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US President 2016 - the Great Horse Race

Trump doesn't hold a majority of the delegates at this time, but I disagree that a race with more than one opponent hurts Trump. When the winner take all states start, it's potentially to Trump's advantage to have those who oppose him divided between multiple candidates. So far there haven't been any winner take all states.
 
Trump doesn't hold a majority of the delegates at this time, but I disagree that a race with more than one opponent hurts Trump. When the winner take all states start, it's potentially to Trump's advantage to have those who oppose him divided between multiple candidates. So far there haven't been any winner take all states.
Most of the states are proportional in the Republican primaries. His trouble is, he isn't winning 50+%. This makes it harder to get a majority of awarded delegates. If he doesn't have a majority by the convention, he pretty much has made no friends in this process and has no way of winning support. The Establishment will look at him, smile and crush him under their big toe.
 
Super Tuesday results: Hillary Clinton, Donald Trump win big - CNNPolitics.com, 2016 Primary Election Results: President Live Map by State, Real-Time Voting Updates - POLITICO

Donald Trump: AL, AR, GA, MA TN, VA, VT
Ted Cruz: AK, OK, TX
Marco Rubio: MN

Hillary Clinton: AL, AR, GA, MA, TN, TX, VA
Bernie Sanders: CO, MN, OK, VT

Looking at Politico's map, John Kasich finished second in the three New England states that have voted so far, after Donald Trump in all three of them, but elsewhere, he's placed 4th or 5th, alongside Ben Carson.
 
Trump doesn't hold a majority of the delegates at this time, but I disagree that a race with more than one opponent hurts Trump. When the winner take all states start, it's potentially to Trump's advantage to have those who oppose him divided between multiple candidates. So far there haven't been any winner take all states.
Most of the states are proportional in the Republican primaries. His trouble is, he isn't winning 50+%. This makes it harder to get a majority of awarded delegates. If he doesn't have a majority by the convention, he pretty much has made no friends in this process and has no way of winning support. The Establishment will look at him, smile and crush him under their big toe.

He doesn't need a majority of the votes to get to the majority of the delegates. Some of the states are proportional, but that doesn't guarantee delegates to all candidates. Some of those states have minimum thresholds. Also some of the states work like South Carolina, where you get a chunk of delegates for having a plurality of the vote, and the rest are allocated by Congressional district.

If Trump goes into the convention with a clear delegate lead, there may be backlash against the establishment should they deny him the nomination. It's plausible that a good chunk of the Trump vote is people saying "fuck you" to the establishment. I'm not sure their behavior is predictable.
 
Most of the states are proportional in the Republican primaries. His trouble is, he isn't winning 50+%. This makes it harder to get a majority of awarded delegates. If he doesn't have a majority by the convention, he pretty much has made no friends in this process and has no way of winning support. The Establishment will look at him, smile and crush him under their big toe.

He doesn't need a majority of the votes to get to the majority of the delegates. Some of the states are proportional, but that doesn't guarantee delegates to all candidates. Some of those states have minimum thresholds. Also some of the states work like South Carolina, where you get a chunk of delegates for having a plurality of the vote, and the rest are allocated by Congressional district.

If Trump goes into the convention with a clear delegate lead, there may be backlash against the establishment should they deny him the nomination. It's plausible that a good chunk of the Trump vote is people saying "fuck you" to the establishment. I'm not sure their behavior is predictable.
Understood. My point is, Trump has given the finger to most of the Republicans. If he falls short, who is going to want and come in and help him get over the top? He is in very good position right now, but he still needs a majority of the delegates. It'll all come down to the third place guy. If the third place guy exists and gets better than 20%, Trump will have trouble.
 
He doesn't need a majority of the votes to get to the majority of the delegates. Some of the states are proportional, but that doesn't guarantee delegates to all candidates. Some of those states have minimum thresholds. Also some of the states work like South Carolina, where you get a chunk of delegates for having a plurality of the vote, and the rest are allocated by Congressional district.

If Trump goes into the convention with a clear delegate lead, there may be backlash against the establishment should they deny him the nomination. It's plausible that a good chunk of the Trump vote is people saying "fuck you" to the establishment. I'm not sure their behavior is predictable.
Understood. My point is, Trump has given the finger to most of the Republicans. If he falls short, who is going to want and come in and help him get over the top? He is in very good position right now, but he still needs a majority of the delegates. It'll all come down to the third place guy. If the third place guy exists and gets better than 20%, Trump will have trouble.

I can agree with that for the most part. I think it's Rubio that has the strategy, long term, of trying to keep Trump from 50% of the delegates, the establishment doesn't like Trump or Cruz. I think it was Lindsey Graham who said if you killed Cruz on the floor of the Senate, be tried in the Senate, nobody would convict you. I'm not sure who the establishment hates more, Trump or Cruz.

http://www.cnn.com/2016/02/26/politics/lindsey-graham-ted-cruz-dinner/
 
Understood. My point is, Trump has given the finger to most of the Republicans. If he falls short, who is going to want and come in and help him get over the top? He is in very good position right now, but he still needs a majority of the delegates. It'll all come down to the third place guy. If the third place guy exists and gets better than 20%, Trump will have trouble.

I can agree with that for the most part. I think it's Rubio that has the strategy, long term, of trying to keep Trump from 50% of the delegates, the establishment doesn't like Trump or Cruz. I think it was Lindsey Graham who said if you killed Cruz on the floor of the Senate, be tried in the Senate, nobody would convict you. I'm not sure who the establishment hates more, Trump or Cruz.

http://www.cnn.com/2016/02/26/politics/lindsey-graham-ted-cruz-dinner/
Cruz is hated, Trump isn't trusted. No one knows what Trump is thinking, so the Republicans are scared. Cruz is a sell out who will beholden to a few people, not even the establishment! Rubio is a toddler with big backers. I think each candidate has a positive and negative.

It is generally agreed that Rubio seems the best General Election candidate, though against Clinton or Sanders in a debate he'd be clobbered. Rubio wouldn't push away support for the Republican party, but he'd have a hard time convincing undecideds that he is better than Clinton.

Cruz, no one likes him, not even his dog. But he is a wannabee conservative. That likely means that the Republicans can survive House re-elections and the losses in the Senate aren't too bad and the Democrats end with just a very small majority.

Trump, Clinton won't need to spend much putting together ads. She'll just find the worst half of the stuff Trump has said on video, put it together, and run it. Trump will be trashed in a couple of ways. Firstly, the terribly disparaging things he said about *insert race, people, creed* in general, and then his expected flip flopping, "Mexicans are rapists v. I love Mexicans". His career as a businessman will be exposed. He isn't a building, he is a labeler. He labels his name on things and tries to convince people that that means something. The mystique of his character will tarnish, which could mean his support goes from 45% to 35%, the true believers. This could put the House at risk of turning, a particularly unlikely event that only Trump can make possible. But on the other hand, Trump has pretty much made liars out of everyone when it came to his political demise, so you can't just write him off, because he has managed to do the unthinkable. The High School class clown / bully alpha male is leading the Republican race at this point (I didn't think he'd be in the race by Iowa!).
 
Trump has already admitted that the way he run run the country might be different from his rhetoric.

One thing that concerns me is that turnout for Democratic primaries is down, but in the GOP primaries is way up, by all reports. We may have some screwy politics ahead of us. And now just to make things more interesting, little Randy Paul is indicating he might consider resurrecting his candidacy.
 
Trump has already admitted that the way he run run the country might be different from his rhetoric.

One thing that concerns me is that turnout for Democratic primaries is down, but in the GOP primaries is way up, by all reports.
This isn't as big a deal as it sounds. There are more people running in the Republican Primary, so it makes sense that the turnout is higher. Also, the 8 years of a black man in charge has made white people very anxious to nominate a replacement to lose to Hillary Clinton.
We may have some screwy politics ahead of us. And now just to make things more interesting, little Randy Paul is indicating he might consider resurrecting his candidacy.
Rand Paul may resurrect his candidacy? Umm yeah. That'll go over so well.
 
I can agree with that for the most part. I think it's Rubio that has the strategy, long term, of trying to keep Trump from 50% of the delegates, the establishment doesn't like Trump or Cruz. I think it was Lindsey Graham who said if you killed Cruz on the floor of the Senate, be tried in the Senate, nobody would convict you. I'm not sure who the establishment hates more, Trump or Cruz.

http://www.cnn.com/2016/02/26/politics/lindsey-graham-ted-cruz-dinner/
Cruz is hated, Trump isn't trusted. No one knows what Trump is thinking, so the Republicans are scared. Cruz is a sell out who will beholden to a few people, not even the establishment! Rubio is a toddler with big backers. I think each candidate has a positive and negative.

It is generally agreed that Rubio seems the best General Election candidate, though against Clinton or Sanders in a debate he'd be clobbered. Rubio wouldn't push away support for the Republican party, but he'd have a hard time convincing undecideds that he is better than Clinton.

Cruz, no one likes him, not even his dog. But he is a wannabee conservative. That likely means that the Republicans can survive House re-elections and the losses in the Senate aren't too bad and the Democrats end with just a very small majority.

Trump, Clinton won't need to spend much putting together ads. She'll just find the worst half of the stuff Trump has said on video, put it together, and run it. Trump will be trashed in a couple of ways. Firstly, the terribly disparaging things he said about *insert race, people, creed* in general, and then his expected flip flopping, "Mexicans are rapists v. I love Mexicans". His career as a businessman will be exposed. He isn't a building, he is a labeler. He labels his name on things and tries to convince people that that means something. The mystique of his character will tarnish, which could mean his support goes from 45% to 35%, the true believers. This could put the House at risk of turning, a particularly unlikely event that only Trump can make possible. But on the other hand, Trump has pretty much made liars out of everyone when it came to his political demise, so you can't just write him off, because he has managed to do the unthinkable. The High School class clown / bully alpha male is leading the Republican race at this point (I didn't think he'd be in the race by Iowa!).

I agree with this for the most part.

Trump winning the Republican nomination, if it happens, would be the WWE Presidential General Election. Maybe it's because I think he's trolling I don't dislike him as much as Cruz or Rubio. I don't think Trump believes half of the stuff he's saying, I still don't trust him, but I suspect Cruz or Rubio would be worse. Trump is unpredictable and that's the thing that worries me about him. "Objects in mirror may be more liberal than they appear".

I'm not so sure that Rubio would lose. We're a country that elected George W. Bush. I hope Rubio loses; I really don't like him. We're talking the heat of 3 billion blue hot suns level of dislike. I don't know why I dislike Rubio that much; I just do. "Objects in mirror may be more dangerous than they appear".

I don't like Cruz's views on church & state. I also don't want him appointing federal judges, especially SCOTUS ones. I'm not sure how militaristic he'd be.

IMO Sanders can't quite be counted out yet, but he's not Aaron Rodgers throwing the Hail Mary pass. I do think he's the least likely candidate to bumble us into wars.
 
most of the states voting so far have been in deep south republican strongholds so i'm not shocked hillary has done well. going forward looks better for sanders but it will still be tough for him.

Given the pledged superdelegates, what percent of remaining regular delegates would he need to win now? 70%, 80%? I could see him winning a little bit in the mid-west, but I don't know about other areas.

MSNBC just reported he would need 59%.
 
Ben Carson, Who Felt God’s Fingers Pushing Him to Run for President, Hints at Suspending Campaign
Noting Ben Carson announces there's 'no way forward' - WTVM.com-Columbus, GA News Weather & Sports
Ben Carson announced that he will not participate in the Fox News debate in Detroit on Thursday, saying “I do not see a political path forward in light of last evening’s Super Tuesday primary results.”

The announcement comes after a dismal showing on Super Tuesday, in which he finished last or next-to-last in all 12 contests.
Hemant Mehta:
If he’s not participating in Thursday’s debate, and the delegate math isn’t in his favor, it’s hard to see how he doesn’t suspend his campaign soon, no matter what he says.
BREAKING: Ben Carson is out.
From a Washington Post article:
Ben Carson, the retired neurosurgeon who briefly led the Republican presidential race before his campaign began an extended public implosion, will tell his supporters in a statement Wednesday afternoon that he does not see a “path forward” and will not attend Thursday’s debate in Detroit, according to two Republicans familiar with his plans.

Carson, however, will not formally suspend his campaign. Instead, the Republicans said, he has decided to make a speech about his political future on Friday at the Conservative Political Action Conference in Maryland, just outside of Washington.
JT Eberhard:
Whatever god nudged Ben Carson to run for President must be laughing his ass off right now. What happened to “The power of god is behind my presidential campaign,” Ben?
 
guess he decided god's fingering him to take rubio's senate seat
 
Given the pledged superdelegates, what percent of remaining regular delegates would he need to win now? 70%, 80%? I could see him winning a little bit in the mid-west, but I don't know about other areas.

MSNBC just reported he would need 59%.

There are 4763 DP delegates. A candidate needs 2382 to get the nomination. Clinton has 577 and Bernie has 386. Since there are 577+386=963 votes cast, there are remaining 3800 delegate votes. Sanders needs (2382-386)/3800 ~= 52.53%. Clinton needs (2382-577)/3800 ~= 47.5% to win.

What you are saying is that once you account for superdelegates who pledged to vote for Clinton, Sanders needs even more, 59%. I believe that because the super delegates make up a big chunk of the total delegates, like around 10% or so.
 
If Bernie does horribly today I don't think it's necessarily the end of his campaign.

I also don't think the Democratic party relying on Nixon's Southern Strategy to get their preferred nominee is a winner in the long run for them.

:confused:
 
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