Merged Greenland is part of NATO via Denmark

[Jimmy Higgins]

They don't need boots on the ground to hurt the US. Just call in the bond debt. It would destroy our economy

That's not how US bonds work...

Yes it is, it is what people are saying about bonds today.

 

[bilby]

It's difficult to think of any economic sanction the EU (or EU+UK) could plausibly impose on the US, that would be noticably more damaging than the tarriffs and Trump has already imposed.

 

[DrZoidberg]

US must be well informed about EU critters phone conversations among themselves. So EU will not go against US.
Some people in Deep State are behind all of this, not just the Orange.
But I wish Denmark does all of that.

One need not eaves drop on telephone conversations to understand treaties and the text of alliance agreements. If Trump attacks Greenland then Nato's Article 5 kicks in.

Of course I wouldn't expect YOU to understand the concept of a country being expected to uphold their signed written agreements.

I think Trump is testing whether or not NATO has any resolve. It's clear that Trump has no respect for the EU or NATO. And there's nothing the European navies have that can stop USA. Trump knows it and Denmark knows it. If there's a fight it'll be the kind of fight Putin hoped Russia would have in Ukraine, but didn't. The biggest price will be that USA will be a pariah state and joins the Axis of Evil countries. But Trump may not care about that.

If there's a land war on European soil the European countries will most likely win against USA. But in the arctic... nope. Not a chance.

Land war in Europe? The US military isn't set up for a land war in Europe. It'd take a while to even mobilize the fight. And last time we did, the coastal areas were on the same side.

The US easily can take Greenland. But I imagine it'll be a scorched Earth maneuver. It'd be costly, deploying troops to occupy a small area isn't cheap, even if there is no violence. Losing health care will make the locals angry, something would happen. And in Congress, there would be a need to authorize spending for the occupation. That won't happen in the Senate. It'll be filibustered to the ground.

Trade relations will evaporate, Europe will turn to China. It'll isolate the US, which is exactly what Russia would love. Of course, if Europe turns to China, that isn't exactly in Russia's favor either, but unlike China, Russia doesn't have much of a forward focus. It is the only nation that looks to the future in the past.

Finally, just because the US military takes Greenland doesn't mean the US has Greenland. International law would get really weird if the part of the Government doesn't recognize the US owns Greenland.

I think it'll change things more radically than that. The rule of law and respecting international treaties would go away. The world would decend into world war again. It'll be a time machine back to the extremely unstable early 20'th century.

When the wars are over we'll see a new world order. Its anyones guess how that will look. But I think Europe has more fight in it than we're now given credit for. Its going to be a long and hard fight

I think it becomes so volatile, it'd actually be impossible to predict. Economic impacts would likely have unanticipated consequences, leading to strange bed fellows.

But it goes much more internal before we reach those points. The US military would have to invade Greenland first, as Greenland isn't trading health care for one time stipend. In order for the world order to collapse, the US's internal order needs to collapse. I'm uncertain about what the rule of law is and whether being ordered to aggressively occupy friendly territory being considered illegal. Does the military refuse to carry out the order? The US already has an agreement with Denmark to put bases ANYWHERE on the island, as long as it is done diplomatically. Do the higher ups say no, this isn't needed, this isn't legal. We could get exactly what we want without landing a single pair of feet on the island.

I have no idea how that goes down, if the military thinks twice at all or Trump ends up resigning because the GOP can't risk it anymore after he fires the entire Chiefs of Staff and Hegseth tries to run it all himself, of the myriad of possibilites.

What I don't understand is the moment Trump threatened Denmark militarily, why wasn't USA kicked out of Greenland? Why wasn't all US bases in Europe closed and the troops shipped home? You can't go around and threaten allies willy nilly. I understand that Europe wants US troops in Europe in case Russia attacks. But Trump has already communicated that he can't be trusted in this regard.

Europe/NATO needs to signal that USA can't behave like this diplomatically. Trumps statements on Greenland are completely unacceptable. I think.

I think I figured it out. The US troops in Europe are there to protect Europe from Russia. Its free soldiers. It'd just be dumb to kick them out. Especially now when there's an ongoing war in Europe

 

[Shadowy Man]

What I don't understand is the moment Trump threatened Denmark militarily, why wasn't USA kicked out of Greenland? Why wasn't all US bases in Europe closed and the troops shipped home?

The moment that USA got kicked out would be the moment Trump would invade. Perhaps they don’t want to give him the justification and still hope that either they solve it diplomatically or TACO kicks in.

 

[ideologyhunter]

It's absolutely incredible/insane/infuriating that we're discussing this. All because of one twisted demagogue who can't seem to get through a government function without nodding off and whose #1 response to detailed press questions has been "I don't know."
Lawrence O'Donnell has been stating that Trump will never invade, occupy, or buy Greenland, that it's all performative. I am usually impressed with O'Donnell's line of reasoning, but, consider where Trump has taken us in the past half year: he's sent National Guard troops into U.S. cities, and threatened more direct action by telling the generals that they may be using American cities as 'training grounds'; he defended the Navy for ordering the second strike to kill the survivors clinging to the wreckage of an alleged cartel boat; he invaded Venzuela to capture the Maduros. Add the June bombing mission to Iran. Trump feels no need to inform Congress of his plans, and as long as he has GOP majorities this will continue. His egomania is off the charts. He's breathing air that none of us are breathing -- he considers himself the most important figure in world history. He told his masses, "I am your justice...I am your retribution." He told us that God saved him to make America great again, and that "He who saves his country breaks no laws." Should any country play chicken with this lunatic?

 

[Elixir]

It's absolutely incredible/insane/infuriating that we're discussing this.

Amen.

But pity the poor toddler. He is between a rock and a hard place.
He is 100% OBLIGATED to put on a convincing show of declaring war on NATO for his boss Vlad, or the other shoe drops and he’s politically dead, and he goes to jail.

But if he does follow though on this Greenland nonsense, his “base” will weaken and his elected Republican toadies, now looking out for themselves, are almost certain to cave in to reason and turn on him to save their own hides before November. And he goes to jail.

He has to find a way to convince Uncle Vlad that he’s doing his best to kill NATO, while keeping his domestic toadies from abandoning the sinking ship. A near impossible assignment. But if he puts on a good enough show, maybe he can live out his days in splendor as Vlad’s guest.

This almost certainly doesn’t end well for The Felon, and is already ending terribly for America. Such a very sad situation.

 

[ZiprHead]

So the autopsy report is out. Good was alive for a period of time after she was shot. Denying her medical care is outrageous.

Gota link?

Nope. Heard it on the news this morning.

 

[barbos]

The idea of Trump fucking over NATO because he is compromised with Russia (economic or whatever else) verses he just does

For fuck's sake, let it go. Epstein could not compromise Trump and you want some mythical pee tape to compromise him?

I didn't bring that up. You did. As I said, Trump's actions relating to Russia has almost all benefited Russia, not the US.

Is there a law that states that all actions of US president must NOT benefit Russia?

 

[barbos]

It's absolutely incredible/insane/infuriating that we're discussing this. All because of one twisted demagogue

The idea of annexing Greenland was first expressed in the 1960s. And he is not alone now, there are people who put ideas in his head.

 

[barbos]

And now Putin essentially tells NATO to get the hell out of Eastern Europe (including Eastern Germany).
EU is searching for someone to talk to Putin.
They have Kaja Kallas but it's hard to imagine Putin will ever talk to her, and she is thinking about resuming drinking (national pastime in Estonia) Finnish President Alexander Stubb seems to be a front runner but he is not a huge improvement over Kallas.
Germany finally concluded that NordStream was blown up by a state actor, Ukraine? or USA? (it's USA)
EU is fucked.
I think what the current crop of clowns need to do is to ask US military out of Europe, cut Ukraine out completely and retire, all of them. Project "Occupy Russia" has failed spectacularly and EU needs to consolidate what they have and normalize relation with Russia with the hope that we will resume exporting gas to them.
Then there should be full normalization to a state where Russia (with Ukraine in it) would be unofficial member of EU.
This is not such a big price for not having Russia in full alliance with China. But don't expect using Russia against China.
All of that implies normalization with Iran too. Israel lobby in US would have to live with that.
EU will not survive without Russia and you are incapable to occupy Russia. Hence you have to live with what you've got.

 

[bilby]

And now Putin essentially tells NATO to get the hell out of Eastern Europe (including Eastern Germany).
EU is searching for someone to talk to Putin.
They have Kaja Kallas but it's hard to imagine Putin will ever talk to her, and she is thinking about resuming drinking (national pastime in Estonia) Finnish President Alexander Stubb seems to be a front runner but he is not a huge improvement over Kallas.
Germany finally concluded that NordStream was blown up by a state actor, Ukraine? or USA? (it's USA)
EU is fucked.
I think what the current crop of clowns need to do is to ask US military out of Europe, cut Ukraine out completely and retire, all of them. Project "Occupy Russia" has failed spectacularly and EU needs to consolidate what they have and normalize relation with Russia with the hope that we will resume exporting gas to them.
Then there should be full normalization to a state where Russia (with Ukraine in it) would be unofficial member of EU.
This is not such a big price for not having Russia in full alliance with China. But don't expect using Russia against China.
All of that implies normalization with Iran too. Israel lobby in US would have to live with that.
EU will not survive without Russia and you are incapable to occupy Russia. Hence you have to live with what you've got.

Have you consulted a neurologist? You appear to be struggling with forming coherent thoughts.

 

[barbos]

And now Putin essentially tells NATO to get the hell out of Eastern Europe (including Eastern Germany).
EU is searching for someone to talk to Putin.
They have Kaja Kallas but it's hard to imagine Putin will ever talk to her, and she is thinking about resuming drinking (national pastime in Estonia) Finnish President Alexander Stubb seems to be a front runner but he is not a huge improvement over Kallas.
Germany finally concluded that NordStream was blown up by a state actor, Ukraine? or USA? (it's USA)
EU is fucked.
I think what the current crop of clowns need to do is to ask US military out of Europe, cut Ukraine out completely and retire, all of them. Project "Occupy Russia" has failed spectacularly and EU needs to consolidate what they have and normalize relation with Russia with the hope that we will resume exporting gas to them.
Then there should be full normalization to a state where Russia (with Ukraine in it) would be unofficial member of EU.
This is not such a big price for not having Russia in full alliance with China. But don't expect using Russia against China.
All of that implies normalization with Iran too. Israel lobby in US would have to live with that.
EU will not survive without Russia and you are incapable to occupy Russia. Hence you have to live with what you've got.

Have you consulted a neurologist? You appear to be struggling with forming coherent thoughts.

Just did, he said I was fine but he wants to see you.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

This is not such a big price for not having Russia in full alliance with China. But don't expect using Russia against China.

ROTFLMFAO! Using Russia against China? Right now Canada is exploring trade options as Trump is fucking North America over because of cockroaches whispering into his ear. PM Carney ain't flying to Moscow.

You keep thinking Russia matters. Russia is a fucking joke. You dudes have been relying on way too much inertia of Cold War supremacy for decades. You have nothing to show for it. In that time, China transformed itself from a beleaguered third world nation into the global production powerhouse. If China wanted, they could take Taiwan, it'd just come at a very high cost. Russia, can't even take over Ukraine. The march to Kiiv was stymied with well pumps.

Russia is a troll nation that will enter a political arena and infect things, but never makes anything better. The only thing going for it at the moment is that Putin has Trump's ear for whatever reason.

Use Russia against China... who would so stupid to do that?

 

[barbos]

ROTFLMFAO! Using Russia against China?

Yes, that was your plan.

You keep thinking Russia matters

Your clearly have not got the memo or can't read german.

You dudes have been relying on way too much inertia of Cold War

I think you are projecting. It's you who is relying on outdated Cold War propaganda.

Russia, can't even take over Ukraine.

We will, we will.

Russia is a troll nation that will enter a political arena and infect things, but never makes anything better. The only thing going for it at the moment is that Putin has Trump's ear for whatever reason.

You need to update your material.

 

[unapologetic]

You are talking out of both dides of your mouth again:

Neither (US or Europe) is anywhere near losing it's position at the front of the pack.-

If you pay attention USA stopped leading the free world in 2022.

Has there been any news reporting of anyone in the military refusing an order yet?

Would the adverage soljer recognize an illeagle order? The secretary of defense war doesen't know or care.

They don't need boots on the ground to hurt the US. Just call in the bond debt. It would destroy our economy

That's not how US bonds work...

Months ago, when tarrifs were imposed on Canada, I read a news report that Canada sold off all it's US bonds. I didn't hear who bought them.
At the same time we lost our AA credit rating.

The US troops in Europe are there to protect Europe from Russia. Its free soldiers.

Europe can not rely on that. Rump could change their mission in his sleep.
Letting Putin invade the Ukraine shows a lack of such protection.

 

[unapologetic]

Operation: HANS OFF! Canada, France & Denmark Unite Against Trump​

 

[Elixir]

Operation: HANS OFF! Canada, France & Denmark Unite Against Trump​

“Delightful! Great job little Donny!”
- V Putin

 

[DrZoidberg]

You are talking out of both dides of your mouth again:

Neither (US or Europe) is anywhere near losing it's position at the front of the pack.-

If you pay attention USA stopped leading the free world in 2022.

Me expressing a bunch of hypotheses (which may contradict eachother) is hardly me talking both sides of my mouth.

My position in this thread, is that I don't understand wtf Trump is doing with wanting to anex Greenland.

That said, USA being an economic leader of the world is in no contradiction with USA being a hegemonic power.

If USA wants to be a world leading power they need to be reliable allies and uphold agreements. That's not going so well for USA, and has little to do with US economic power.

The UK never behaved as bad as USA is now doing, even at the height of their power. And because of that the UK has a lot of respect still.

Has there been any news reporting of anyone in the military refusing an order yet?

Would the adverage soljer recognize an illeagle order? The secretary of defense war doesen't know or care.

They don't need boots on the ground to hurt the US. Just call in the bond debt. It would destroy our economy

That's not how US bonds work...

Months ago, when tarrifs were imposed on Canada, I read a news report that Canada sold off all it's US bonds. I didn't hear who bought them.
At the same time we lost our AA credit rating.

The US troops in Europe are there to protect Europe from Russia. Its free soldiers.

Europe can not rely on that. Rump could change their mission in his sleep.
Letting Putin invade the Ukraine shows a lack of such protection.

Sure. But if US troops are already stationed in Europe, there's less of a hurdle to get USA embroiled I think

 

[crazyfingers]

So the stupid evil gangster piece of shit said that he will impose an additional 10% tariff on goods from Denmark, Norway, Sweden, France, Germany, the United Kingdom, the Netherlands, and Finland because they resist his desire to steal Greenland.

When will congress impeach and convict this fucker?

Trump says 8 European countries will face 10% tariff for opposing US control of Greenland

President Donald Trump says he'll impose a 10% import tax starting in February on goods from eight European nations because of their opposition to American control of Greenland.

apnews.com

 

[DrZoidberg]

So the stupid evil gangster piece of shit said that he will impose an additional 10% tariff on goods from Denmark, Norway, Sweden, France, Germany, the United Kingdom, the Netherlands, and Finland because they resist his desire to steal Greenland.

When will congress impeach and convict this fucker?

Trump says 8 European countries will face 10% tariff for opposing US control of Greenland

President Donald Trump says he'll impose a 10% import tax starting in February on goods from eight European nations because of their opposition to American control of Greenland.

apnews.com

Not soon enough