Trump VS COVID-19 Threat

[Trausti]

“If you are a healthy young person, there is no reason if you want to go on a cruise ship, go on a cruise ship.” Anthony Fauci, Director of NIAID. - March 9, 2020
https://www.forbes.com/sites/douggo...uising-is-ok-if-you-are-healthy/#5972dff42d4d

Cuomo and De Blasio also said there was nothing to worry about in the beginning.

Pelosi said everything is fine as well.

Why do you guys keep saying it was only Trump who downplayed it???

This is getting ridiculous.

It's unclear what Trump could have done earlier. China and Taiwan, the main manufacturers of the N95 masks halted export. The US had an anemic manufacturing base. And, despite what Trump may have said, it's constitutionally dubious whether the president can order states to lock down for a heath emergency. The federal government's power for heath emergencies is at the borders and ports. Trump has used that power.

 

[Keith&Co.]

So, then why would you expect Trump to have acted sooner?

Because of the OTHER expert opinions he was getting, but paying no attention to? The ones NOT being made available to the public at the time.
But, if Bonespurs was HALF the media maestro he imagines himself to be, he might have leaked the intel, prepped the country, alerted the media, worked with governors, so thast when they announced a need to take drastic action it would appear like leadership, not an ill-conceived whim?
Maybe?

What intel was there that Fauci was not aware of when he made his statement on January 21?

I'm gonna take 'Insider Trading' for several thousand dollars, Alex.

 

[Half-Life]

Why do you guys keep saying it was only Trump who downplayed it???

How many times do we answer that question before we realize you're not interested in the honest answer?
Oh. Look.
Whatever the number was, we have reached it.

When did you answer that question, Keith? Because the lesson I'm getting from this is, "If a Democrat says something that turns out to be false later, the media can safely ignore it and pretend they never said it."

But when Trump says the same things, he gets crucified. Very horrible how this man is being treated. Trump is even making a bipartisan effort to take practical solutions to this because he knows if he makes a decision without consulting them and it turns out to be wrong, they will blame him again and start whining. At least with bipartisan efforts, the Dems can't pretend it's all Trump's fault anymore.

 

[Jayjay]

I think there is a survivor bias at play with dr. Fauci's comments. The reason why we have these statements of his from January and February downplaying the virus is because if he had been any more critical of the administration's handling of the crisis, he'd not be in the position he is today. We wouldn't be talking about it because we wouldn't even know who dr. Fauci is, instead the guy in charge would be some other Trump stooge.

 

[Half-Life]

I think there is a survivor bias at play with dr. Fauci's comments. The reason why we have these statements of his from January and February downplaying the virus is because if he had been any more critical of the administration's handling of the crisis, he'd not be in the position he is today. We wouldn't be talking about it because we wouldn't even know who dr. Fauci is, instead the guy in charge would be some other Trump stooge.

So, a conspiracy?

My opinion is that Democrats/leftists read the statements from Fauci from February/March and do the Picard facepalm knowing Fauci gives fuel to the doubters when he talks like that.

 

[Trausti]

I think there is a survivor bias at play with dr. Fauci's comments. The reason why we have these statements of his from January and February downplaying the virus is because if he had been any more critical of the administration's handling of the crisis, he'd not be in the position he is today. We wouldn't be talking about it because we wouldn't even know who dr. Fauci is, instead the guy in charge would be some other Trump stooge.

What about his 36-year tenure at the NIAID makes you think he bows to political pressure? The dude is 79 years old. Retire at any time.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

If grocery stores, convenience stores, gas stations, walmart etc. can figure out how to remain open during this "shutdown," then surely other places can open with the same restrictions as well. Going to 711 at 2am for a bag of doritos and a bottle of soda is not necessary, yet people do it with no problems. If this was a real problem, ALL STORES would close between 10pm and midnight and reopen in the morning. But keeping stores open 24 hours such as 711 is stupid if this is really a pandemic. But, if it's mostly fear mongering, then I can see why 711 would remain open for 24 hours. Because there's no problems. Even the McDonald's by my neighborhood is still open 24 hours. People really need a big mac and soda at 2am? Cmon, this is getting ridiculous. Why do you think restaurants and bars are complaining about the stores that are allowed to stay open 24 hours but they can't be open?

The way they stay open is by dying.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/business/2020/04/12/grocery-worker-fear-death-coronavirus/

At least 41 so far.

The people at grocery stores wear gloves but they handle the cash register/money with the same gloves that they use to pick up your items and scan them. The gloves are useless then! Pretty dumb if you ask me if this was a real pandemic.

Yeah, gloves are of no value when dealing with a respiratory virus.

 

[cycomiko]

Speaking of rewriting history, what Fauci actually said was "This is not a major threat to the people of the United States and this is not something that the citizens of the United States should be worried about right now." which at the time was the correct statement. It's almost as if intelligent adults can learn new facts and adjust their opinions on stuff. Weird.

That is correct. Thank you for proving my point. He said "nothing to worry about right now."

So, then why would you expect Trump to have acted sooner? Fauci said that on January 21. So that means you expect Trump...on January 21....to have said, "We're shutting down everything right now!!!!!!"

Can you imagine if he did that? Media would've crucified him!! "Fauci says no problem, Trump defies medical expert!!!"

Did I say something about Trump or did I simply comment on what Fauci said?

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

Why do you guys keep saying it was only Trump who downplayed it???

How many times do we answer that question before we realize you're not interested in the honest answer?

Why do you do you folk keep replying to them?!

 

[hurtinbuckaroo]

Why do you guys keep saying it was only Trump who downplayed it???

How many times do we answer that question before we realize you're not interested in the honest answer?

Why do you do you folk keep replying to them?!

Damn good question. Not the first time it's been asked.

 

[bilby]

“If you are a healthy young person, there is no reason if you want to go on a cruise ship, go on a cruise ship.” Anthony Fauci, Director of NIAID. - March 9, 2020
https://www.forbes.com/sites/douggo...uising-is-ok-if-you-are-healthy/#5972dff42d4d

Just imagine if this above quote was from Trump on March 9. You guys would be killing him!

Cuomo and De Blasio also said there was nothing to worry about in the beginning.

Pelosi said everything is fine as well.

Why do you guys keep saying it was only Trump who downplayed it???

This is getting ridiculous. It's media spin to make Trump look bad. That's all. Very simple.

"Just imagine if ..." is a shithouse way to think about anything.

People can imagine an alien invasion, or a perpetual motion machine, or a world where people's minds are swapped with those of dogs. That doesn't make those things real.

However, if the "Just imagine if ..." is followed by a conclusion that is completely at odds with observed reality, it does serve one useful purpose: It marks out the speaker as unlikely to have anything useful to contribute to the discussion.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

Speaking of rewriting history, what Fauci actually said was "This is not a major threat to the people of the United States and this is not something that the citizens of the United States should be worried about right now." which at the time was the correct statement. It's almost as if intelligent adults can learn new facts and adjust their opinions on stuff. Weird.

That is correct. Thank you for proving my point. He said "nothing to worry about right now."

So, then why would you expect Trump to have acted sooner? Fauci said that on January 21. So that means you expect Trump...on January 21....to have said, "We're shutting down everything right now!!!!!!"

Can you imagine if he did that? Media would've crucified him!! "Fauci says no problem, Trump defies medical expert!!!"

Fine! In Ohio, the schools began looking into contingencies to close no later than March 6th. On March 12th, Gov Dewine orders that schools are to close the next Tuesday on March 17th.

So the school systems in Ohio were getting ready to transition to online two weeks before Trump engages simply on "social distancing". So School Districts in Ohio were quicker to act on Covid-19 than the President! That is pathetic.

 

[Trausti]

Speaking of rewriting history, what Fauci actually said was "This is not a major threat to the people of the United States and this is not something that the citizens of the United States should be worried about right now." which at the time was the correct statement. It's almost as if intelligent adults can learn new facts and adjust their opinions on stuff. Weird.

That is correct. Thank you for proving my point. He said "nothing to worry about right now."

So, then why would you expect Trump to have acted sooner? Fauci said that on January 21. So that means you expect Trump...on January 21....to have said, "We're shutting down everything right now!!!!!!"

Can you imagine if he did that? Media would've crucified him!! "Fauci says no problem, Trump defies medical expert!!!"

Fine! In Ohio, the schools began looking into contingencies to close no later than March 6th. On March 12th, Gov Dewine orders that schools are to close the next Tuesday on March 17th.

So the school systems in Ohio were getting ready to transition to online two weeks before Trump engages simply on "social distancing". So School Districts in Ohio were quicker to act on Covid-19 than the President! That is pathetic.

The president can't close Ohio schools or enforce "social distancing."

 

[Trausti]

 

[Trausti]

Everybody’s an Expert (2005)

Tetlock also found that specialists are not significantly more reliable than non-specialists in guessing what is going to happen in the region they study. Knowing a little might make someone a more reliable forecaster, but Tetlock found that knowing a lot can actually make a person less reliable. “We reach the point of diminishing marginal predictive returns for knowledge disconcertingly quickly,” he reports. “In this age of academic hyperspecialization, there is no reason for supposing that contributors to top journals—distinguished political scientists, area study specialists, economists, and so on—are any better than journalists or attentive readers of the New York Times in ‘reading’ emerging situations.” And the more famous the forecaster the more overblown the forecasts. “Experts in demand,” Tetlock says, “were more overconfident than their colleagues who eked out existences far from the limelight.”

Tetlock found that, consistent with this asymmetry, experts routinely misremembered the degree of probability they had assigned to an event after it came to pass. They claimed to have predicted what happened with a higher degree of certainty than, according to the record, they really did. When this was pointed out to them, by Tetlock’s researchers, they sometimes became defensive.

 

[Patooka]

Why do you do you folk keep replying to them?!

Damn good question. Not the first time it's been asked.

Same reason people are watching Tiger King or Married at First Sight, I suppose.

 

[ZiprHead]

NYT-He Could Have Seen What Was Coming: Behind Trump’s Failure on the Virus

An examination reveals the president was warned about the potential for a pandemic but that internal divisions, lack of planning and his faith in his own instincts led to a halting response.

A week after the first coronavirus case had been identified in the United States, and six long weeks before President Trump finally took aggressive action to confront the danger the nation was facing — a pandemic that is now forecast to take tens of thousands of American lives — Dr. Mecher was urging the upper ranks of the nation’s public health bureaucracy to wake up and prepare for the possibility of far more drastic action.

“You guys made fun of me screaming to close the schools,” he wrote to the group, which called itself “Red Dawn,” an inside joke based on the 1984 movie about a band of Americans trying to save the country after a foreign invasion. “Now I’m screaming, close the colleges and universities.”

His was hardly a lone voice. Throughout January, as Mr. Trump repeatedly played down the seriousness of the virus and focused on other issues, an array of figures inside his government — from top White House advisers to experts deep in the cabinet departments and intelligence agencies — identified the threat, sounded alarms and made clear the need for aggressive action.

The president, though, was slow to absorb the scale of the risk and to act accordingly, focusing instead on controlling the message, protecting gains in the economy and batting away warnings from senior officials. It was a problem, he said, that had come out of nowhere and could not have been foreseen.

Much more in the article.

 

[crazyfingers]

Trump claims that he has the power to override the state Governors on when to "open the economy" despite it being very unclear where he would have that power.

Trump says he’ll decide on easing coronavirus pandemic guidelines, not governors

WASHINGTON (AP) — President Donald Trump asserted Monday that he is the ultimate decision-maker for determining how and when to relax the nation’s social distancing guidelines as he grows anxious to reopen the coronavirus-stricken country as soon as possible.

....

Under the Constitution, public health and safety is primarily the domain of state and local officials and it was not clear what, if any, authorities Trump could use to overrule their decisions.

https://www.boston.com/news/politic...coronavirus-pandemic-guidelines-not-governors

Some other interesting things in there. Massachusetts Governor Baker seems to think that Trump's team gets the idea that a lot more testing needs to be done before opening things up. It they do get that, I guess Trump hasn't got the word. Of course Trump has previously said that massive more testing is not needed.

White House claims that Fauci won't get fired even though Rump retweeted some prick that says he should.

East and western states forming pacts to coordinate efforts.

https://www.cnn.com/2020/04/13/politics/states-band-together-reopening-plans/index.html

 

[lpetrich]

The Hoarse Whisperer on Twitter: "Nine states representing 1/3 of the country’s entire economy just formed two regional partnerships to manage the eventual reopening of their states.
Trump’s leadership vacuum is being filled by competent, responsible governors." / Twitter

A northeast one and a west-coast one.

The Hoarse Whisperer on Twitter: "West Coast: California, Oregon, Washington
East Coast: Connecticut, Rhode Island, New York, New Jersey, Pennsylvania, Delaware
Watch for other states to join.
Blue state governors are simply replacing the failed federal leadership with their own." / Twitter

The Hoarse Whisperer on Twitter: "Massachusetts joins the Northeast coalition bringing the number of states to seven.
Combined with the Western States Pact, the ten states account for just under 40% of the United States economy." / Twitter

 

[blastula]

Trump claims that he has the power to override the state Governors on when to "open the economy" despite it being very unclear where he would have that power.

Trump says he’ll decide on easing coronavirus pandemic guidelines, not governors

WASHINGTON (AP) — President Donald Trump asserted Monday that he is the ultimate decision-maker for determining how and when to relax the nation’s social distancing guidelines as he grows anxious to reopen the coronavirus-stricken country as soon as possible.

....

Under the Constitution, public health and safety is primarily the domain of state and local officials and it was not clear what, if any, authorities Trump could use to overrule their decisions.

https://www.boston.com/news/politic...coronavirus-pandemic-guidelines-not-governors

Adolf Urkel thinks he has absolute authority and zero responsibility at the same time.