Europe submits voluntarily

[Jokodo]

Yes, there are a lot of young males. Some of them unmarried, but many do have family still in a refugee camp in Turkey or Lebanon. There are also many famlies. In fact, the proportion of families is much higher than it was a year, or even just a few months ago.

If you'd actually been on the scene, instead of commenting from the other end of the Milky Way galaxy, you'd have observed young men positioning themselves in the second row to allow families to board the trains first; young men covering their face because they're ashamed to let their tears of joy show; young men who are just incredibly tired. Young men are people too.

You'd also have seen very impatient young men who would, yes, sometimes get loud. If you'd finally reached Austria having experienced their treatment by the Hungarian authorities, but heard rumors that Austria is going to start summarily deporting people back to Hungary any day now (rumors well-founded on official statements by government spokespeople, no less), I bet you'd be impatient to get on a train to Germany too.

You have got nice rationalization here, but that's just that - rationalization. 70% of people there are young unmarried and obnoxious males.<snip>

You know this how? Have you been at Vienna Western station when the chartered trains bringing people from the Hungarian border arrived? Have you sat next to them on a train from Vienna to Passau or Munich?

I have.

 

[bilby]

And of course everyone needs to be prevented from doing anything that they believe might make their lives better.

Well, if their plan is to get paid for doing nothing then yes, they should be prevented from doing that.
I mean, we all know what's going on here. Yes, there is a civil war in Syria but this is no excuse to use it as pretext to get into rich country and live on social security. EU should make refugees conditions uniform throughout EU and more importantly stop the civil war in Syria by making a deal with Assad and then ending the war.

The idea of the refugee who wants to live on benefits is a myth; those refugees who do end up living on benefits do so not because they don't want to work, but because of misguided laws that prohibit them from working.

Few if any of them plan to get paid for doing nothing; that is just the paranoid fantasy of the bigoted westerners.

 

[barbos]

Well, if their plan is to get paid for doing nothing then yes, they should be prevented from doing that.
I mean, we all know what's going on here. Yes, there is a civil war in Syria but this is no excuse to use it as pretext to get into rich country and live on social security. EU should make refugees conditions uniform throughout EU and more importantly stop the civil war in Syria by making a deal with Assad and then ending the war.

The idea of the refugee who wants to live on benefits is a myth; those refugees who do end up living on benefits do so not because they don't want to work, but because of misguided laws that prohibit them from working.

I guess It's final, all of them go to Germany and UK

 

[barbos]

You have got nice rationalization here, but that's just that - rationalization. 70% of people there are young unmarried and obnoxious males.<snip>

You know this how? Have you been at Vienna Western station when the chartered trains bringing people from the Hungarian border arrived? Have you sat next to them on a train from Vienna to Passau or Munich?

I have.

I suggest you to be careful with your anecdotes because in general I have more of them than you.
And no, I have never sat next to a syrian in my life.
I have sat next to American, Canadian, Mexican, German, French, Italian, Austrian, Finnish, Spanish, Brazilian, Argentinian, Polish, Korean (South), Japanese, Indian, Serbian, Pakistani, Honduran, Ukrainian, Russian, Iranian, some arabs, Bulgarian, Turkish, Greek, Vietnamese, Australian, Romanian, South African (white), Hungaian, Armenian, Georgian, Uzbeks, Kazachs, Tadzhiks, Litvinian, Latvian, Dagestanian, Chinese, Hong Kongian, Azerbajdhanian, some africans, Gypsy.

Walked by: Danish, Albanian, NewZelander, Irish.

 

[Jokodo]

You know this how? Have you been at Vienna Western station when the chartered trains bringing people from the Hungarian border arrived? Have you sat next to them on a train from Vienna to Passau or Munich?

I have.

I suggest you to be careful with your anecdotes because in general I have more of them than you.
And no, I have never sit next to a syrian in my life.

But you know that the vast majority of them are "young unmarried and obnoxious males".

Because ... intuition? Revelation?

My four-year-old does that too, make up things and then claim to know them when it's obvious he has no way of knowing. But we're all adults here, mkay?

 

[barbos]

I suggest you to be careful with your anecdotes because in general I have more of them than you.
And no, I have never sit next to a syrian in my life.

But you know that the vast majority of them are "young unmarried and obnoxious males".

So you sat down next to an old married Syrian woman? and made a conclusion that all these refugees are old married Syrian women?
You need to get a Nobel Prize in statistics.

 

[bilby]

But you know that the vast majority of them are "young unmarried and obnoxious males".

So you sat down next to an old married Syrian woman? and made a conclusion that all these refugees are old married Syrian women?
You need to get a Nobel Prize in statistics.

A single datum may not be very significant; but it's still more information than zero data.

 

[whichphilosophy]

But you know that the vast majority of them are "young unmarried and obnoxious males".

So you sat down next to an old married Syrian woman? and made a conclusion that all these refugees are old married Syrian women?
You need to get a Nobel Prize in statistics.

I'm not sure how you reached that conclusion. To me sitting next to an Arab is no different than sitting next to a European.
While I have been posting against mass immigration of illegal and migrants, we have created chaos out of wars we created in Syria and Iraq. In these cases people are trying to flee the war zones created by western intervention.

 

[dystopian]

I suggest you to be careful with your anecdotes because in general I have more of them than you.

It's amazing how you can say that with such certainty despite not knowing a damn thing about how many anecdotes Jokodo has.

And no, I have never sat next to a syrian in my life.

So then, your anecdotes are completely *irrelevant* here.

I have sat next to American, Canadian, Mexican, German, French, Italian, Austrian, Finnish, Spanish, Brazilian, Argentinian, Polish, Korean (South), Japanese, Indian, Serbian, Pakistani, Honduran, Ukrainian, Russian, Iranian, some arabs, Bulgarian, Turkish, Greek, Vietnamese, Australian, Romanian, South African (white), Hungaian, Armenian, Georgian, Uzbeks, Kazachs, Tadzhiks, Litvinian, Latvian, Dagestanian, Chinese, Hong Kongian, Azerbajdhanian, some africans, Gypsy.

Walked by: Danish, Albanian, NewZelander, Irish.

Wow!

So basically what you're saying is that you ride the train during the daily commute rush in any random major European or American city. And this is relevant how?

 

[barbos]

So you sat down next to an old married Syrian woman? and made a conclusion that all these refugees are old married Syrian women?
You need to get a Nobel Prize in statistics.

A single datum may not be very significant; but it's still more information than zero data.

You are implying that I have zero data, which is ridiculous, no one in this world nave zero data about this mess.
But I find it amusing when people who accused me of using anecdotes use ones themselves, and pretty ridiculous ones at that.

 

[barbos]

It's amazing how you can say that with such certainty despite not knowing a damn thing about how many anecdotes Jokodo has.

And no, I have never sat next to a syrian in my life.

So then, your anecdotes are completely *irrelevant* here.

I have sat next to American, Canadian, Mexican, German, French, Italian, Austrian, Finnish, Spanish, Brazilian, Argentinian, Polish, Korean (South), Japanese, Indian, Serbian, Pakistani, Honduran, Ukrainian, Russian, Iranian, some arabs, Bulgarian, Turkish, Greek, Vietnamese, Australian, Romanian, South African (white), Hungaian, Armenian, Georgian, Uzbeks, Kazachs, Tadzhiks, Litvinian, Latvian, Dagestanian, Chinese, Hong Kongian, Azerbajdhanian, some africans, Gypsy.

Walked by: Danish, Albanian, NewZelander, Irish.

Wow!

So basically what you're saying is that you ride the train during the daily commute rush in any random major European or American city. And this is relevant how?

No, I actually had couple of words (at least) with these people, and much more than few words with half of them.
But good luck bumping into Latvian or Tadzhik in US.

By the way, I forgot dutch, I have met these too, they were much less obnoxious than you. Language is pretty obnoxious to a russian ear though, not your fault but it is what it is.

 

[Jokodo]

But you know that the vast majority of them are "young unmarried and obnoxious males".

So you sat down next to an old married Syrian woman? and made a conclusion that all these refugees are old married Syrian women?
You need to get a Nobel Prize in statistics.

Not what I said. Read again.

I have set next to an elderly woman traveling with two daughters and one grandchild. I've also sat next to a family with three kids. I've also sat next to young men traveling alone or in groups. I've also seen hundreds emerge from special trains freshly arriving from Hungary. I know that a majority are men, and I've never claimed otherwise.

While you reread my posts and try to discern what I'm actually saying, feel free to reveal how you experienced their obnoxiousness.

 

[arkirk]

But you know that the vast majority of them are "young unmarried and obnoxious males".

So you sat down next to an old married Syrian woman? and made a conclusion that all these refugees are old married Syrian women?
You need to get a Nobel Prize in statistics.

People can change if they feel that the change can make their life better. I think we need to regard all human beings as having at least the capability to learn things. We are flooded with propaganda about Muslims that is totally inaccurate. We are given false notions of evilness being associated with being Persian. We do not even seem to recognize that Iran is a polyglot nation and definitely not a monolithic Muslim. If your nation is a good place to live and decomplicates peoples' lives, you will find an abandonment of their original nationalism the general rule among immigrants from backward nations. It is only among nations that assault immigrants with demands of immediate abandonment of the Muslim faith that there arises a resistant and militant factor.

The real questions should be can we all eat? What do we have to do so everybody had a place to stay and work to sustain their lives? This is not a tall insurmountable problem for civilized people who know how to read and write. These refuges mostly are running from the results of long standing empires crumbling in the last century and compounded by the political vacuum the old colonizers actually encouraged as they left. We are seeing anachronistic power struggles in these lands and try as any of us may, it is almost impossible for the old colonizers to help in the establishment of peace and stability. Despite our great technological advantages, we too have a military industrial complex that constantly struggles for power in our own countries.

 

[Underseer]

When images of dead children started surfacing, I predicted that conservatives would celebrate it due to their hatred of immigrants, Muslims, and the poor.

I have not been disappointed. That's the "culture of life" for you!

 

[barbos]

So you sat down next to an old married Syrian woman? and made a conclusion that all these refugees are old married Syrian women?
You need to get a Nobel Prize in statistics.

People can change if they feel that the change can make their life better. I think we need to regard all human beings as having at least the capability to learn things. We are flooded with propaganda about Muslims that is totally inaccurate. We are given false notions of evilness being associated with being Persian. We do not even seem to recognize that Iran is a polyglot nation and definitely not a monolithic Muslim. If your nation is a good place to live and decomplicates peoples' lives, you will find an abandonment of their original nationalism the general rule among immigrants from backward nations. It is only among nations that assault immigrants with demands of immediate abandonment of the Muslim faith that there arises a resistant and militant factor.

The real questions should be can we all eat? What do we have to do so everybody had a place to stay and work to sustain their lives? This is not a tall insurmountable problem for civilized people who know how to read and write. These refuges mostly are running from the results of long standing empires crumbling in the last century and compounded by the political vacuum the old colonizers actually encouraged as they left. We are seeing anachronistic power struggles in these lands and try as any of us may, it is almost impossible for the old colonizers to help in the establishment of peace and stability. Despite our great technological advantages, we too have a military industrial complex that constantly struggles for power in our own countries.

You are idealistic optimist. No one demands muslim refugees to abandon their faith. What they demand is respect of local laws and traditions. Unfortunately that requires modification of culture and traditions muslims have, and what is extra unfortunate is that some of these traditions got ingrained into their faith. And to be honest these are some pretty retarded and completely unattainable in modern society traditions to begin with.

 

[barbos]

When images of dead children started surfacing, I predicted that conservatives would celebrate it due to their hatred of immigrants, Muslims, and the poor.

And what is your solution? do you suggest Europe lets everyone in?
Do you realize what would happen? Yes, it's horrible that children die, but that child had parents who knew that could happen.

 

[bilby]

When images of dead children started surfacing, I predicted that conservatives would celebrate it due to their hatred of immigrants, Muslims, and the poor.

And what is your solution? do you suggest Europe lets everyone in?
Do you realize what would happen? Yes, it's horrible that children die, but that child had parents who knew that could happen.

What would happen if Europe did let everyone in who wants to come?

I'm unconvinced that it would be bad for Europeans.

I'm even less convinced that it would be bad for those who want to go.

 

[Tom Sawyer]

Every European country should make a firm committment to take in as many refugees as Arab countries such as Saudi Arabia and Bahrain.

 

[DrZoidberg]

Every European country should make a firm committment to take in as many refugees as Arab countries such as Saudi Arabia and Bahrain.

If Saudi Arabia feels unfairly targeted by this criticism we can offer to build 200 protestant christian churches in Saudi Arabia, as compensation for their butthurtness. Maybe ask Kim Davis if she wants to head a new Christian Saudi megachurch? We'll build the world's biggest one just for the hell of it. That'll shut both of them up.

 

[dystopian]

No, I actually had couple of words (at least) with these people, and much more than few words with half of them.

Are you under the impression that people do not talk during rush hour?

Or are you under the impression that talking to random strangers is somehow relevant to this discussion? Because I asked you how this is *relevant*.

But good luck bumping into Latvian or Tadzhik in US.

You do realize that after Latvia itself, the US is the country with the highest number of Latvian residents, and they're mostly concentrated in a few areas, right? There's also more than 50,000 Tajik's in the US; who are likely also concentrated in certain areas... so depending on where you are it shouldn't be too unlikely to bump into one...

...not that this has anything whatsoever to do with the topic.

By the way, I forgot dutch, I have met these too, they were much less obnoxious than you.

Yes, of course.

Language is pretty obnoxious to a russian ear though, not your fault but it is what it is.

It might shock you, but Russian isn't exactly considered a good sounding language either. Not that this, once again, has anything whatsoever to do with the topic.