How should west respond to potential (likely) Russian invasion of Ukraine?

[barbos]

Did anyone tell the Bosnians or the Albanians?

They were not invaders, I was talking about Osmans

 

[barbos]

Your link says Russia was the aggressor.

Not in Crimea (GB/France were aggressors there) In other places technically yes, but in reality Russia was a liberator of oppressed christian population from Osman empire. Crimea was a russian land. Russia kicked muslim invaders out of Europe.

I see you are backtracking. This is effectively an admission you were the aggressor. "Liberating" is your standard pretext for war.

No, I am not backtracking again. GB and France invaded Crimea for no good reason other than to help Turks not to lose their possessions in Eastern Europe.

 

[barbos]

You realize Russia was the aggressor in the Crimean war?

No, I don't realize that, because it was not so.
Aggressor was GB and France.

And prior to that Russia expelled Turkish influence over the region and took control. Local "indigenous" population of crimean tatars lost their little slave business because of that.

You didn't get what you wanted with words so you resorted to attacking. You continue to consider countries doing things you don't like as aggressors. Reality is that the country that engages in an act of war is the aggressor. Normally that means shooting but it can be things like blockades.

What exactly are you talking about?
Fucking crimean tatars (along with their turkish masters) were constantly invading proper Russia and burning everything including Moscow.
Imaging Canadians doing that. What would you do? Of course Russia solved that problem by taking over Crimea. Katherine the Great who was german by the way did that.
By the time of 19 century Crimean War, Russia had been in control of Crimea for almost a hundred years. And then GB decided to invade. You were the invaders.


Now, we have regime in "Ukraine" which cause problem being an US puppet shitster. Russia is going to solve that problem.

 

[barbos]

In other news, Polish government admitted they had been lying for more than 10 years about 2010 presidential jet crash.
I don't know what game they are playing now. New Prime Minister Tusk is a bigger russophobe than previous one.
But I am glad that polish democracy finally admitted being filthy liars.
Maybe in 10 years US would admit they blew up NordStream and Putin was right about everything.

 

[barbos]

Péter Szijjártó talks how Nuland was trying to subvert Hungarian democracy in 2014 ordering changes
in Hungarian laws.

Ðлава ÐÐÐ ÐенгÑии ÑаÑÑказал об оÑкоÑблении в СШРÑо ÑÑоÑÐ¾Ð½Ñ ÐÑланд - ÐазеÑа.Ru | ÐовоÑÑи

ÐиниÑÑÑ Ð¸Ð½Ð¾ÑÑÑаннÑÑ Ð´ÐµÐ» ÐенгÑии ÐеÑÐµÑ Ð¡Ð¸Ð¹ÑÑÑо ÑаÑÑказал об Ñнижении на пÑиеме в 2014 Ð³Ð¾Ð´Ñ Ñо ÑÑоÑÐ¾Ð½Ñ Ð°Ð´Ð¼Ð¸Ð½Ð¸ÑÑÑаÑии СШÐ, когда ÐµÐ¼Ñ Ð¿ÑÑалиÑÑ Ð½Ð°Ð²ÑзаÑÑ Ð°Ð¼ÐµÑиканÑкие ÑÑловиÑ. Ðб ÑÑом ÑообÑÐ°ÐµÑ Mandiner .

www.gazeta.ru

And I and Victoria Nuland, who is now a deputy minister, and then was an assistant secretary of state, sat down at a small coffee table, and she threw me a two-page document,” Nuland said.

Among the specified conditions were demands to change the constitution, the law on media, church rules and other aspects of domestic policy. Then Nuland demanded that Szijjártó either accept the conditions of the United States, or there would be no conversation about bilateral cooperation. Szijjarto refused.

 

[barbos]

And speaking of "85% of the russian army being dead" BS.
Looks like, US "intelligence" indeed repeats what Kiev Bobs are telling them.
It was "declassified" in the attempt to ease up voting for $60bil for Ukro-Fuhrer, did not work.
Nobody with more than half a brain believes that number. But we can estimate that this is what Ukrainian forces lost.
Kiev Bobs simply reverse numbers. So yeah, we now have people estimating ukrainian losses 300-700K.

When shit finally hits the fan (as it did in Vietnam and recently in Afghanistan) US will blame everything on Ukrainians.
They will simply say "They told us these numbers and we believed them, what ca we do?"

 

[barbos]

Some brits are smelling shit coming from Ursula von der Hitler.
Which is ironic, since british government are one of the most enthusiastic russia haters.
I think the worry is misplaced cause UK does not really have land army.
Maybe in the future when Ursula von der Hitler reinstates draft in UK.

 

[bilby]

Did anyone tell the Bosnians or the Albanians?

They were not invaders, I was talking about Osmans

The South African wholesaler? Or the spice traders? Or the presenter of the BBC's House of Games?

I don't think any of them are Muslim, nor were they removed from Europe by the Russians, as far as I am aware.

 

[bilby]

constantly invading proper Russia and burning everything including Moscow.
Imaging Canadians doing that.

The Canadians DID invade the USA, and they burned down the Whitehouse, along with a good part of Washington DC, on 24th of August 1814.

Don't they teach you anything in Russia?

 

[Patooka]

Don't they teach you anything in Russia?

Everything you need to know about Victoria Nuland, because for some reason barbos thinks she's mega important in global politics.

But that's about it.

 

[bilby]

UK does not really have land army.

That's what the Germans thought in 1914.

The 'Old Contemptibles' of the original BEF were so effective with their Lee Enfields that the German units who encountered them thought they were equipped with machine guns. But they weren't.

The British Army has, perforce, always valued quality over quantity. The Russian Army has always been the opposite. Which is why they're such constant losers. They only beat Hitler because they finally got some decent trucks and supplies from the Americans and the British. And they still wasted vast numbers of soldiers lives in the process, because like all Russian leaders from the Tsars to Putin, Stalin couldn't care less how many ordinary Russians died for his aggrandisment.

When are the Russian people going to wake up and stop sacrificing their lives for rulers of indifferent attitude and indifferent abilities?

 

[barbos]

constantly invading proper Russia and burning everything including Moscow.
Imaging Canadians doing that.

The Canadians DID invade the USA, and they burned down the Whitehouse, along with a good part of Washington DC, on 24th of August 1814.

Don't they teach you anything in Russia?

I knew that, but they don't tech that in Russia.
So what did US do?

 

[barbos]

Did anyone tell the Bosnians or the Albanians?

They were not invaders, I was talking about Osmans

The South African wholesaler? Or the spice traders? Or the presenter of the BBC's House of Games?

I don't think any of them are Muslim, nor were they removed from Europe by the Russians, as far as I am aware.

Russia liberated Ester Europe from Osman Empire.

 

[barbos]

That's what the Germans thought in 1914.

US "saved" France from Germany in 1914.
and no, UK does not currently have a land army worthy of notice.

 

[ZiprHead]

Did anyone tell the Bosnians or the Albanians?

They were not invaders, I was talking about Osmans

 

[zorq]

Péter Szijjártó talks how Nuland was trying to subvert Hungarian democracy in 2014 ordering changes
in Hungarian laws.

Ðлава ÐÐÐ ÐенгÑии ÑаÑÑказал об оÑкоÑблении в СШРÑо ÑÑоÑÐ¾Ð½Ñ ÐÑланд - ÐазеÑа.Ru | ÐовоÑÑи

ÐиниÑÑÑ Ð¸Ð½Ð¾ÑÑÑаннÑÑ Ð´ÐµÐ» ÐенгÑии ÐеÑÐµÑ Ð¡Ð¸Ð¹ÑÑÑо ÑаÑÑказал об Ñнижении на пÑиеме в 2014 Ð³Ð¾Ð´Ñ Ñо ÑÑоÑÐ¾Ð½Ñ Ð°Ð´Ð¼Ð¸Ð½Ð¸ÑÑÑаÑии СШÐ, когда ÐµÐ¼Ñ Ð¿ÑÑалиÑÑ Ð½Ð°Ð²ÑзаÑÑ Ð°Ð¼ÐµÑиканÑкие ÑÑловиÑ. Ðб ÑÑом ÑообÑÐ°ÐµÑ Mandiner .

www.gazeta.ru

And I and Victoria Nuland, who is now a deputy minister, and then was an assistant secretary of state, sat down at a small coffee table, and she threw me a two-page document,” Nuland said.

Among the specified conditions were demands to change the constitution, the law on media, church rules and other aspects of domestic policy. Then Nuland demanded that Szijjártó either accept the conditions of the United States, or there would be no conversation about bilateral cooperation. Szijjarto refused.

This critique of Nuland tells me that you and the weird Russia propaganda web author you cited have no understanding of what a diplomat does.

For a little context, Szijjártó is merely one of Viktor Orban's liutennants and says whatever his master tells him to say. And Orban has a weird grudge against Zelinsky and Ukraine and likes to suck up to Putin. But about diplomats...

Diplomats represent their own country's interests. Democracies like the US value the peace and prosperity that comes with a world filled with other democracies. So when a country like Hungary (under Orban) starts sliding into authoritarian shittyness, a country like the US might offer a nice incentive for the shitty country to clean up that shittyness. In this case, the offer of bilateral cooperation was rejected because Orban likes being an authoritarian shithead who controls and manipulates Hungary's media and he likes baking Religion inspired bigotry into the Hungary's constitution. That doesn't mean that Nuland was "interfering" in Hungary's democracy though. Similarly, I am not actually interfereing with a shoplifter when I offer them a free discount if they agree to pay for the candy they hid in their pocket.

It sounds like Nuland was merely doing her job of trying to encourage a bad actor to clean up their act before they slide down that slippery slope to become full blown corrupt authoritarian shithole like Russia. Because, as you know, corrupt authoritarian shitholes like Russia are all too happy to use violence against their own people and their neighbors for shitty reasons like greed and bigotry and power. That makes a big headache for countries lead by people who care about life, and liberty, and happiness for all people (not just billionaires.)

.

 

[bilby]

That's what the Germans thought in 1914.

US "saved" France from Germany in 1914.
and no, UK does not currently have a land army worthy of notice.

The UK saved France from Germany in 1914. The US didn't even enter the war until April 1917.

 

[DrZoidberg]

It was the height of the age of empire. Everybody who could was just grabbing whatever. The Ottoman empire was falling apart. The Brits, French and Russians, all wanted to take over parts of the Ottoman empire.

No,

Crimean War - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Yes

 

[Elixir]

That's what the Germans thought in 1914.

US "saved" France from Germany in 1914.
and no, UK does not currently have a land army worthy of notice.

The UK saved France from Germany in 1914. The US didn't even enter the war until April 1917.

But in the AFU (Alternate Facts Universe) the UK saved France from Germany in 1914.
IME it doesn’t pay to try to tease delusion away from mendacity here.

 

[bilby]

I'm no military historian. But I've never heard of a truly religious war.

Well, that depends what you mean by "truly". Religious wars usually have (or rapidly develop) some secular objectives, so purely religious (or for that matter, purely anything) wars are rare.

But if, for example, the Bishops Wars of 1639 and '40, between England (ruled by King Charles I), and Scotland (also ruled by King Charles I), wasn't a "truly religious war", then I don't know what could be.

The Covenanters sole objective, and reason for fighting against their king, was to prevent his imposition of a common religious practice across both of his kingdoms. They weren't even fighting to remain Protestant; Just over the details of how their Protestantism should be organised, and what rituals, hymns, and prayers would be permitted in the Kirk.