6/27/24 presidential debate

[pood]

Goldwater was a good candidate.

You do realize that Goldwater later recanted some of his positions, including his opposition to the 1964 civil rights act?

By the way, do YOU support the 1964 civil rights act?

I support the 1957 civil rights act and the 1960 civil rights act. There's a reason many people who supported the 1957 act and the 1960 act opposed the 1964 act, and many people who opposed the 1957 act and the 1960 act supported the 1964 act. You did know there were other civil rights acts?

Why, Yes I do. They were toothless.

You actually oppose this. Just to get it straight.

The upshot of course is that the act of 1964 provides for the very color-blind society you claim to support, but obviously do not really support.

 

[Politesse]

I think that it's also true that a great deal of the work accomplished in DC is accomplished by persons of color and queer people, that has always been the case and it is my opinion that queer and person of color is being highlighted instead of hidden.

Also true. The Lavender scare wasn't a travesty because all of its accusations were false, but because the heroic gays and lesbians who had (disproportionately by number) kept the lights on and the legislation moving during our nation's most perilous foreign war deserved to be treated better than they were.

 

[Politesse]

I found this x thread compilation humorous though:

What the Hell is a 'Black Job?' Black Twitter Goes Off on Trump's Comment During Debate With Biden

The phrase caught much of Black Twitter off guard, leading to some amusing posts on social media.

www.theroot.com

Of course, white people routinely complain about people taking "white jobs" (before the 90s) or "American jobs" (in the dogwhistle era) being taken away by immigrants, as though all desirable jobs were their natural property. Why wouldn't Trump assume that Black folks have the same habit of speech? But it is actually a very revealing habit of speech.

Not to mention the WAY too transparent attempt to set two minorities against one another to his benefit. But that's Trump, he's always saying the quiet part out loud, that's why his people love him.

 

[ZiprHead]

If you just read a transcript of the debate and not seen any of it, who do you think would win?

 

[barbos]

If you just read a transcript of the debate and not seen any of it, who do you think would win?

So next debate will be written multiple choice test?
But thank you for admitting that your eyes and ears told you that it was a disaster for Biden.

 

[Politesse]

If you just read a transcript of the debate and not seen any of it, who do you think would win?

Biden, hands down. This is mostly a audiovisual problem. In words, Trump pretty blatantly refused to answer any questions that might cast him in a poor light, and lied about the things he did say in way that made it obvious he was just lying and daring anyone to call him out on it. That doesn't look good at all. If Biden were played by Humphrey Bogart, and Trump were played by Peter Lorre? This "debate" would have settled the whole election. Unfortunately, that's not what we've got.

 

[Toni]

I found this x thread compilation humorous though:

What the Hell is a 'Black Job?' Black Twitter Goes Off on Trump's Comment During Debate With Biden

The phrase caught much of Black Twitter off guard, leading to some amusing posts on social media.

www.theroot.com

Of course, white people routinely complain about people taking "white jobs" (before the 90s) or "American jobs" (in the dogwhistle era) being taken away by immigrants, as though all desirable jobs were their natural property. Why wouldn't Trump assume that Black folks have the same habit of speech? But it is actually a very revealing habit of speech.

Not to mention the WAY too transparent attempt to set two minorities against one another to his benefit. But that's Trump, he's always saying the quiet part out loud, that's why his people love him.

My head snapped up away from my phone where I was reading an online chat of the debate when Trump made that remark.

I do not understand why more wasn't made of this comment made during the debate. Ideally, Biden would have called him out on it but I do understand debate format does not lend itself to such immediate responses. But I've seen nothing in the media about this pretty overt racist remark, which is as appalling as Trump's or perhaps more so because I do think the media has more integrity and less racist attitudes than Trump. Or I used to think that.

 

[Politesse]

I found this x thread compilation humorous though:

What the Hell is a 'Black Job?' Black Twitter Goes Off on Trump's Comment During Debate With Biden

The phrase caught much of Black Twitter off guard, leading to some amusing posts on social media.

www.theroot.com

Of course, white people routinely complain about people taking "white jobs" (before the 90s) or "American jobs" (in the dogwhistle era) being taken away by immigrants, as though all desirable jobs were their natural property. Why wouldn't Trump assume that Black folks have the same habit of speech? But it is actually a very revealing habit of speech.

Not to mention the WAY too transparent attempt to set two minorities against one another to his benefit. But that's Trump, he's always saying the quiet part out loud, that's why his people love him.

My head snapped up away from my phone where I was reading an online chat of the debate when Trump made that remark.

I do not understand why more wasn't made of this comment made during the debate. Ideally, Biden would have called him out on it but I do understand debate format does not lend itself to such immediate responses. But I've seen nothing in the media about this pretty overt racist remark, which is as appalling as Trump's or perhaps more so because I do think the media has more integrity and less racist attitudes than Trump. Or I used to think that.

Mine too, but given my line of work, I struggle with veiled racism in discussions of "appropriate" jobs all the time, so I'm probably a bit more tuned in to it than your average bear. I imagine the same might be a bit true of you, as you are also no stranger to academia.

 

[thebeave]

I found this x thread compilation humorous though:

What the Hell is a 'Black Job?' Black Twitter Goes Off on Trump's Comment During Debate With Biden

The phrase caught much of Black Twitter off guard, leading to some amusing posts on social media.

www.theroot.com

Of course, white people routinely complain about people taking "white jobs" (before the 90s) or "American jobs" (in the dogwhistle era) being taken away by immigrants, as though all desirable jobs were their natural property. Why wouldn't Trump assume that Black folks have the same habit of speech? But it is actually a very revealing habit of speech.

Not to mention the WAY too transparent attempt to set two minorities against one another to his benefit. But that's Trump, he's always saying the quiet part out loud, that's why his people love him.

My head snapped up away from my phone where I was reading an online chat of the debate when Trump made that remark.

I do not understand why more wasn't made of this comment made during the debate. Ideally, Biden would have called him out on it but I do understand debate format does not lend itself to such immediate responses. But I've seen nothing in the media about this pretty overt racist remark, which is as appalling as Trump's or perhaps more so because I do think the media has more integrity and less racist attitudes than Trump. Or I used to think that.

Take it easy, now. Illegal immigrants taking jobs away from black people (especially black men) is hardly breaking news. And its not racist, unless you want to call the United States Commission on Civil Rights racist, then have at it.

Supporting Illegal Immigration Means Opposing Black Workers

Back in 2008, the United States Commission on Civil Rights assembled a panel of experts whose findings were released in a report called "The Impact of Illegal Immigration on the Wages and Employment Opportunities of Black Workers." The Commission found that illegal workers comprise as much as one-third of immigrants, and that illegal immigration creates a surplus of low-skilled, low-wage labor in the U.S. labor market. Experts on the panel testified that while illegal immigration to the U.S. depresses employment and wages for low-skilled American citizens, Black men are disproportionally affected.

"About six in 10 adult black males have a high school diploma or less and Black men are disproportionately employed in the low-skilled labor market, where they are more likely to be in labor competition with immigrants," the Commission noted in its findings.

Dr. Vernon Briggs, Emeritus Professor of Labor Economics at the New York State School of Labor and Industrial Relations at Cornell University, told the Commission that both Black Americans and illegal aliens are disproportionately concentrated in large metropolitan areas where competition between the two groups over jobs is likely to be extensive. To illegal immigrant workers, even low wages offered in the U.S. are higher than in their home country, and employers take advantage of this through preferential hiring of illegal workers, more out of pragmatism than bad intent, Briggs noted.

That competition between illegal immigrants and Black men keeps wages down. Entry-level jobs that are typically filled by low-skilled workers are supposed to be stepping stones that allow those workers to gain experience, develop their abilities and a solid work ethic, and prepare them for their next job, often one that comes with higher compensation and benefits.

 

[AthenaAwakened]

there are over 300,000,000 million Americans

This appears to be something of an overestimate.

I'll take a four year old, a four month old, a Labrador Retriever; ANYONE ANYTHING over Stadler-and-Waldorf-on-a-low-budget.

 

[Toni]

I found this x thread compilation humorous though:

What the Hell is a 'Black Job?' Black Twitter Goes Off on Trump's Comment During Debate With Biden

The phrase caught much of Black Twitter off guard, leading to some amusing posts on social media.

www.theroot.com

Of course, white people routinely complain about people taking "white jobs" (before the 90s) or "American jobs" (in the dogwhistle era) being taken away by immigrants, as though all desirable jobs were their natural property. Why wouldn't Trump assume that Black folks have the same habit of speech? But it is actually a very revealing habit of speech.

Not to mention the WAY too transparent attempt to set two minorities against one another to his benefit. But that's Trump, he's always saying the quiet part out loud, that's why his people love him.

My head snapped up away from my phone where I was reading an online chat of the debate when Trump made that remark.

I do not understand why more wasn't made of this comment made during the debate. Ideally, Biden would have called him out on it but I do understand debate format does not lend itself to such immediate responses. But I've seen nothing in the media about this pretty overt racist remark, which is as appalling as Trump's or perhaps more so because I do think the media has more integrity and less racist attitudes than Trump. Or I used to think that.

Take it easy, now. Illegal immigrants taking jobs away from black people (especially black men) is hardly breaking news. And its not racist, unless you want to call the United States Commission on Civil Rights racist, then have at it.

Supporting Illegal Immigration Means Opposing Black Workers

Back in 2008, the United States Commission on Civil Rights assembled a panel of experts whose findings were released in a report called "The Impact of Illegal Immigration on the Wages and Employment Opportunities of Black Workers." The Commission found that illegal workers comprise as much as one-third of immigrants, and that illegal immigration creates a surplus of low-skilled, low-wage labor in the U.S. labor market. Experts on the panel testified that while illegal immigration to the U.S. depresses employment and wages for low-skilled American citizens, Black men are disproportionally affected.

"About six in 10 adult black males have a high school diploma or less and Black men are disproportionately employed in the low-skilled labor market, where they are more likely to be in labor competition with immigrants," the Commission noted in its findings.

Dr. Vernon Briggs, Emeritus Professor of Labor Economics at the New York State School of Labor and Industrial Relations at Cornell University, told the Commission that both Black Americans and illegal aliens are disproportionately concentrated in large metropolitan areas where competition between the two groups over jobs is likely to be extensive. To illegal immigrant workers, even low wages offered in the U.S. are higher than in their home country, and employers take advantage of this through preferential hiring of illegal workers, more out of pragmatism than bad intent, Briggs noted.

That competition between illegal immigrants and Black men keeps wages down. Entry-level jobs that are typically filled by low-skilled workers are supposed to be stepping stones that allow those workers to gain experience, develop their abilities and a solid work ethic, and prepare them for their next job, often one that comes with higher compensation and benefits.

What really is happening is that the legal status of undocumented workers keeps wages fir certain types of jobs low and allows those who employ undocumented workers to ignore inconvenient laws and regulations concerning worker safety, work hours, benefits, overtime, health care, etc.

I’m certain there is a certain amount of racism involved for employers who prefer to employ workers they can abuse with impunity and who have ( generally) lighter skin colors than many black people. I also know that there are those white Americans who have a great deal more sympathy and empathy for immigrants compared with the descendants of enslaved people, and of indigenous people that some sought to exterminate.

 

[southernhybrid]

I found this x thread compilation humorous though:

What the Hell is a 'Black Job?' Black Twitter Goes Off on Trump's Comment During Debate With Biden

The phrase caught much of Black Twitter off guard, leading to some amusing posts on social media.

www.theroot.com

Of course, white people routinely complain about people taking "white jobs" (before the 90s) or "American jobs" (in the dogwhistle era) being taken away by immigrants, as though all desirable jobs were their natural property. Why wouldn't Trump assume that Black folks have the same habit of speech? But it is actually a very revealing habit of speech.

Not to mention the WAY too transparent attempt to set two minorities against one another to his benefit. But that's Trump, he's always saying the quiet part out loud, that's why his people love him.

My head snapped up away from my phone where I was reading an online chat of the debate when Trump made that remark.

I do not understand why more wasn't made of this comment made during the debate. Ideally, Biden would have called him out on it but I do understand debate format does not lend itself to such immediate responses. But I've seen nothing in the media about this pretty overt racist remark, which is as appalling as Trump's or perhaps more so because I do think the media has more integrity and less racist attitudes than Trump. Or I used to think that.

I think one of the Black pundits on MSNBC called him out on it, but I'm old and I watch and read way too much news, so don't ask me who it was. I agree that there are no jobs that immigrants are taking aways from Black people. It's just ignorant to stereotype any group of people, by claiming they do only certain types of work. There are Black professionals living in my neighborhood and I don't know of any immigrants taking away their work. Plus, immigrants from poor countries often do the type of work that nobody else would even consider doing, like roofing, farm work, and meat packing.

BTw, I've never heard a white person complain that anyone was taking away white jobs. Maybe I've never lived in such a place as that. When I first became an RN, there were very few Black nurses, but now there are lots of them. There is no such thing as a Black job or a white job. Only poor immigrants do the worst jobs and a lot of them go on to open their own businesses, if they are smart, motivated and have the opportunity. My small city has at least six or seven restaurants that are owned by immigrants, mostly Mexican, one Lebanese, an Italian, a Japanese and at least one of the Chinese, at least the little take out place near me. The owners just returned from China to visit family. I've known immigrants who were nurses and doctors too, mostly from India, one from Haiti and one from New Zealand, but I think she decided to go back to her home country, at least that's what she told me was she planning.

Trump is just an asshole who lies and says plenty of racist things. But what can one expect from a psychopath?

And, these young people who are complaining about Biden's age crack me up, considering they were so enthralled by Bernie Sanders, who is even a bit older than Biden. Sanders is supporting Biden and so are most of the Black folks. OOOOps.... Right now, Rev. Al is talking about that stupid phrase about immigrants taking away Black jobs, so there ya go.

 

[thebeave]

This was pretty pathetic. Jill Biden pandering to her husband after the debate about how good he was and answered all the questions. Like he's a five year old kid. And, Joe's standing there all smiling and proud, thinking "I'm a big boy today!".

 

[ZiprHead]

This was pretty pathetic. Jill Biden pandering to her husband after the debate about how good he was and answered all the questions. Like he's a five year old kid. And, Joe's standing there all smiling and proud, thinking "I'm a big boy today!".

I assume you've never experienced the joy of having a supportive wife. That's too bad.

 

[Spacetime Inhabitant]

Everyone be honest, when you hear the words "black job" do you immediately think of POTUS (Obama) or a janitor. Its quite clear that when Trump used this term he was thinking of menial positions, and not of high level professional positions. It was completely racist.
As a separate issue, which is a universal social problem, our societies have been conditioned for centuries to think vital positions like garbage men and janitors are somehow lesser (meaning social position) than any white collar job or even most inane socialite.

 

[Derec]

I assume you've never experienced the joy of having a supportive wife. That's too bad.

Saying that Joe did "such a great job" in the debate is well beyond being "supportive" and has entered the "enabling" territory.

 

[Derec]

If you just read a transcript of the debate and not seen any of it, who do you think would win?

Even in the transcript, Biden's poor performance would shine through, sadly.
Take his abortion meander:

He turned from a topic that is beneficial to him - abortion - to one that is not - illegal immigration, for no conceivable reason.

Even if he attempted the Grandpa Simpson gambit, he did not execute it well.

 

[Patooka]

The silver lining is that because people have such short fucking attention spans nowadays, a hundred different scandals and gotcha moments are going to crop up before election day and Biden's debate performance will be completely forgotten. I fucking guarantee that on no less than three separate occasions between now and November, TSwizzle will quote the Daily Mail on some cropped, out of context incident and gleefully cry , "See? Brandon needs to resign something something fuck Newsome!"

 

[Derec]

Biden, hands down. This is mostly a audiovisual problem.

In words, Trump pretty blatantly refused to answer any questions that might cast him in a poor light, and lied about the things he did say in way that made it obvious he was just lying and daring anyone to call him out on it. That doesn't look good at all.

Note that Biden did not do his share of lying. Like about not losing any soldiers despite the Afghanistan withdrawal debacle.

If Biden were played by Humphrey Bogart, and Trump were played by Peter Lorre? This "debate" would have settled the whole election. Unfortunately, that's not what we've got.

Who would be Mary Astor, I wonder ...

 

[thebeave]

Everyone be honest, when you hear the words "black job" do you immediately think of POTUS (Obama) or a janitor. Its quite clear that when Trump used this term he was thinking of menial positions, and not of high level professional positions. It was completely racist.
As a separate issue, which is a universal social problem, our societies have been conditioned for centuries to think vital positions like garbage men and janitors are somehow lesser (meaning social position) than any white collar job or even most inane socialite.

How about when Joe Biden said this about Indian jobs? Racist or not?...let's let the viewer decide: