Europe submits voluntarily

[Jayjay]

Refugees from troubled countries lead to troubled families which lead to troubled youth. I don't see why Sweden needs any of that trouble to begin with.

 

[DrZoidberg]

Refugees from troubled countries lead to troubled families which lead to troubled youth. I don't see why Sweden needs any of that trouble to begin with.

The operating word is "refugees". They're protected by a UN charter. We can't not take them in. Not if we want to maintain any self respect.

The fact that Afghanistan is now labelled as peaceful and as such their refugees are now labelled "migrants" is also a disgrace. Afghanistan has a full blown war on.

Let's rephrase it, why do you think normal families deserve getting shot and ripped apart by war? Would you stick around in a situation like that? Especially if the forces involved are much greater than within that country.

Sure, we could lock the door and say they can solve their own problems. Do you think that will help or hinder making the world a better place.

Sweden is full of refugees who came here from Bosnia in the 90'ies. A majority Muslim. They settled in just fine. I think everybody can agree that it's been nothing but a boon for Sweden long term.

The same can be said about the Iranians who came here in the 80'ies.

It would be inhumane to keep them out as well as financialy unwise. Sure they were trouble when they first came. But that calmed down. We should also be honest about that the extra crime rates are negligible. Most crimes, by far, in all categories are done by ethnic Swedes. This is established by analysing the names of inmates. There's no official statistics on ethniticity and crime

 

[KeepTalking]

WTF? Seriously? What did we do to deserve the reanimation of this thread?

 

[Loren Pechtel]

For once the Daily mail got it right. Still not sure why you posted in this thread. The fact that the perpetrators are brown doesn't prove that the European Caliphate is near.

Do you think it does?

I should also mention the degree of idiocy in this rape. They live stream a rape on a public profile on Facebook They also show off an illegal firearm.

Not only are they rapists but the dumbest fucks on the planet. What does this have to say about Islam? Brown people? Immigration? If you do you're basically saying that this group are predominantly idiots. Are you?

The issue here is they obviously feel they aren't doing something wrong if they livestream it.

That says they consider raping infidels proper behavior.

 

[Nice Squirrel]

WTF? Seriously? What did we do to deserve the reanimation of this thread?

 

[Derec]

The operating word is "refugees".

Note that a large number of the migrants that have flooded into Europe have not been bona-fide refugees, but are rather economic migrants. When you have people in Idomeni or Calais talking like Apu pretending to be "Syrian refugees" you know Europe has been had.

They're protected by a UN charter. We can't not take them in. Not if we want to maintain any self respect.

Show me where in the UN charter does it say that European/Western nations must take in millions of refugees from other continents?

Refugees should be helped. No question there. But resettlement should be primarily regional, not to the West. Not only because of proximity but also because of culture. It is insane for Europe or US to take in a large number of Afghans for example, when 99% of Afghans are fundamentalist Muslims who support Sharia law.

Note also that vast majority of the migrants so far have been single men. That means that when they get around to bringing their wives and children the number of migrants in Europe will increase by a factor of 4 or 5, given how many children your average Muslim has. Europe will not able to sustain that kind of influx. That is very different than "Slobodan" or "Bogdan" that you mention earlier. They are from Europe, i.e. a much more compatible culture and also these are not Muslim names. And even Bosnian Muslims tend to be more modern and secular than those from Syria, Afghanistan or Somalia. Hijabs are rare for example and most drink.

The fact that Afghanistan is now labelled as peaceful and as such their refugees are now labelled "migrants" is also a disgrace. Afghanistan has a full blown war on.

No, it does not. There are skirmishes, but not a full blown war. And the responsibility should be on the region to take the brunt of resettlements. The only ones who should be resettled are those who are more secular and who would fit well in Western society.

Let's rephrase it, why do you think normal families deserve getting shot and ripped apart by war? Would you stick around in a situation like that? Especially if the forces involved are much greater than within that country.

They do not deserve to be ripped apart by war. But that does not mean that they all should be resettled to the West. Note also, that many of these people are more fundamentalist than their respective governments and that this is why they claim to be persecuted. But do you really want Sweden/Europe filled with people more fundamentalist than the governments of Iraq, Afghanistan or Pakistan?

Sure, we could lock the door and say they can solve their own problems. Do you think that will help or hinder making the world a better place.

Europe needs to be more selective regarding how many and who it lets in.
What is necessary is:
- setting numbers of how many refugees (legit refugees only) Europe will take in and take only that number.
- to fill that number, European governments should be selective whom they let it. No criminals, no fundamentalists or radicals.
- when refugees commit serious crimes in their host countries they should lose their refugee status and be deported. It is unconscionable that they can assault, rape, assassinate and still be able to stay. '

I do not see why these three points should be in any way controversial. I am not saying close the borders entirely or that we should not allow any Muslim to immigrate. But mass migration is dangerous to any society, especially when it occurs from societies with very different cultures. Thus, Europe should not allow it in its own best interest. Liberalism and tolerance should not be suicide pacts.

Sweden is full of refugees who came here from Bosnia in the 90'ies. A majority Muslim. They settled in just fine. I think everybody can agree that it's been nothing but a boon for Sweden long term.

First of all, the entire population of Bosnia is 4 million. Less than 60k Bosnians live in Sweden. Just volume-wise, Bosnian refugees were a much smaller problem than mass migration from Asia and Africa that occurs now. Second, the two examples you listed, Slobodan and Bogdan were not Muslim, or they are from a family so secular as to make no difference. Bogdan is an old Slavic Christian name meaning 'gift from god' (same meaning as Jonathan, although the Slavic version of that is Jovan/Ivan) and Slobodan is of more recent, 19th century origin, means "freedom" and has been inspired by John Stewart Mill. Third, Bosnia is a European country (fulfilling my "primarily a regional responsibility" criterion), sharing many cultural, legal and societal commonalities with countries such as Sweden or Germany. That is very different than what is going on now.

The same can be said about the Iranians who came here in the 80'ies.

That's because those were mostly either the more secular Muslims or religious minorities (Jews, Bahai) fleeing the theocratic Weirdbeards. They are not a random sample of Iranian society. Different immigrants are different. There is no reason why they should all be lumped together. Again, Afghans are among the most fundamentalist Muslims out there. 99% support Sharia. Then they come to Europe and advocate the same shit.

It would be inhumane to keep them out as well as financialy unwise.

It is inhumane toward your own people to let everybody in without any vetting, as well as financially unwise. It is both inhumane and unwise to keep people in when they have committed serious crimes.

Sure they were trouble when they first came. But that calmed down. We should also be honest about that the extra crime rates are negligible. Most crimes, by far, in all categories are done by ethnic Swedes. This is established by analysing the names of inmates.

Compare not who commits "most crimes" but rather "most crimes per capita". It's kind of the nonsense in the US claiming that whites commit most murders. They do, barely, but only because most people in the US are white. Blacks have 5-6 times higher murder rate even if they commit slightly lower number of murders.

There's no official statistics on ethniticity and crime

I wonder why? Hiding something?

 

[DrZoidberg]

For once the Daily mail got it right. Still not sure why you posted in this thread. The fact that the perpetrators are brown doesn't prove that the European Caliphate is near.

Do you think it does?

I should also mention the degree of idiocy in this rape. They live stream a rape on a public profile on Facebook They also show off an illegal firearm.

Not only are they rapists but the dumbest fucks on the planet. What does this have to say about Islam? Brown people? Immigration? If you do you're basically saying that this group are predominantly idiots. Are you?

The issue here is they obviously feel they aren't doing something wrong if they livestream it.

That says they consider raping infidels proper behavior.

It has nothing to do with if they think it's wrong or not. It has to do with how much they realise other people think it's wrong. Ie, the illegality of it.

I rather think it speaks volumes on how much drugs they were on.

 

[angelo]

With elections coming up in Netherlands, France and Germany this year, watch the anti immigration politicos gain millions of votes. Ignoring the problem may be a sure way of political suicide.

 

[whichphilosophy]

With elections coming up in Netherlands, France and Germany this year, watch the anti immigration politicos gain millions of votes. Ignoring the problem may be a sure way of political suicide.

I am in the UK.
While I welcome refugees over for asylum but strict controls on illegal entries as the UK is really overcrowded, Britons who return to the UK after working abroad face problems now.

Many Britons went to work abroad after Norman Tebbit and others advocated people to 'get on their bikes' if there are no jobs available.
Those who are unemployed and in need of housing can now expect to be refused as they chose another place of abode.
In most cases this is true because if they worked outside the EU, they are only in the host country to work. After that they have a short time to leave. If they don't leave it is the bum's rush.

Anyway thanks to the EU Britons have to pass a Habitual Residency Test and cannot immediately open a bank account unless they have a fixed address and utility bills.
There is no definition of how long this should take but a consensus suggests 1 to 3 months. Then there is time to evaluate and appeal.

The wife of a low paid British citizen (under GBP18,000.00 plus GBP 2,500.00 per year more for each child) cannot bring his non British/EU wife to the UK and likewise the wife cannot bring the husband to the UK.

However, a EU citizen who comes to the UK to seek work does not have to comply to this and can bring anyone.

Ealing Council in London advertises the fact that it was one of the first to house refugees from Syria which is a good thing (for the mainly genuine ones). This is thanks to Merkel. However, that same council no longer has available housing and gives applicants several websites to apply for themselves.

New houses are not being built fast enough to meet the flood of housing demands. Rents in London have escalated. In many cases rents are above the average working wage.

The issue is that British citizens of any background should be equal in rights to EU migrants and given more consideration for housing.

Added to this the government is slashing expenditure on its local councils and council rates and taxes are set to increase next year.

BREXIT still remains in demand but it is doubtful if illegal immigration will be tackled. Teresa May was in charge of this for six years and did nothing. She did nothing about BREXIT until Trump gave her a bone (a trade deal). It will take in my estimate at least 5 years to leave the EU, costing billions of dollars in Euro-Mafia tribute payments while we are still in.

The EU advocates once claimed extremism would disappear for ever. In fact the EU has inadvertently wet-nursed all of these groups. Le Pen by the way has even been wooing Muslim voters

 

[DrZoidberg]

With elections coming up in Netherlands, France and Germany this year, watch the anti immigration politicos gain millions of votes. Ignoring the problem may be a sure way of political suicide.

While true, doesn't make the worries true

 

[Derec]

While true, doesn't make the worries true

It doesn't make them false either. You seem to be very oblivious to the threat of Islamic takeover of Europe by demographics. Both mass migration and huge birthrates (having 5-10 children is common among religious Muslims) will mean that Muslims will be majority in many places in Europe in a couple of decades. They already are a significant population percentage in many cities. Are you really ok with your country being run by Syrians, Afghans and Pakistanis rather than Swedes?

 

[Nice Squirrel]

While true, doesn't make the worries true

It doesn't make them false either. You seem to be very oblivious to the threat of Islamic takeover of Europe by demographics. Both mass migration and huge birthrates (having 5-10 children is common among religious Muslims) will mean that Muslims will be majority in many places in Europe in a couple of decades. They already are a significant population percentage in many cities. Are you really ok with your country being run by Syrians, Afghans and Pakistanis rather than Swedes?

Terror babies.

 

[DrZoidberg]

While true, doesn't make the worries true

It doesn't make them false either. You seem to be very oblivious to the threat of Islamic takeover of Europe by demographics. Both mass migration and huge birthrates (having 5-10 children is common among religious Muslims) will mean that Muslims will be majority in many places in Europe in a couple of decades. They already are a significant population percentage in many cities. Are you really ok with your country being run by Syrians, Afghans and Pakistanis rather than Swedes?

No, I am not oblivious to that particular insane conspiracy theory. You Sir are bonkers.

 

[bilby]

A brief century or two ago, the EXACT same argument was used to prove that the Irish were a menace who would turn England Catholic.

How's that coming along? Is Catholic dominated England overrun by Irishmen today?

Because the threat posed by Islam is now equally important, urgent, and worrying.

 

[Jayjay]

A brief century or two ago, the EXACT same argument was used to prove that the Irish were a menace who would turn England Catholic.

How's that coming along? Is Catholic dominated England overrun by Irishmen today?

Because the threat posed by Islam is now equally important, urgent, and worrying.

So what you are saying is that to avoid problems, Europe should treat muslims with the same kindness and acceptance that England has afforded to the Irish in the past 200 years or so?

 

[bilby]

A brief century or two ago, the EXACT same argument was used to prove that the Irish were a menace who would turn England Catholic.

How's that coming along? Is Catholic dominated England overrun by Irishmen today?

Because the threat posed by Islam is now equally important, urgent, and worrying.

So what you are saying is that to avoid problems, Europe should treat muslims with the same kindness and acceptance that England has afforded to the Irish in the past 200 years or so?

Sure, because that worked out so well for them, and nipped any idea of terrorism by Irish Nationalists in the bud.

 

[whichphilosophy]

A brief century or two ago, the EXACT same argument was used to prove that the Irish were a menace who would turn England Catholic.

How's that coming along? Is Catholic dominated England overrun by Irishmen today?

Because the threat posed by Islam is now equally important, urgent, and worrying.

Britain has always experienced immigration, when the Irish and others visited the UK there was work in abundance.
Compared to the levels of immigration today which are in unprecedented levels of immigration 100 years ago are negligible.

 

[Trausti]

People bring their cultures with them. The Europe we've know for the past half century will likely fade away.

 

[Trausti]

Seriously. This mass migration will probably destroy Western Europe.

http://d.repec.org/n?u=RePEc:mos:moswps:2016-04&r=gro

 

[angelo]

So what you are saying is that to avoid problems, Europe should treat muslims with the same kindness and acceptance that England has afforded to the Irish in the past 200 years or so?

Sure, because that worked out so well for them, and nipped any idea of terrorism by Irish Nationalists in the bud.

Irish don't follow an ideology that thinks Sharia superior to all other Western Cultures or Democratic ideology.