding? 12 Full-moon cycles every trip around the sun? Seriously, is that what you think the moon does? That the year, 365.241 days, even divides into 12 moon cycles?

I suppose this can answer Skeps and bilby's post too. Its still 356 days in a year ...

No, no it is not.
First off, that's a typo, and second off, it's inaccurate.
Even my nephew knows why we have a leap year....

ALL you really are highlighting is a need for "Calibration" via a second(s). After all its not much of a drastic difference really ...is it.... when comparing previous records?

Well, that's the perfect apologist approach, Learner. Claim that there is no error, and when that's disproven, claim that the error that DOES exist is too small to matter. When someone shows that it does matter, what's next? Claim that it only 'matters' for secular purposes, not True Faith usage?

But true ...I do need to look into it (and gain a little more knowledge).

A lottle more, actually. It's LIKE a little, but a lot.

 

[skepticalbip]

Have you or anyone seen or noticed on any record(s) : the decay?

Heh.
Yeah. I actually teach this. Part of the presentation is the actual numbers about how much the day is slowing, but why the slowin gof the day is NOT the reason for the leap second.
While we're on that topic, we discuss the actual length of a year and the variation in that.

Once again, you appear to know JUST enough about the topic to be confident, but not enough to look knowledgable.

lol ..ok......But what does it mean? Do you mean it doesn't fit the "conventional calender" as there is a difference ,just as there is between Gregorian and Julian formats?

Regardless of the day is longer (and proportionate to the night being shorter i.e. same 24 hours between) both the sun and moon mark time! Lunar months (biblical)

I suppose this can answer Skeps and bilby's post too. Its still 356 days in a year ...ALL you really are highlighting is a need for "Calibration" via a second(s). After all its not much of a drastic difference really ...is it.... when comparing previous records?

But true ...I do need to look into it (and gain a little more knowledge).

How important time is really depends on what you want to do. For someone navigating the ocean that doesn't want run aground on a reef during the night, seconds of error in timing could be devastating in calculating their position. For someone growing turnips, an error of days on timing the planting wouldn't be a big deal but an error of months would.

But to your "clockwork" precision for the Lunar month:

http://earthsky.org/astronomy-essentials/lengths-of-lunar-months-in-2017

The shortest lunar month of 2017 starts with the May 25 new moon and ends at new moon on June 24, lasting 29 days 6 hours and 46 minutes. The longest lunar month of the 21st century (2001 to 2100) actually comes at the year’s end, starting on December 18, 2017 and ending on January 17, 2018, lasting for 29 days 19 hours and 47 minutes.

That would be a 13 hour variation in the length of the Lunar month in 2017. For turnip planting, this wouldn't be significant but would be for many other other things.

 

[Jobar]

356 days in a year

Not in a very, very long time.

 Day length fluctuations

 Earth's rotation

Over millions of years, the Earth's rotation slowed significantly by tidal acceleration through gravitational interactions with the Moon. In this process, angular momentum is slowly transferred to the Moon at a rate proportional to r − 6 {\displaystyle r^{-6}} r^{{-6}}, where r {\displaystyle r} r is the orbital radius of the Moon. This process gradually increased the length of day to its current value and resulted in the Moon being tidally locked with the Earth.

This gradual rotational deceleration is empirically documented with estimates of day lengths obtained from observations of tidal rhythmites and stromatolites; a compilation of these measurements[41] found the length of day to increase steadily from about 21 hours at 600Myr ago[42] to the current 24 hour value. By counting the microscopic lamina that form at higher tides, tidal frequencies (and thus day lengths) can be estimated, much like counting tree rings, though these estimates can be increasingly unreliable at older ages.

 

[Learner]

Pardon me . I did mean 365 days.

lol

 

[Keith&Co.]

Pardon me . I did mean 365 days.

lol

Yeah, we figured.
But that's still wrong.

 

[Learner]

Whether it's a 'drastic' difference depends on what you want to do with the information, and over what timescale your 'previous records' span. Between today and the start of the Common Era with the early church's guesstimate of the timing of their legends, the effects causing the leap second have made a difference of about 1,260 seconds, or 21 minutes. Since the construction of Stonehenge, the difference is almost an hour.

That may not seem like much, but if you are trying to send supplies to the ISS, getting your timing wrong by a just few seconds means missing the space station completely, leaving the astronauts to starve.

If the GPS satellite clocks were wrong by even a few milliseconds, the whole satellite navigation thing wouldn't work at all.

Accurate timekeeping has real world implications; And the rotations and orbits of various celestial bodies (including the Earth) simply are not accurate enough for many modern purposes.

I don't dispute having various time scales : The big world clock to reference by. Knowing what day it is , so to speak, and the precision time and timing by small increments for intricate tasks. Precision timing where you have the other party "syncronise" their clocks (setting a localised time between parties) as in your example "sending suppiles to the astronauts". (Synchronised timing is not a new thing to ancients BTW).

If it ain't good enough for Garmin, it sure as shit can't be good enough for a God who is alleged to be in the habit of perfection.

We can at least not fuss over nature and life by minor time variations which has always been fine with the seasonal clock.

 

[Keith&Co.]

We can at least not fuss over nature and life by minor time variations which has always been fine with the seasonal clock.

Ha. Nailed it.

So, nature works 'like clockwork' to support the idea that there's an intelligence behind it, but when necessary, this 'like clockwork' reference can be fudged down to 'good enough,' which is no longer clockwork.

 

[Learner]

We can at least not fuss over nature and life by minor time variations which has always been fine with the seasonal clock.

Ha. Nailed it.

So, nature works 'like clockwork' to support the idea that there's an intelligence behind it, but when necessary, this 'like clockwork' reference can be fudged down to 'good enough,' which is no longer clockwork.

Well time measured by the atomic clock hasn't really come up yet. Besides variations aren't a problem and still can be depended on for many tasks. You just adjust and "calibrate".

 

[Keith&Co.]

Well time measured by the atomic clock hasn't really come up yet.

interesting.

So, your theory is that your skybeast created days and years to work 'like clockwork,' but also hid a time reference in the way atomic particles behaved, so that one day, we could build our own time references that were accurate enough to measure the inaccuracies in the 'like clockwork' references mentioned in the Bible?
Why didn't he just make really, really accurate and stable days/months/years? Stuff that ACTUALLY worked 'like clockwork?'

Besides variations aren't a problem and still can be depended on for many tasks. You just adjust and "calibrate".

Ever been late to an appointment because your clock was running slow?
Did you tell the person waiting on your that such variations were not a problem, and could still be depended upon for other tasks, just not this one?

Still, you're just walking back your claim about the 'clockwork.' Variations you didn't know about have been directly measured, but you still need to preserve the architect of the sloppy precision.

 

[Learner]

Will have to deal with previous posts later... "time" issue.