Dem Post Mortem

[TomC]

What shift? Latinos are still Latinos. How the GOP is marketing towards them is changing. Trump made a play for the toxic male vote. And lets remember, latinos didn't swerve MI or WI.

So what you're saying is that hispanic men are toxic?

There is no possible other interpretation from the text above other than all Latino men are toxic.

Sure there is.
See if you care enough to figure it out.
Tom

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

What shift? Latinos are still Latinos. How the GOP is marketing towards them is changing. Trump made a play for the toxic male vote. And lets remember, latinos didn't swerve MI or WI.

So what you're saying is that hispanic men are toxic?

There is no possible other interpretation from the text above other than all Latino men are toxic.

Sure there is.
See if you care enough to figure it out.
Tom

Care enough to suss out what I said?

 

[Tigers!]

To broaden the Dems appeal to Latinos the Democrats need to start trashing Latinos.

I for one will not blame any specific demographic, but I will blame misinformation peddlers who are everywhere and the media for being shit at educating people. Actually I will blame the religious fundamentalists too.

You have just blamed a specific demographic despite your best efforts to the contrary.

Yes, I said I was going to blame one demographic.

My visible version of your post says "I for one will not blame any specific demographic,"
Those words must mean something different in US English compared to the King's English.

 

[Tigers!]

"Don't call Trump supporters derogatory names! Anyway, the other side gets to do whatever the fuck they want and get away with it."

If you do what your opponents do are you any better than them? Are you not trying to be better than them?

We've tried being better than them. They still voted for the dipshit.

Ingratitude is shocking. Still no reason to try to stop being better. If you descend to their level they will beat you with experience.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

To broaden the Dems appeal to Latinos the Democrats need to start trashing Latinos.

I for one will not blame any specific demographic, but I will blame misinformation peddlers who are everywhere and the media for being shit at educating people. Actually I will blame the religious fundamentalists too.

You have just blamed a specific demographic despite your best efforts to the contrary.

Yes, I said I was going to blame one demographic.

My visible version of your post says "I for one will not blame any specific demographic,"
Those words must mean something different in US English compared to the King's English.

Okay, the white evangelicals in this country have been demonizing liberals for decades (arguably over a century). They had their Pat Robertsons and Jerry Falwells, fat cat wealthy 'men of god' blaming 9/11, natural disasters, HIV, etc... on homosexuals (people remember "the gay agenda"), liberals. During the Clinton Administration there was no end in sight of the aghast evangelicals and the moral-less President Clinton. So much so, they put their faith in a reborn George W Bush who'd restore morality into the White House. Well, that was after the push poll in South Carolina that helped push white evangelicals away from McCain (before the pod people got him) because he had a black kid, signs of things to come.

All those fuckers voted for Trump.

 

[GenesisNemesis]

To broaden the Dems appeal to Latinos the Democrats need to start trashing Latinos.

I for one will not blame any specific demographic, but I will blame misinformation peddlers who are everywhere and the media for being shit at educating people. Actually I will blame the religious fundamentalists too.

You have just blamed a specific demographic despite your best efforts to the contrary.

Yes, I said I was going to blame one demographic.

My visible version of your post says "I for one will not blame any specific demographic,"
Those words must mean something different in US English compared to the King's English.

And then I said "actually" which is a normal English word you apparently can't comprehend.

 

[Don2 (Don1 Revised)]

To broaden the Dems appeal to Latinos the Democrats need to start trashing Latinos.

I for one will not blame any specific demographic, but I will blame misinformation peddlers who are everywhere and the media for being shit at educating people. Actually I will blame the religious fundamentalists too.

You have just blamed a specific demographic despite your best efforts to the contrary.

Yes, I said I was going to blame one demographic.

My visible version of your post says "I for one will not blame any specific demographic,"
Those words must mean something different in US English compared to the King's English.

Okay, the white evangelicals in this country have been demonizing liberals for decades (arguably over a century). They had their Pat Robertsons and Jerry Falwells, fat cat wealthy 'men of god' blaming 9/11, natural disasters, HIV, etc... on homosexuals (people remember "the gay agenda"), liberals. During the Clinton Administration there was no end in sight of the aghast evangelicals and the moral-less President Clinton. So much so, they put their faith in a reborn George W Bush who'd restore morality into the White House. Well, that was after the push poll in South Carolina that helped push white evangelicals away from McCain (before the pod people got him) because he had a black kid, signs of things to come.

All those fuckers voted for Trump.

...and when he gave a blowjob to a microphone when there was a child in the background audience, they cheered him on....

 

[Emily Lake]

Since conservatives hate Mexicans, trans people, and college education

What leads you to believe that conservatives hate mexicans,

Immigrants in general? The whole "they are eating the pets" thing.

Why do you believe that Trump's view is representative of all conservatives?

or hate trans people

Did you not see the Harris is with They/Them, He is with You ad? Are you out in California where only the House races are potentially competitive? The ads in Ohio were brutally anti-transgender.

What leads you to feel that the ads for a single specific candidate represent the views of all conservatives?

or hare college education?

You mean other than the 30+ years of mocking people with college educations, at least on Fox News and AM Radio. Of course, all of the elected Republicans have one, and typically from the elite Ivy League schools the propaganda mill mocks.

What mockery did Fox push that specified college educations? Why do you assume that infotainment has the beliefs of all conservatives nailed?

 

[Emily Lake]

Since conservatives hate Mexicans, trans people, and college education

What leads you to believe that conservatives hate mexicans, or hate trans people, or hare college education?

The things they say, the policies they support, the felons they vote for, the…

What things to conservatives say? Are they said by all conservatives, a majority of conservatives, or just a few?

What policies do conservatives support? Are those policies supported by all conservatives, most conservatives, or just a few?

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

Since conservatives hate Mexicans, trans people, and college education

What leads you to believe that conservatives hate mexicans,

Immigrants in general? The whole "they are eating the pets" thing.

Why do you believe that Trump's view is representative of all conservatives?

You said conservatives but ai answered as if you said Trump voters.

My bad.

 

[Shadowy Man]

Since conservatives hate Mexicans, trans people, and college education

What leads you to believe that conservatives hate mexicans, or hate trans people, or hare college education?

The things they say, the policies they support, the felons they vote for, the…

What things to conservatives say? Are they said by all conservatives, a majority of conservatives, or just a few?

What policies do conservatives support? Are those policies supported by all conservatives, most conservatives, or just a few?

It was mostly a joke.

I don’t want to end up in a rhetorical trap of “no true conservative” form or deciding what the threshold percentage of people thinking similarly on a given subject is required to consider them a group.

 

[Spacetime Inhabitant]

What "gendered suffix problem" did Latinos want to be solved?

Implicit exclusion of trans and non-binary people from Latino spaces. I take it you never learned how to Google? Am I your Google?

I think he's implying that Latinos, as a whole, did not want to solve that problem. And the "woke left" who pushed the solution may have solved it for a minuscule minority of Latinos but then pushed away enough of the majority of Latinos to get them to vote for Trump instead of Harris.

The POWER of the left. If anyone could be pushed into voting for Trump by a group with no real power, over some extremely minor issue, then that person is very easily manipulable, and is more likely to become a Trump voter due to the unrelenting pro-Trump slant of US media.

"Don't call Trump supporters derogatory names! Anyway, the other side gets to do whatever the fuck they want and get away with it."

If you do what your opponents do are you any better than them? Are you not trying to be better than them?

It was a winning strategy for Trump - lies and insults. Maybe the Dems need to get real hardcore and lie about everything and insult everyone. Of course, this will destroy America, but who cares, eh? The Dems already are better, and that didn't work, and of course they won't lower themselves like the Republicans did, who submitted to Trump and Putin.

 

[ZiprHead]

What "gendered suffix problem" did Latinos want to be solved?

Implicit exclusion of trans and non-binary people from Latino spaces. I take it you never learned how to Google? Am I your Google?

I think he's implying that Latinos, as a whole, did not want to solve that problem. And the "woke left" who pushed the solution may have solved it for a minuscule minority of Latinos but then pushed away enough of the majority of Latinos to get them to vote for Trump instead of Harris.

Or it could have been that every ad against Harris was that she supported trans womens rights to be in women's spaces. If that is truly her platform I disagree with it. It must affect tens of people throughout the country.

Frankly very much of the rest of her platform I was in favor of.

 

[ZiprHead]

Rather than recognizing the shift in diversity of these cultures and subcultures, the Dems treated them as a given while at the same time dismissing their concerns.

What shift? Latinos are still Latinos. How the GOP is marketing towards them is changing. Trump made a play for the toxic male vote. And lets remember, latinos didn't swerve MI or WI.

Ah yes, the "toxic male" vote. By current leftist social media standards, that label can and is often applied with a very wide brush to hetero men, regardless of ethnicity, including Hispanic males. As I've said before, this bullshit never made me vote R, and I'll never vote R, but when that message is communicated to young men, well, we saw the results of last week's election.

Given what I've said above, maybe the Latino vote by itself didn't sway those states, but the excoriation of hetero males as a demographic likely did.

I find it really hard to see any male more toxic than Trump. If that's who they want to emulate, it's very hard not to consider them toxic too.

 

[ZiprHead]

It was the poster of post 161 who averred that Harris ran a good campaign. The Shadow asked about such a strawman. I merely noted that strawman has already been presented by another.

I wrote the post number 161. I just repeated it. you are welcome to refute it if you can.

It is president-elect Trump not president-elect Harris ergo Harris ran a poorer campaign than Trump.
I know it is hard to acknowledgement you lost to a clown and a buffoon but reality doesn't not care about your feelings.

Note that I also asked how do you run a campaign against a campaign like Trump's. Would you care to take a shot at answering?

See bottom half of post 206 where I jot down some comments.

I saw it. That's not what I asked of you. I asked how you would confront Trumpers to change their minds.

I will ask you again. How you would confront Trumpers to change their minds? What would YOU say?

You asked the question I italicised above. I took that to refer to Trump's latest (sadly successful) electoral campaign.

No, you confronted me because I called Trump voters derogatory names and said that's not how it should be done.

I have given you a possible solution. Calling people derogatory names and then wondering why they arc up does not work. Treat them civility is a good start (no guarantees though). Do you really need a manual on how to treat people civilly?

That is not necessarily the same as confronting Trump supporters. Trying to change someone's mind during an electoral campaign is most unlikely to be successful. Time is short, emotions are sometimes running hot etc. etc. It needs to be done before the campaign begins.
To which where you referring?

Okay. So now you have two tasks before you. You are still avoiding doing both, just criticizing.

Stop criticizing until you can demonstrate you can do better.

I notice you didn't respond to this part.

 

[Shadowy Man]

What "gendered suffix problem" did Latinos want to be solved?

Implicit exclusion of trans and non-binary people from Latino spaces. I take it you never learned how to Google? Am I your Google?

I think he's implying that Latinos, as a whole, did not want to solve that problem. And the "woke left" who pushed the solution may have solved it for a minuscule minority of Latinos but then pushed away enough of the majority of Latinos to get them to vote for Trump instead of Harris.

The POWER of the left. If anyone could be pushed into voting for Trump by a group with no real power, over some extremely minor issue, then that person is very easily manipulable, and is more likely to become a Trump voter due to the unrelenting pro-Trump slant of US media.

indeed! Trump got votes by pushing the rock down the hill while Harris had to push the rock up the hill.

 

[Colonel Sanders]

What "gendered suffix problem" did Latinos want to be solved?

Implicit exclusion of trans and non-binary people from Latino spaces. I take it you never learned how to Google? Am I your Google?

Sorry, but I'm calling bullshit on this. Like it or not, the vast majority of Americans don't give a damn about any trans issues, and it's especially off putting for Latinos, who have a serious conservative streak. It's a losing cause in terms of getting and then maintaining a voter base.

The group is super vocal and sucks up a lot of air on the internet, which gives them an outsized voice. You wanna see attempted cancellation, see their psychotic and unrelenting attacks on JK Rowling. That's the epitome of the movement.

The Dems need to moderate their position on this issue e.g. we believe in equal rights for everyone, but not special rights. No more extra accommodations, no more taxpayer funded surgeries, and no more of this "There's no such thing as a man or a woman" bullshit.

If you wanna alter what you're born with, that's up to you, but not until you've reached the age of consent, and insurance companies should never be required to pay for that. It's a voluntary surgery.

 

[Colonel Sanders]

To broaden the Dems appeal to Latinos the Democrats need to start trashing Latinos.

Nah. Maybe the Dems could start by actually doing their research and understanding their culture, needs and desires. Like perhaps looking at surveys showing they don't like being called Latinx. By an overwhelming margin. Yet PBS & NPR, etc continue to use that term.

how many Trump voters do you suppose spend a lot of time listening to PBS and NPR?

They don't have to listen to those stations in order for the word to get out into the public sphere.

They're tired of being relabeled every decade or so e.g from Chicano to Hispanic to Latino, and then Latinx. It's condescending in that tiny numbers of overly influential people in the liberal sphere are consistently attempting to recreate their identity for them.

Colonel
You really need to stop talking sense or you will be banned.

I know you're being sarcastic, but gee, I hope not.

"Don't call Trump supporters derogatory names! Anyway, the other side gets to do whatever the fuck they want and get away with it."

If you do what your opponents do are you any better than them? Are you not trying to be better than them?

We've tried being better than them. They still voted for the dipshit.

This whole "When they go low, we go high" notion died in 2016. IMO, the Trump party has gotten into the mud and is eating all the food from the trough. While dirty politics has always existed, discourse from conservatives is a scary but very real threat.

Being above it all is indeed being better than them, and ideal, but the bully needs to get punched in the mouth. IF we fail to do so, we're going to continually get our heads dunked in the toilet in the boys bathroom at the local high school.

Of course, this is all based on the idea that we'll continue to have free and fair elections. If we don't, which I believe is an all too real possibility, then none of this matters.

 

[Don2 (Don1 Revised)]

...and when he gave a blowjob to a microphone when there was a child in the background audience, they cheered him on....

Can any of you imagine if ANY OTHER Presidential candidate in the history of Presidential candidates running for office did this, what the backlash would be? Bill Clinton, Hillary Clinton, Kamala Harris, Obama, Kerry, Bush 1, Bush 2, Gore, Bernie Sanders, even Ronald Reagan ... The Moral Outrage Brigade, the Party of Family Values, the Old-White-Men-Have-Dementia Crowd were all completely silent and worse, cheering...

The election result was not about VALUES or IDEOLOGY. It was about CHANGE and the ECONOMY. There was a perception that the economy was not recovering fast enough and people wanted swifter changes to get us there. Kamala Harris was seen as the status quo and just as much at fault for not improving things swiftly as Biden even though VP's have little power.

 

[pood]

What "gendered suffix problem" did Latinos want to be solved?

Implicit exclusion of trans and non-binary people from Latino spaces. I take it you never learned how to Google? Am I your Google?

Sorry, but I'm calling bullshit on this. Like it or not, the vast majority of Americans don't give a damn about any trans issues, and it's especially off putting for Latinos, who have a serious conservative streak. It's a losing cause in terms of getting and then maintaining a voter base.

The group is super vocal and sucks up a lot of air on the internet, which gives them an outsized voice. You wanna see attempted cancellation, see their psychotic and unrelenting attacks on JK Rowling. That's the epitome of the movement.

The Dems need to moderate their position on this issue e.g. we believe in equal rights for everyone, but not special rights. No more extra accommodations, no more taxpayer funded surgeries, and no more of this "There's no such thing as a man or a woman" bullshit.

If you wanna alter what you're born with, that's up to you, but not until you've reached the age of consent, and insurance companies should never be required to pay for that. It's a voluntary surgery.

I don’t think anyone is saying “there is no such thing as a man or a woman.” They are saying something perhaps subtly but crucially different, as can be seen from P.Z Myers’ rebuttal to Jerry Coyne.

If people want to get worked up and lathered up about trans’ rights, that’s their problem.