The World is Stupid

[DrZoidberg]

It's the same thing about terrorism. If you want to fight terrorism, just ignore it. Don't change your lifestyle. Tell them to fuck off, but go about your day.

Can you provide evidence of the success of your proposal?

What would count as success?

I once worked near the Stockholm Central Station. There had been a Al Qaeda threat to bomb it. The station wasn't shut down. I told my staff that the office is open as normal. I took the train home as normal. That was the end of it. My life wasn't impacted = Success

 

[none]

It's the same thing about terrorism. If you want to fight terrorism, just ignore it. Don't change your lifestyle. Tell them to fuck off, but go about your day.

Can you provide evidence of the success of your proposal?

What would count as success?

I once worked near the Stockholm Central Station. There had been a Al Qaeda threat to bomb it. The station wasn't shut down. I told my staff that the office is open as normal. I took the train home as normal. That was the end of it. My life wasn't impacted = Success

I heard about a guy who had an amazing story, it was incomplete but amazing

 

[Don2 (Don1 Revised)]

It's the same thing about terrorism. If you want to fight terrorism, just ignore it. Don't change your lifestyle. Tell them to fuck off, but go about your day.

Can you provide evidence of the success of your proposal?

What would count as success?

I once worked near the Stockholm Central Station. There had been a Al Qaeda threat to bomb it. The station wasn't shut down. I told my staff that the office is open as normal. I took the train home as normal. That was the end of it. My life wasn't impacted = Success

Okay, but the Swedish cultural philosophy doesn't always work. Take for example WWII. Don't get me wrong, I love Sweden. My grandfather was from Ödskölt. I have relatives there and I am very sympathetic to the way of thinking, but ultimately the philosophy of not dealing with racists and Nazis has limits and if you don't solve it, then someone else has to. There isn't a one-size fits-all philosophy either when it comes to Nazis and racists. People try to solve it in different ways.

 

[Swammerdami]

Three fingers forming a white supremacists' salute? I'm skeptical, but could be. I'd guess that studying the guy's social media would give a clue.

Trump gave a one-finger salute ("flipping the bird") during a televised appearance, after making a mistake while praising female astronauts. Presumably he's flipping the bird at whichever aide briefed him. (Trump thought they did the first female space-walk but they weren't first.) This definitely looks like a "bird flip", but I'm not completely certain of that either.

[YOUTUBE]J-1KklDCSvw[/YOUTUBE]

 

[zorq]

By giving away symbols to hate groups we're empowering them. The way the gay movement conquered hate speech was by quit being offended by it.

I think the message that needs to be spread is that it's ok being offensive and nobody needs to care if you get offended. Being offended has to stop being a thing that is expected to lead to apologies or changed behaviours.

I'd prefer it if people weren't Nazis. But I don't want Nazis to be quiet or stop being proud of being Nazis. If they're visible, at least we can talk with them about it. They're not going to stop being Nazis because they're forced to be sneaky about their Nazism. That's not how human psychology works. Nobody wants to be told what to do. Nobody wants to be told what to think. If we want people to change their opinion we need to up our persuasion game, rather than getting offended.

Meanwhile, how many teenage suicides due to bullying should we celebrate?

Gays didn't "conquer hate speech." Hate speech is alive and well and just as painful as it has always been. Words can have as much or more power than actions.

Thinking that you can make abusive people go away by insisting they face no consequences for their abusive behavior is silly. That doesn't work for criminal abusers, so why would it help for these non criminal abusers? You don't even want us to acknowledge the abuse? Just go about our days patting abusive assholes on the back? "Good job! I don't exect you to apologise and I don't expect you to change your behavior. Just keep it up so I know where to find you!"
No, that isn't the path to a better world.

What's the alternative? You're arguing for that we give bullys more weapons to hurt and then hope that it will make bullying stop. Good luck with that strategy. Prediction, your strategy will lead to more bullying, as well as fragile kids unable to cope with the adult world. The worst of all possible alternatives.

With you in charge we will create a woke hell, where everybody loses.

It isn't the "weapons" that give abusive people power. If you were to take away all their "weapons" except for one word they would use that word endlessly. If you were to take that one word away they would just invent a new word/gesture and it would have just as much power as the old ones because everyone would still know what it means. You CAN'T take away all the "weapons" of assholes, and trying to doesn't diminish their offensiveness.

Do you know why I think gay people have had so much success at acquiring public respect over the past 50 years? Not because they turned 'fag' or 'homo' into a playful teasing words (in only some contexts). It is because they stood up and demanded respect and proved that they were worthy of it.

BTW, what the hell is a "woke hell?" A world where assholes face consequences and accidental assholes are asked to apologize? How is that "hell?" Is Mary Poppins really the "woke devil?"

 

[laughing dog]

It's the same thing about terrorism. If you want to fight terrorism, just ignore it. Don't change your lifestyle. Tell them to fuck off, but go about your day.

Can you provide evidence of the success of your proposal?

What would count as success?

I once worked near the Stockholm Central Station. There had been a Al Qaeda threat to bomb it. The station wasn't shut down. I told my staff that the office is open as normal. I took the train home as normal. That was the end of it. My life wasn't impacted = Success

If that iss an example of fighting terrorism, it is in a very narrow sense of idea. I seriously doubt if there had been a bomb and it had gone off, if the Swedish response would have been to shrug your collective shoulders and say "meh".

 

[Patooka]

If that iss an example of fighting terrorism, it is in a very narrow sense of idea. I seriously doubt if there had been a bomb and it had gone off, if the Swedish response would have been to shrug your collective shoulders and say "meh".

Closing one's eyes and wishing the problem will magically go away hasn't been a solution to...well, anything really.

 

[Elixir]

What would count as success?

I once worked near the Stockholm Central Station. There had been a Al Qaeda threat to bomb it. The station wasn't shut down. I told my staff that the office is open as normal. I took the train home as normal. That was the end of it. My life wasn't impacted = Success

I heard about a guy who had an amazing story, it was incomplete but amazing

I almost saw a rabbit today.

 

[DrZoidberg]

What would count as success?

I once worked near the Stockholm Central Station. There had been a Al Qaeda threat to bomb it. The station wasn't shut down. I told my staff that the office is open as normal. I took the train home as normal. That was the end of it. My life wasn't impacted = Success

Okay, but the Swedish cultural philosophy doesn't always work. Take for example WWII. Don't get me wrong, I love Sweden. My grandfather was from Ödskölt. I have relatives there and I am very sympathetic to the way of thinking, but ultimately the philosophy of not dealing with racists and Nazis has limits and if you don't solve it, then someone else has to. There isn't a one-size fits-all philosophy either when it comes to Nazis and racists. People try to solve it in different ways.

It's not the Swedish way. It's the only way that works everywhere.

Terrorism is by definition the last resort of an outgunned enemy. Its about creating terror greater than them just showing up with guns.

Nazi Germany was a real military threat. Terrorists never are, by definition.

Because terrorism is violence from a belligerent side that can't win, by ignoring them we are defeating them.

 

[DrZoidberg]

What's the alternative? You're arguing for that we give bullys more weapons to hurt and then hope that it will make bullying stop. Good luck with that strategy. Prediction, your strategy will lead to more bullying, as well as fragile kids unable to cope with the adult world. The worst of all possible alternatives.

With you in charge we will create a woke hell, where everybody loses.

It isn't the "weapons" that give abusive people power. If you were to take away all their "weapons" except for one word they would use that word endlessly. If you were to take that one word away they would just invent a new word/gesture and it would have just as much power as the old ones because everyone would still know what it means. You CAN'T take away all the "weapons" of assholes, and trying to doesn't diminish their offensiveness.

Do you know why I think gay people have had so much success at acquiring public respect over the past 50 years? Not because they turned 'fag' or 'homo' into a playful teasing words (in only some contexts). It is because they stood up and demanded respect and proved that they were worthy of it.

BTW, what the hell is a "woke hell?" A world where assholes face consequences and accidental assholes are asked to apologize? How is that "hell?" Is Mary Poppins really the "woke devil?"

Woke hell is where everybody's language is policed so nobody ever says anything potentially offensive, even by mistake. Clear and authentic communication becomes difficult. Everybody lies most of the time.

 

[Politesse]

What's the alternative? You're arguing for that we give bullys more weapons to hurt and then hope that it will make bullying stop. Good luck with that strategy. Prediction, your strategy will lead to more bullying, as well as fragile kids unable to cope with the adult world. The worst of all possible alternatives.

With you in charge we will create a woke hell, where everybody loses.

It isn't the "weapons" that give abusive people power. If you were to take away all their "weapons" except for one word they would use that word endlessly. If you were to take that one word away they would just invent a new word/gesture and it would have just as much power as the old ones because everyone would still know what it means. You CAN'T take away all the "weapons" of assholes, and trying to doesn't diminish their offensiveness.

Do you know why I think gay people have had so much success at acquiring public respect over the past 50 years? Not because they turned 'fag' or 'homo' into a playful teasing words (in only some contexts). It is because they stood up and demanded respect and proved that they were worthy of it.

BTW, what the hell is a "woke hell?" A world where assholes face consequences and accidental assholes are asked to apologize? How is that "hell?" Is Mary Poppins really the "woke devil?"

Woke hell is where everybody's language is policed so nobody ever says anything potentially offensive, even by mistake. Clear and authentic communication becomes difficult. Everybody lies most of the time.

I would prefer that racists pretend not to be, actually. Just because you have a disease doesn't mean you should make everyone look at it.

 

[laughing dog]

It's not the Swedish way. It's the only way that works everywhere.

Terrorism is by definition the last resort of an outgunned enemy. Its about creating terror greater than them just showing up with guns.

Nazi Germany was a real military threat. Terrorists never are, by definition.

Because terrorism is violence from a belligerent side that can't win, by ignoring them we are defeating them.

Give a successful example of defeating terrorists who perform actual violent acts by ignoring them.

 

[Treedbear]

It's not the Swedish way. It's the only way that works everywhere.

Terrorism is by definition the last resort of an outgunned enemy. Its about creating terror greater than them just showing up with guns.

Nazi Germany was a real military threat. Terrorists never are, by definition.

Because terrorism is violence from a belligerent side that can't win, by ignoring them we are defeating them.

Give a successful example of defeating terrorists who perform actual violent acts by ignoring them.

I think Dr Z must mean that the general population should just ignore it and trust that their government will not ignore it but actively take steps to defeat the terrorists. Like President Bush did telling people to go out and spend money to keep the economy (or at least the stock market) going after 9/11 as if they weren't concerned in the least. The theory being that the goal was to demoralize the population and undermine the economy. Am I right?

 

[DrZoidberg]

Woke hell is where everybody's language is policed so nobody ever says anything potentially offensive, even by mistake. Clear and authentic communication becomes difficult. Everybody lies most of the time.

I would prefer that racists pretend not to be, actually. Just because you have a disease doesn't mean you should make everyone look at it.

Spoken like a true fascist. Enjoy your totalitarianism.

 

[DrZoidberg]

It's not the Swedish way. It's the only way that works everywhere.

Terrorism is by definition the last resort of an outgunned enemy. Its about creating terror greater than them just showing up with guns.

Nazi Germany was a real military threat. Terrorists never are, by definition.

Because terrorism is violence from a belligerent side that can't win, by ignoring them we are defeating them.

Give a successful example of defeating terrorists who perform actual violent acts by ignoring them.

I think Dr Z must mean that the general population should just ignore it and trust that their government will not ignore it but actively take steps to defeat the terrorists. Like President Bush did telling people to go out and spend money to keep the economy (or at least the stock market) going after 9/11 as if they weren't concerned in the least. The theory being that the goal was to demoralize the population and undermine the economy. Am I right?

Yes, obviously. It was from the perspective of what a civilian can do to beat terrorism.

 

[none]

I think Dr Z must mean that the general population should just ignore it and trust that their government will not ignore it but actively take steps to defeat the terrorists. Like President Bush did telling people to go out and spend money to keep the economy (or at least the stock market) going after 9/11 as if they weren't concerned in the least. The theory being that the goal was to demoralize the population and undermine the economy. Am I right?

Yes, obviously. It was from the perspective of what a civilian can do to beat terrorism.

train cats to sniff out explosives?

 

[Politesse]

Woke hell is where everybody's language is policed so nobody ever says anything potentially offensive, even by mistake. Clear and authentic communication becomes difficult. Everybody lies most of the time.

I would prefer that racists pretend not to be, actually. Just because you have a disease doesn't mean you should make everyone look at it.

Spoken like a true fascist. Enjoy your totalitarianism.

I don't think you know what either of those words mean...

 

[DrZoidberg]

It's not the Swedish way. It's the only way that works everywhere.

Terrorism is by definition the last resort of an outgunned enemy. Its about creating terror greater than them just showing up with guns.

Nazi Germany was a real military threat. Terrorists never are, by definition.

Because terrorism is violence from a belligerent side that can't win, by ignoring them we are defeating them.

Give a successful example of defeating terrorists who perform actual violent acts by ignoring them.

History is full of them.

The atheist anarchists of the early 20'th century. No government took them particularly seriously. They had other more serious problems to worry about. Eventually the militant anarchists went away.

Another good one is IRA's terror attacks in London. In the 50'ies to 70'ies the Brits in northern Ireland became more and more extreme in clamping down on IRA. Only swelling the ranks of IRA. In the 80'ies they reversed policy and became lenient and chill. They started treating IRA bomb attacks like bad weather. A couple of years ago IRA disarmed.

You can't fight terrorism with conventional arms. That's an old adage that's as true now as it was then. Terrorism exists because of a core issue. Solve that issue and the terrorism will go away.

Islamic terrorism is the result of the Middle-East being run by a string of fascist dictators abusing Islam to take focus off their own abuses of power, and to place it on some nebulous outer scary force. Yes, it sucks for us that we're victims of their domestic problems.

 

[DrZoidberg]

Spoken like a true fascist. Enjoy your totalitarianism.

I don't think you know what either of those words mean...

The opposite of fascism is tolerance. You're not tolerant. As your statement clearly demonstrates.

The problem with evil is that evil people rarely think they're evil. They're convinced they're the good guys.

 

[Politesse]

Spoken like a true fascist. Enjoy your totalitarianism.

I don't think you know what either of those words mean...

The opposite of fascism is tolerance. You're not tolerant. As your statement clearly demonstrates.

The problem with evil is that evil people rarely think they're evil. They're convinced they're the good guys.

So you're just using those terms as vague insults, rather than political descriptors with actual meaning?

I don't know whether I agree that "tolerance" is an unquestionable virtue, but I also think that promoting racist public discourse as a cure for racism is an act of mental gymnastics so profound it would be fascinating if I did not encounter it so depressingly often.