Split Can we call this insurrection? (Split from Race for 2024)

[Derec]

THIS DISCUSSIONS OF POTENTIAL INSURRECTION NOT INVOLVEDWITH PEOPLE RUNNING FOR OFFICE WAS SPLIT FROM RACE FOR 2024

It's not just democrats who object to violent insurrection, to the point of booting violent insurrectioists off the ballot.
Tom

Except for this kind of violent insurrection:

Reminder: a group of left-wing insurrectionists armed with rifles occupied several city blocks in Seattle in 2020 for weeks and suffered zero consequences.

Insurrections are ok when leftists do them. That's why the likes of Huey Newton or Fred Hampton, self-described "revolutionaries" who wanted to overthrow the US government and impose a Maoist dictatorship are still revered on the left.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

Insurrections are ok when leftists do them. That's why the likes of Huey Newton or Fred Hampton, self-described "revolutionaries" who wanted to overthrow the US government and impose a Maoist dictatorship are still revered on the left.

There is also the Y'all Queda group that has had even more aggressive standoffs with the police. And they brought along human shields.

 

[bilby]

Reminder: a group of left-wing insurrectionists armed with rifles occupied several city blocks in Seattle in 2020 for weeks and suffered zero consequences.

Are any of them attempting to run for President?

If so, I would be completely comfortable with their disqualification on a 14th Amendment basis.

If not, mentioning their existence is completely irrelevant whataboutism of the most pathetic kind.

 

[Harry Bosch]

It's not just democrats who object to violent insurrection, to the point of booting violent insurrectioists off the ballot.
Tom

Except for this kind of violent insurrection:

Reminder: a group of left-wing insurrectionists armed with rifles occupied several city blocks in Seattle in 2020 for weeks and suffered zero consequences.

Insurrections are ok when leftists do them. That's why the likes of Huey Newton or Fred Hampton, self-described "revolutionaries" who wanted to overthrow the US government and impose a Maoist dictatorship are still revered on the left.

The above insurrectionists were very mean blocking streets, delaying motorists. The Jan 6 rioters were trying to stop the election of Biden. They were trying to stop the transfer of power in the US. Do you see the difference?

 

[Elixir]

It's not just democrats who object to violent insurrection, to the point of booting violent insurrectioists off the ballot.
Tom

Except for this kind of violent insurrection:

Reminder: a group of left-wing insurrectionists armed with rifles occupied several city blocks in Seattle in 2020 for weeks and suffered zero consequences.

Insurrections are ok when leftists do them. That's why the likes of Huey Newton or Fred Hampton, self-described "revolutionaries" who wanted to overthrow the US government and impose a Maoist dictatorship are still revered on the left.

The above insurrectionists were very mean blocking streets, delaying motorists. The Jan 6 rioters were trying to stop the election of Biden. They were trying to stop the transfer of power in the US. Do you see the difference?

That question has been asked and ignored so many times that the answer is evident.

 

[Harry Bosch]

It's not just democrats who object to violent insurrection, to the point of booting violent insurrectioists off the ballot.
Tom

Except for this kind of violent insurrection:

Reminder: a group of left-wing insurrectionists armed with rifles occupied several city blocks in Seattle in 2020 for weeks and suffered zero consequences.

Insurrections are ok when leftists do them. That's why the likes of Huey Newton or Fred Hampton, self-described "revolutionaries" who wanted to overthrow the US government and impose a Maoist dictatorship are still revered on the left.

The above insurrectionists were very mean blocking streets, delaying motorists. The Jan 6 rioters were trying to stop the election of Biden. They were trying to stop the transfer of power in the US. Do you see the difference?

That question has been asked and ignored so many times that the answer is evident.

The goals for Jan 6 (and the fake elector scheme) was to stop the electoral college delegates from electing Biden. This would then move the election process to the 50 individual states where the republicans have a majority. I can’t help anyone who dosnt see the implications of what this would have caused.

 

[repoman]

Forgetting for the moment any of the elected or government people who were involved in J6, just looking at J6 itself...

It was about what to do after the election was held, but it also had preparations before election day. It was about bending rules in all sorts of ways from just unethical to clearly illegal.

Looking at what is happening NOW with Democratic primaries that may be cancelled or have candidates unfairly barred in what is likely to be a collusive manner, how can this be addressed through enforcement?

All rule benders, rule breakers, colluders and fraudsters need to be at least investigated, no matter which phase of the election process they do their dirty deeds in.

 

[ZiprHead]

Forgetting for the moment any of the elected or government people who were involved in J6, just looking at J6 itself...

It was about what to do after the election was held, but it also had preparations before election day. It was about bending rules in all sorts of ways from just unethical to clearly illegal.

Looking at what is happening NOW with Democratic primaries that may be cancelled or have candidates unfairly barred in what is likely to be a collusive manner, how can this be addressed through enforcement?

All rule benders, rule breakers, colluders and fraudsters need to be at least investigated, no matter which phase of the election process they do their dirty deeds in.

Examples would be nice.

 

[Patooka]

Looking at what is happening NOW with Democratic primaries that may be cancelled or have candidates unfairly barred in what is likely to be a collusive manner, how can this be addressed through enforcement?

Can't parties select their candidate anyway they choose during the primary process? Isn't that why some states use super delegates and some don't?

 

[Don2 (Don1 Revised)]

I didn't know that in the middle of the street in Seattle we have a national Capitol.

 

[Politesse]

THIS DISCUSSIONS OF POTENTIAL INSURRECTION NOT INVOLVEDWITH PEOPLE RUNNING FOR OFFICE WAS SPLIT FROM RACE FOR 2024

It's not just democrats who object to violent insurrection, to the point of booting violent insurrectioists off the ballot.
Tom

Except for this kind of violent insurrection:

Reminder: a group of left-wing insurrectionists armed with rifles occupied several city blocks in Seattle in 2020 for weeks and suffered zero consequences.

Insurrections are ok when leftists do them. That's why the likes of Huey Newton or Fred Hampton, self-described "revolutionaries" who wanted to overthrow the US government and impose a Maoist dictatorship are still revered on the left.

Zero consequences? The whole thing ended in mass arrests and imprisonment, and a loyalty purge of the police department.

 

[Derec]

Zero consequences? The whole thing ended in mass arrests and imprisonment,

Arrests are immaterial if there are no prosecutions due to the political climate in Seattle. "Imprisonment" implies a felony conviction. To my knowledge, not even Warlord Raz Simone was prosecuted for taking over several city blocks with armed force for weeks. Do you know of any people actually being prosecuted and serving jail or prison time for crimes committed during the CHAZ insurrection?

and a loyalty purge of the police department.

What do you mean by that?

 

[Derec]

I didn't know that in the middle of the street in Seattle we have a national Capitol.

So it only matters when it involves the US Capitol? Taking over several city blocks and declaring them "autonomous" from the US does not matter to you? Or only because it is leftists doing it? Had Trump supporters occupied a part of Seattle for weeks, you'd be singing a very different tune. As would have the quisling Mayor Jenny.

For all their faults, the January 6th rioters at least did not proclaim an autonomous "republic", which is textbook insurrection.

 

[Derec]

Are any of them attempting to run for President?

14.3 does not apply just to presidency. In fact, it is very unclear whether it applies to presidency at all.

No person shall be a Senator or Representative in Congress, or elector of President and Vice-President, or hold any office, civil or military, under the United States, or under any State, who, having previously taken an oath, as a member of Congress, or as an officer of the United States, or as a member of any State legislature, or as an executive or judicial officer of any State, to support the Constitution of the United States, shall have engaged in insurrection or rebellion against the same, or given aid or comfort to the enemies thereof. But Congress may by a vote of two-thirds of each House, remove such disability.

It talks explicitly about state legislators, congresscritters, etc. as well as "electors of President and Vice-President", but not the offices of President and Vice-President themselves. Curious omission.

If not, mentioning their existence is completely irrelevant whataboutism of the most pathetic kind.

It is not. It is comparison of pearl clutching over January 6th while ignoring or even defending much worse things done by leftists in 2020. In the original thread about CHAZ, there were people (particularly Don2 and Politesse, who are also posting in this thread) defending this open rebellion by Seattle LWNJs.

 

[laughing dog]

THIS DISCUSSIONS OF POTENTIAL INSURRECTION NOT INVOLVEDWITH PEOPLE RUNNING FOR OFFICE WAS SPLIT FROM RACE FOR 2024

It's not just democrats who object to violent insurrection, to the point of booting violent insurrectioists off the ballot.
Tom

Except for this kind of violent insurrection:

Reminder: a group of left-wing insurrectionists armed with rifles occupied several city blocks in Seattle in 2020 for weeks and suffered zero consequences.

Insurrections are ok when leftists do them. That's why the likes of Huey Newton or Fred Hampton, self-described "revolutionaries" who wanted to overthrow the US government and impose a Maoist dictatorship are still revered on the left.

“Whataboutism” is whining, not an argument.

Trying to overthrow the government is an insurrection. Making life difficult and miserable is not an insurrection.

 

[Politesse]

Zero consequences? The whole thing ended in mass arrests and imprisonment,

Arrests are immaterial if there are no prosecutions due to the political climate in Seattle. "Imprisonment" implies a felony conviction. To my knowledge, not even Warlord Raz Simone was prosecuted for taking over several city blocks with armed force for weeks. Do you know of any people actually being prosecuted and serving jail or prison time for crimes committed during the CHAZ insurrection?

So to clarify, whenever you say that there were "zero consequences" for something, we should all assume that arrests were made and sentences served?

And yes, plenty of people were charged and sentenced for crimes relating to CHOP. Most have already finished their setences, as our law does not, despite your turgid longing, include life sentences for loitering or blocking intersections. Try Singapore or the PRC, if you want to live somewhere where rioting puts you away for all time. But those who commited more serious crimes, like murderer Marcel Long, are still in jail.

and a loyalty purge of the police department.

What do you mean by that?

100 police officers were fired in the wake of the incident, along with resigning police chief Carmen Best for perceived disloyalty to their department.

 

[Don2 (Don1 Revised)]

I didn't know that in the middle of the street in Seattle we have a national Capitol.

So it only matters when it involves the US Capitol?

Sort of, yeah, because it's not really an insurrection, i.e. violent overthrow of govt without taking down the white house, capitol or similar. Some dirty hippies in a Seattle street don't really qualify. Even if armed. However, if they violently removed a mayor, shooting police and assemblymen, that could count, too.

 

[Toni]

It's not just democrats who object to violent insurrection, to the point of booting violent insurrectioists off the ballot.
Tom

Except for this kind of violent insurrection:

Reminder: a group of left-wing insurrectionists armed with rifles occupied several city blocks in Seattle in 2020 for weeks and suffered zero consequences.

Insurrections are ok when leftists do them. That's why the likes of Huey Newton or Fred Hampton, self-described "revolutionaries" who wanted to overthrow the US government and impose a Maoist dictatorship are still revered on the left.

The above insurrectionists were very mean blocking streets, delaying motorists. The Jan 6 rioters were trying to stop the election of Biden. They were trying to stop the transfer of power in the US. Do you see the difference?

That question has been asked and ignored so many times that the answer is evident.

I wish that people would stop playing along and further confusing the understanding of the differences between protests—protected by the US Constitution, and insurrection, defined as the act or an instance of revolting, especially against civil or political authority or against an established government.

Not to me to mention the people who post images without citing sources or providing information, expecting readers to fed ce that the armed individuals are attempting to overthrow governments using weapons that these same individuals are loath to restrict or regulate,

 

[scombrid]

Did they submit fake electoral votes for president? Did they try to block certification of legitimate electoral votes? Did they break into the legislature to those ends? I'm not sure insurrection works. But you can call them that and block them from holding office in whatever jurisdiction they were subverting if they were indeed trying to overthrow and take control of that government. That seems fair enough.

Now lets talk some more about butterymales or some other whatabout. Hey, there's a mayor in a town of 21,000 that's at least as bad as George Santos. Let's bring her into this.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

Are any of them attempting to run for President?

14.3 does not apply just to presidency. In fact, it is very unclear whether it applies to presidency at all.

So? Are any of the Chaz people running for office?