Were Russia and US ever allies? (Split from How should west respond to potential (likely) Russian invasion of Ukraine?)

[barbos]

Which is something that never happened.

Yes, according to western propaganda it never happened.

 

[Jayjay]

It was never about NATO to Putin, but about imperialistic and nationalistic greed.

I keep hearing this garbage theory.

Yet you never seem to be able to refute it with any evidence.

Show me where Putin, or Lavrov, or Peskov, or any other Kremlin stooge is saying that Russia will withdraw from Ukraine if Ukraine agrees not to join NATO? And if Russia intends to leave, why are they preparing for fake referendums and preparing to annex the land to Russia? Why a propaganda campaign in the occupied territories that says "X is Russia forever"? It's obvious to anyone with two brain cells that Russian goal is a land grab, not to keep Ukraine out of NATO (because Ukraine wasn't going to join anyway).

 

[barbos]

Conspiracy theorist horse shit. Americans wanted Zelensky to run away to save his life, but he decided to stay.

The cunt named Fiona Hill disagrees

 

[barbos]

Yet you never seem to be able to refute it with any evidence.

Says who?
The guy who insists that there is nothing wrong with the video of Kharkov City Hall bombing?
I am sorry, but your opinion is not worth a shit.

 

[barbos]

Show me where Putin, or Lavrov, or Peskov, or any other Kremlin stooge is saying that Russia will withdraw from Ukraine if Ukraine agrees not to join NATO?

Russian proposal did not include any withdraw.
Your ignorance is fucking annoying.
It's your Narco the Clown who demands surrender now.

Russian proposal included independence of DNR/LNR and neutral status for remaining Ukraine. These parts were not negotiable. The rest was.

 

[Jayjay]

What a bunch of bullshit. If any "generals" are "admitting" anything on tv, it's only that Russia needs to be hurt so they will withdraw and stop the war.

Yes, hurt and hopefully destroy.
As far as Russia was concerned this war was unavoidable.
NATO has been exterminating Russian population in "Ukraine" for 8 years, hoping to provoke a response. This year it finally happened.
Unfortunately for you, you put all your money on an economic war and it utterly failed.

If any of that were true, why are you having such a hard time providing evidence of this imaginary extermination? I've asked you multiple times, and you always somehow always run away when pressed for evidence for any of this nonsense.

 

[barbos]

What a bunch of bullshit. If any "generals" are "admitting" anything on tv, it's only that Russia needs to be hurt so they will withdraw and stop the war.

Yes, hurt and hopefully destroy.
As far as Russia was concerned this war was unavoidable.
NATO has been exterminating Russian population in "Ukraine" for 8 years, hoping to provoke a response. This year it finally happened.
Unfortunately for you, you put all your money on an economic war and it utterly failed.

If any of that were true, why are you having such a hard time providing evidence of this imaginary extermination? I've asked you multiple times, and you always somehow always run away when pressed for evidence for any of this nonsense.

You sound like a broken record. I provided all the evidence starting with admission from georgian politicians who were "mentored" by your side.
You honestly believe that intentions of neocons is such a secret for FSB?

The mistake russians made was that they thought they can play that game and "buy"/influence your politicians. In reality only Israel is able to do that.
It was stupid idea anyway.

 

[Jayjay]

Conspiracy theorist horse shit. Americans wanted Zelensky to run away to save his life, but he decided to stay.

The cunt named Fiona Hill disagrees

I don't think she does.

On the contrary, she seems to agree with me:

The Russian leadership has created a horrible situation. The country is going to be a pariah state for the foreseeable future. And the only way that this ends is through a much bigger international effort of diplomacy. We have really got to focus on getting other countries that are sitting on the fence thinking this is just a battle between the West and Russia to see it for what it is: a postcolonial, postimperial grab of territory.

 

[barbos]

I don't think she does.

That's not what I was talking about. I was talking about Boris Johnson.
Other than that, yes, she is a neocon cunt.
The reason why I brought her into this is that you have this trust in neocon's opinion.
Well, they openly admit all that shit. I don't know why are you asking for proof.

 

[Jayjay]

Yet you never seem to be able to refute it with any evidence.

Says who?
The guy who insists that there is nothing wrong with the video of Kharkov City Hall bombing?

What? The "missing frame" nonsense again? I told you that the most likely explanation is framerate conversion, as evidenced by there being a shadow in the video where the missile should be.

Your problem is that you just swoop in to vomit this nonsense, then run away and never read the replies. And you keep repeating this cycle thinking your regurgitated propaganda garbage hasn't been refuted a thousand times, when it has been. This time I'm not going to even bother finding the link, use the search button and do your own homework.

 

[barbos]

What? The "missing frame" nonsense again? I told you that the most likely explanation is framerate conversion,

Nope. that's not possible. Not to mention that there were no conversion there.
And again, it's not even possible in the first place.
Same way it's not possible for Alfa Bank Trump story to be true.
Same way, it's not possible for BBC to not know that they were taking part in staged chemical attack video.
Western media are a bunch of criminals.

 

[barbos]

Your problem is that you just swoop in to vomit this nonsense

No, that's your problem.

 

[Jayjay]

Show me where Putin, or Lavrov, or Peskov, or any other Kremlin stooge is saying that Russia will withdraw from Ukraine if Ukraine agrees not to join NATO?

Russian proposal did not include any withdraw.
Your ignorance is fucking annoying.

What ignorance? There are multiple sources that tell there was an agreement on the table which included withdrawal to February 23 borders. The Reuters article I linked above cites Russian diplomats, and the Fiona Hill seems to have said the same based on her sources in US.

Russian proposal included independence of DNR/LNR and neutral status for remaining Ukraine. These parts were not negotiable. The rest was.

That's not in dispute. Zelensky has been saying consistently that if Russia withdraws to February 23 borders, then negotiations can begin. Of course he's not conceding an inch of land before negotiation, but he has said that there would be huge casualties if Ukraine tries to take Crimea.

The problem is, that a deal was drafted and delivered to Putin, but he ignored it because he fancies himself the reincarnation of Peter the Great and he wants to restore Russian lands not just in Crimea and the DNR/LNR, but the entire southern Ukraine, if not the whole country.

 

[barbos]

Canada and America supplied Russia with materials and weapons in WWII, even though we were not allies.

Er, yes, you were.

I am flabbergasted that anyone who was alive in the C20th doesn't know this...

You are?
What about american shithead mercenaries in Ukraine who think that USSR still exists and that THEY actually just invaded it.
Are you flabbergasted by that?

 

[Jayjay]

What a bunch of bullshit. If any "generals" are "admitting" anything on tv, it's only that Russia needs to be hurt so they will withdraw and stop the war.

Yes, hurt and hopefully destroy.
As far as Russia was concerned this war was unavoidable.
NATO has been exterminating Russian population in "Ukraine" for 8 years, hoping to provoke a response. This year it finally happened.
Unfortunately for you, you put all your money on an economic war and it utterly failed.

If any of that were true, why are you having such a hard time providing evidence of this imaginary extermination? I've asked you multiple times, and you always somehow always run away when pressed for evidence for any of this nonsense.

You sound like a broken record. I provided all the evidence starting with admission from georgian politicians who were "mentored" by your side.

What a pathetic dodge. I ask about evidence for extermination of pro-Russians in Ukraine, and you bring up some conspiracy theorist nonsense about US diplomacy in Georgia, which has absolutely nothing to do with anything.

 

[barbos]

That's not in dispute. Zelensky has been saying consistently that if Russia withdraws to February 23 borders, then negotiations can begin

He can say whatever he wants. And he does. The other day he declared a war to North Korea

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

Show me where Putin, or Lavrov, or Peskov, or any other Kremlin stooge is saying that Russia will withdraw from Ukraine if Ukraine agrees not to join NATO?

Russian proposal did not include any withdraw.
Your ignorance is fucking annoying.
It's your Narco the Clown who demands surrender now.

Russian proposal included independence of DNR/LNR and neutral status for remaining Ukraine. These parts were not negotiable. The rest was.

Love that term "remaining Ukraine". Nothing at all suspicious there.

 

[barbos]

What a pathetic dodge. I ask about evidence for extermination of pro-Russians in Ukraine,

Yes, 14 thousand people have died over there in 8 years. 1/3 of that number is civilian population. The woman who died on the video during terrorist attack by ukrainian nazi airforce is icluded in that number. [removed]
The pilot was considered a hero in Ukraine. Yep, he murdered 8 (bystanders) people in that attack on Donetsk City Hall in 2014.

 

[barbos]

Love that term "remaining Ukraine". Nothing at all suspicious there.

Kosovo, nothing suspicious there too.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

Love that term "remaining Ukraine". Nothing at all suspicious there.

Kosovo, nothing suspicious there too.

Dude, it appears you lost. You lost to fucking "clown", as I think you put it.