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Yet another school shooting

There's a facebook meme going around to the effect of:
"An objection to restricting access to assault rifles seems to be that it won't stop mass killers, it will only make it more difficult. Fine - let's make it more difficult then; let them try to kill 17 people in five minutes with a butter knife, brick, rocks - whatever. Let's do whatever we can to make it as difficult as possible because I"M SICK OF IT BEING EASY!"
 
Except he WAS adopted at birth AND he WAS taken in by a couple that seemed to genuinely want to help him.

Some Rightists say Cruz (the FL school shooter) was Antifa, or Muslim, or a Dreamer. Some Liberals say he was alt right. People who knew him say he was weird and depressed. His social media says he had a lot of guns and he killed small animals.

I'm going with the last two. I find those sufficient to explain a mass shooter. And they are things that you can actually check for yourself in the world of real things,

I know that this is way too soon, and not enough is known but I will still go out on a limb and say that gun control (which I heavily favor) is not the first place to lay blame or to look for solutions.

We have a 19 year old boy, adopted and an unknown (to the public or at least to me) age. I am guessing he was not adopted as an infant because every news story talks about his adoptive parents. So, I will assume that he was at least a toddler and possibly school age when he was adopted by who seem to have been good, loving, attentive parents. But some people who are adopted as infants have some issues surrounding adoption and if they were adopted as older children, it is often the case that there has been much trauma in a young child's life prior to whatever circumstances lead to the dissolution of a relationship with the biological parents, whatever those circumstances. So, at a minimum, going into the relationship with his adoptive parents, the kid had already suffered some significant trauma.

His adoptive father dies.

His adoptive mother dies, rather recently.

He lost his girlfriend (not sure how long ago).

He was taken in by a friend's family but that wasn't working out so he asked a different friend's family if he could live there.

He gets kicked out of school for behavior problems (ya think?).

This kid--and I'm sorry, a 19 year old is still more kid than adult, no matter what law says--lost every single anchor he possibly could have had, most of them in a relatively short period of time.

Why did no one reach out, encompass him, envelop him in love and caring and yes, get him into as many services as possible?

Why weren't there more services for this kid?


I was 49, long married, with my children grown or mostly grown when I lost both my parents in a relatively short period of time--over the course of a summer, actually.

What did it feel like to this adult, in a long stable relationship, with a good job, economic stability, great health care, a home, family and friends who love me to lose both my parents so quickly?

It felt as though I had been dragged through a field of barbed wire, embedded with shards of glass, then dragged through battery acid. I had a loving husband, children old enough and together enough to be supportive and to share my grief, friends- some decades long friendships, siblings and other family to lean on. But that's what it felt like. I swear every single nerve ending in my body and my mind was raw with pain. For weeks. Eventually the battery acid feeling subsided to just something like alcohol on an open wound, and then to some mild acid like vinegar. But that took weeks and months and I had friends, family, a job: all the support in the world.

This kid lost everything.

People just talk about how weird he was.

Yeah, I know I'm the only person in this world who feels for this kid's pain and wants to know what we are going to do to stop school shootings.

We need to start dealing with this before anyone even thinks that a possible solution to whatever bad things they are feeling and experiencing gets resolved with a gun or twenty.

You're not the only person. My daughter and I were having this discussion almost exactly word for word this morning.
 
I also feel as if the system failed this boy. It's insane that an 18 year old can buy such a lethal weapon legally, especially when one has had a history of emotional problems and depression, especially when some of his remarks on social media were reported to the FBI, especially when the school he attended was so concerned about his combative behavior that they expelled him, especially after he had been taking medications for mental illness, and especially when he had a case opened by social services. Did I leave anything out?

And, the vast majority of gun owners want more restrictions for gun ownership, so it's about time to move in that direction. For starters, we could have better background checks, get rid of the gun show loophole, raise the age of gun ownership. restrict access to assault type weapons, etc. I seriously doubt the founders would have written the 2nd Amendment if they had the type of weapons that we have these days. Perhaps we could change the amendment to say that we have the right to own muskets that can shoot two or three times within a minute. What people are buying these days are often more similar to military type weapons. And, I say that as someone who is married to a gun toting liberal. I'm very pleased that some of the teenagers in Florida are trying to start a movement to change gun laws. It's too bad that they look more like adults than most of the grown men in Congress.
 
https://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/florida-shooter-former-friend-gma_us_5a8c1890e4b0117adf71f83f

“He used to sell knives out of his lunchbox, which I thought was like insane because you can’t have knives ... [in] a school,” Lopez said. “He would talk about how he sympathized with Syrian terrorists and how people who opposed them should be killed.”



-----

The wingnuts are trying to spin this as some sort of leftist plot. The kid was a kook with terrorist sympathies, probably not really thought out.
 
Except he WAS adopted at birth AND he WAS taken in by a couple that seemed to genuinely want to help him.

Everything that I have read states that he and his younger biological brother were adopted as young children. The fact that he was adopted with a younger biological brother strongly suggests that he was at most, a toddler when he was adopted. His adoptive parents were older. His adoptive father died when Nikolas was very young.

I am certain that the parents who adopted him loved him and wanted the best for him and did their best for him.

I am certain that the family who first agreed to take him in wanted to do their best for him. I read that he left because they would not allow him to keep his guns.

I am certain that the next family who took him in wanted what was best for him.

I think this is a kid who had a life full of losses. The loss of his mother, on top of breaking up with his girlfriend and getting kicked out of school seem to have come fairly quickly together. Everything I read suggests that he's been a troubled kid for years and that the school was trying but unsuccessful at getting him appropriate treatment. AT one point, he was attending a school for troubled kids. It isn't known (at least not to me, and not that I've read) why he transferred back to a mainstream school.
 
Just found out today that, in addition to my co-worker whose niece was shot (but recovering), another co-worker lost his best friend (one of the teachers) and yet another co-worker lost her daughter.

I just can't even imagine...

This one is really hitting too close to home
 
Just found out today that, in addition to my co-worker whose niece was shot (but recovering), another co-worker lost his best friend (one of the teachers) and yet another co-worker lost her daughter.

I just can't even imagine...

This one is really hitting too close to home

I am so sorry. I cannot even begin to imagine.
 
Here is a conversation from another website that I frequent:

"Just saw an interesting article. Did you know that ice cream sales soar during June, July and August? Did you ALSO know that the murder rate in the U.S. goes UP in June, July and August every year? So, by the logic of the left…?"

" We could save lives if we could just get Congress to ban ice cream. Join me in a march on Washington to save lives by banning ice cream!"

"I have a right to eat ice cream. Do I need a license now to eat ice cream?? "

I honestly don't know how to respond to such fucking stupidity. These people are allowed to vote.
 
I wonder how much armed security that NRA guy with french last name has, because if he is even a little bit rational he has to consider a possibility that sooner or later these shootings will involve people who would then snap and take it on him and thanks to him they will have no problem in gun department.
 
The real thoughts and prayers that the right wing NRA supported, do-nothing GOP politicians should be praying.

"Please don't let there be another mass shooting in a school just before the 2018 elections!".
 
Here is a conversation from another website that I frequent:

"Just saw an interesting article. Did you know that ice cream sales soar during June, July and August? Did you ALSO know that the murder rate in the U.S. goes UP in June, July and August every year? So, by the logic of the left…?"

" We could save lives if we could just get Congress to ban ice cream. Join me in a march on Washington to save lives by banning ice cream!"

"I have a right to eat ice cream. Do I need a license now to eat ice cream?? "

I honestly don't know how to respond to such fucking stupidity. These people are allowed to vote.

Ask them how anyone used ice cream to murder anyone.

But yeah... it is truly frightening that people that stupid are allowed to vote. :(

- - - Updated - - -

The real thoughts and prayers that the right wing NRA supported, do-nothing GOP politicians should be praying.

"Please don't let there be another mass shooting in a school just before the 2018 elections!".

At the rate we are going, there will be at least two.
 
Randi Rhodes, who also lives in Florida in the same area as the shooting, read off a list of Cruz' problems in school dating back many years. Many incidents of disruption, fighting. He would draw swastikas on his papers he turned in, write about guns and shooting people for his school papers. Many trips to counselors and social workers for years. Sent to a special school for disturbed kids. Nothing seemed to get through to him.
 
Randi Rhodes, who also lives in Florida in the same area as the shooting, read off a list of Cruz' problems in school dating back many years. Many incidents of disruption, fighting. He would draw swastikas on his papers he turned in, write about guns and shooting people for his school papers. Many trips to counselors and social workers for years. Sent to a special school for disturbed kids. Nothing seemed to get through to him.
His head was clearly broken and there are limits to how much of it one can fix. In fact I am of the opinion that you can't fix it at all. Best you can do is to manage it.
 
Randi Rhodes, who also lives in Florida in the same area as the shooting, read off a list of Cruz' problems in school dating back many years. Many incidents of disruption, fighting. He would draw swastikas on his papers he turned in, write about guns and shooting people for his school papers. Many trips to counselors and social workers for years. Sent to a special school for disturbed kids. Nothing seemed to get through to him.

You can lead a horse to water...Social workers are only as helpful as the recipient is willing to work with them.

Counselors are useless. They never really address the things you want to talk about but seem trained to try and direct the conversation in a way they want. So you'll finish spilling your guts to one and they'll ask some stupid question out of left field about "Your future". They don't actually seem to acknowledge or care about your problems but only exist to reinforce school ethics onto students. "Graduate! Go to college! Get a good job! Be a credit to society!" That's great and all but not the sort of thing a disaffected outcast is interested in hearing. It sounds trite and patronizing at the same time. It feels like the lights are on but nobody's actually listening.

Special schools are a wild card just as likely to hurt as they are to help.
 
Randi Rhodes, who also lives in Florida in the same area as the shooting, read off a list of Cruz' problems in school dating back many years. Many incidents of disruption, fighting. He would draw swastikas on his papers he turned in, write about guns and shooting people for his school papers. Many trips to counselors and social workers for years. Sent to a special school for disturbed kids. Nothing seemed to get through to him.
His head was clearly broken and there are limits to how much of it one can fix. In fact I am of the opinion that you can't fix it at all. Best you can do is to manage it.

And not let him buy an AR-15 or any other kind of a gun.
 
Here is a conversation from another website that I frequent:

"Just saw an interesting article. Did you know that ice cream sales soar during June, July and August? Did you ALSO know that the murder rate in the U.S. goes UP in June, July and August every year? So, by the logic of the left…?"

" We could save lives if we could just get Congress to ban ice cream. Join me in a march on Washington to save lives by banning ice cream!"

"I have a right to eat ice cream. Do I need a license now to eat ice cream?? "

I honestly don't know how to respond to such fucking stupidity. These people are allowed to vote.

The point is correlation != causation. When there's a problem a lot of people will jump on the first correlation they see and insist it's the cause of the problem.
 
Randi Rhodes, who also lives in Florida in the same area as the shooting, read off a list of Cruz' problems in school dating back many years. Many incidents of disruption, fighting. He would draw swastikas on his papers he turned in, write about guns and shooting people for his school papers. Many trips to counselors and social workers for years. Sent to a special school for disturbed kids. Nothing seemed to get through to him.
His head was clearly broken and there are limits to how much of it one can fix. In fact I am of the opinion that you can't fix it at all. Best you can do is to manage it.

And not let him buy an AR-15 or any other kind of a gun.

Agreed.

But the left wanted to put the mental health records into a nationwide police database. As normal, they let their overreach cause it to fail.
 
And not let him buy an AR-15 or any other kind of a gun.

Agreed.

But the left wanted to put the mental health records into a nationwide police database. As normal, they let their overreach cause it to fail.

Except that is the whole issue, when can constitutional rights be taken away. The normal process is going through a court system and the judge then would take it away with due process. The courts have been very lenient on things like that or locking people up. We couldn't keep my ex in a mental hospital even though that was what she needed for a long time.
 
Randi Rhodes, who also lives in Florida in the same area as the shooting, read off a list of Cruz' problems in school dating back many years. Many incidents of disruption, fighting. He would draw swastikas on his papers he turned in, write about guns and shooting people for his school papers. Many trips to counselors and social workers for years. Sent to a special school for disturbed kids. Nothing seemed to get through to him.

And yet, he could LEGALLY own an AR-15. Meanwhile the gun nuts smirked. "We own the politicians and we make the rules and laws. Suck it up liberals!".
 
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