January 6 Hearings Live

[SLD]

I keep wondering what would’ve happened had Pence gone along with Trump? If it had been thrown into the House (which I’m not sure how he could’ve done that) then each state would have had a vote. But for Trump to win he’d have to have almost perfect party loyalty. Would Lynn Cheney, the sole representative from Wyoming have gone along with this? A few other Republicans in key swing states? Gonzalez in Ohio? I wonder if it would’ve worked?

I think the idea was to have results overturned only in states which he lost.
That's what Jim Jordan message to Meadows says.

But it would’ve thrown the election in to the House, where each state has one vote.

Why?

That was the whole point of the exercise. if enough states were thrown out then no one would have a majority. They weren't giving the states to Trump. Trump still needed 270. So once no one had a majority, the House decides.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

I keep wondering what would’ve happened had Pence gone along with Trump? If it had been thrown into the House (which I’m not sure how he could’ve done that) then each state would have had a vote. But for Trump to win he’d have to have almost perfect party loyalty. Would Lynn Cheney, the sole representative from Wyoming have gone along with this? A few other Republicans in key swing states? Gonzalez in Ohio? I wonder if it would’ve worked?

I think the idea was to have results overturned only in states which he lost.
That's what Jim Jordan message to Meadows says.

But it would’ve thrown the election in to the House, where each state has one vote.

Why?

Constitution. The plan was to make it so neither Biden or Trump had a majority of EVs (by ax'ing away at states Biden won), which is required to be declared the winner of the Presidency (and vice presidency). Then it goes to the House and the EVs no longer matter. Then it is state v state. Team with the most states wins the White House.

What happened in November 2020 isn't supposed to happen, and hasn't happened in 140 or so years, but back then there were real electoral election issues regarding voter suppression. It isn't supposed to be so easy to try and throw out an election's results. Ultimately, McConnell had control, and he kept the hands on the wheel. He would have been necessary to overthrow the election.

 

[Keith&Co.]

Two longtime conservative Fox News commentators have resigned in protest of what they call a pattern of incendiary and fabricated claims by the network's opinion hosts in support of former President Donald Trump.

In separate interviews with NPR, Stephen Hayes and Jonah Goldberg pointed to a breaking point this month: network star Tucker Carlson's three-part series on the Jan. 6 siege of the U.S. Capitol, which relied on fabrications and conspiracy theories to exonerate the Trump supporters who participated in the attack.

"It's basically saying that the Biden regime is coming after half the country and this is the War on Terror 2.0," Goldberg tells NPR. "It traffics in all manner of innuendo and conspiracy theories that I think legitimately could lead to violence. That for me, and for Steve, was the last straw."

Hayes has been a close friend of Fox News political anchor Bret Baier since their college days at DePauw University; both he and Goldberg were mainstays of Baier's Special Report after joining the network in 2009. Together, Hayes and Goldberg co-founded the conservative news site The Dispatch.


According to five people with direct knowledge, the resignations reflect larger tumult within Fox News over Carlson's series Patriot Purge and his increasingly strident stances, and over the network's willingness to let its opinion stars make false, paranoid claims against President Biden, his administration and his supporters.

And the FOX responseis, "How dare they rrad our emails!"

Some9ne shoots a black kid, the media wants his arrest record whether or not any charge in it is connected to the shooting.
But participate in an actual crime, reveal knowledge of the key players, znd it's back to Trump's "find the leak!" distraxtion...

 

[barbos]

I keep wondering what would’ve happened had Pence gone along with Trump? If it had been thrown into the House (which I’m not sure how he could’ve done that) then each state would have had a vote. But for Trump to win he’d have to have almost perfect party loyalty. Would Lynn Cheney, the sole representative from Wyoming have gone along with this? A few other Republicans in key swing states? Gonzalez in Ohio? I wonder if it would’ve worked?

I think the idea was to have results overturned only in states which he lost.
That's what Jim Jordan message to Meadows says.

But it would’ve thrown the election in to the House, where each state has one vote.

Why?

Constitution. The plan was to make it so neither Biden or Trump had a majority of EVs (by ax'ing away at states Biden won), which is required to be declared the winner of the Presidency (and vice presidency). Then it goes to the House and the EVs no longer matter. Then it is state v state. Team with the most states wins the White House.

What happened in November 2020 isn't supposed to happen, and hasn't happened in 140 or so years, but back then there were real electoral election issues regarding voter suppression. It isn't supposed to be so easy to try and throw out an election's results. Ultimately, McConnell had control, and he kept the hands on the wheel. He would have been necessary to overthrow the election.

US House of representatives or Senate?
State houses or senates? I still think they wanted to declare some states result illegitimate and keep the rest.

 

[Swammerdami]

What happened in November 2020 isn't supposed to happen, and hasn't happened in 140 or so years, but back then there were real electoral election issues regarding voter suppression. It isn't supposed to be so easy to try and throw out an election's results. Ultimately, McConnell had control, and he kept the hands on the wheel. He would have been necessary to overthrow the election.

US House of representatives or Senate?
State houses or senates? I still think they wanted to declare some states result illegitimate and keep the rest.

If nobody receives 270 electoral votes, the Presidential election is turned over to the U.S. House of Reps, which chooses, one vote per state, among the three top electoral vote getters. It is the newly elected House, in this case the 117th Congress of the United States which votes.

It's not clear to me what happens in case of a tie, which is actually quite likely. I suppose the House keeps casting ballots until someone gets a plurality^* or until the Inauguration deadline is reached. In the latter case, the Presidency is filled by the newly elected Vice President, if any.

The Vice President, assuming no candidate gets 270 votes, is chosen by the Senate, one vote per Senator, between the two highest VP electoral vote-getters.

Note that Georgia did not certify the election of its two Senators until January 19, 13 days after the Congress passed its judgment on the Electoral College submission, and one day before the Inauguration of President. (Presumably Georgia would have delayed this certification further in the hypothetical.) So the GOP controlled the 117th Senate 50-48 prior to the Inauguration.

The most recent time such a "contingent election" has occurred was in 1836, and that was just for the Vice Presidency, Martin van Buren winning a majority of EV's for President despite the Whigs running four different candidates in four different regions hoping to engineer a contingent election.

One of the most interesting Presidential Elections occurred in 1876. Samuel J. Tilden, Democrat, won 51% of the popular vote and, possibly, a majority of the electoral vote but, as in 2021, some of these results were in dispute. A compromise was reached: Rutherford B. Hayes was named President in return for his promise to remove the remaining federal troops from states which had been in rebellion 12 years before. "Some black Republicans felt betrayed as they lost their power in the South that had been propped up by the federal military, and by 1905 most blacks were effectively disenfranchised by the now-democratically elected state legislatures in every Southern state."

* - The use of plurality to denote "the largest number of votes" is marked by some dictionaries as a USA-ism:

plu·ral·i·ty
/plo͝oˈralədē/
noun: plurality; plural noun: pluralities

1.
the fact or state of being plural.

2.
US
the number of votes cast for a candidate who receives more than any other but does not receive an absolute majority.

 

[SLD]

What happened in November 2020 isn't supposed to happen, and hasn't happened in 140 or so years, but back then there were real electoral election issues regarding voter suppression. It isn't supposed to be so easy to try and throw out an election's results. Ultimately, McConnell had control, and he kept the hands on the wheel. He would have been necessary to overthrow the election.

US House of representatives or Senate?
State houses or senates? I still think they wanted to declare some states result illegitimate and keep the rest.

If nobody receives 270 electoral votes, the Presidential election is turned over to the U.S. House of Reps, which chooses, one vote per state, among the three top electoral vote getters. It is the newly elected House, in this case the 117th Congress of the United States which votes.

It's not clear to me what happens in case of a tie, which is actually quite likely. I suppose the House keeps casting ballots until someone gets a plurality^* or until the Inauguration deadline is reached. In the latter case, the Presidency is filled by the newly elected Vice President, if any.

The Vice President, assuming no candidate gets 270 votes, is chosen by the Senate, one vote per Senator, between the two highest VP electoral vote-getters.

Note that Georgia did not certify the election of its two Senators until January 19, 13 days after the Congress passed its judgment on the Electoral College submission, and one day before the Inauguration of President. (Presumably Georgia would have delayed this certification further in the hypothetical.) So the GOP controlled the 117th Senate 50-48 prior to the Inauguration.

The most recent time such a "contingent election" has occurred was in 1836, and that was just for the Vice Presidency, Martin van Buren winning a majority of EV's for President despite the Whigs running four different candidates in four different regions hoping to engineer a contingent election.

One of the most interesting Presidential Elections occurred in 1876. Samuel J. Tilden, Democrat, won 51% of the popular vote and, possibly, a majority of the electoral vote but, as in 2021, some of these results were in dispute. A compromise was reached: Rutherford B. Hayes was named President in return for his promise to remove the remaining federal troops from states which had been in rebellion 12 years before. "Some black Republicans felt betrayed as they lost their power in the South that had been propped up by the federal military, and by 1905 most blacks were effectively disenfranchised by the now-democratically elected state legislatures in every Southern state."

* - The use of plurality to denote "the largest number of votes" is marked by some dictionaries as a USA-ism:

plu·ral·i·ty
/plo͝oˈralədē/
noun: plurality; plural noun: pluralities

1.
the fact or state of being plural.

2.
US
the number of votes cast for a candidate who receives more than any other but does not receive an absolute majority.

Thanks! Exactly correct. My original question is what would really have happened in such a scenario? Wyoming would be under the vote of one person, Lynn Cheney. Would she really have gone along with what was obviously a coup attempt? She hates Trump. Same with Gonzalez in Ohio. Both voted to impeach the bastard. But that was after the coup. If Pence had gone along with the plan, there’d be no need for Trump to order the Capitol to be stormed. So would they have gone along and voted for Trump in such a scenario? I think it may have been a bridge too far for them and possibly other Republicans. The whole scheme was an obviously Machiavellian plot to usurp the electoral will of the people. Many Republican Senators, including McConnell and Graham didn’t go along with it either from the get go.

I fear that may be different next time around.

 

[SLD]

And now there’s this story. Three generals warn that the military is as divided as the country, and the 2024 could trigger a serious crisis in the ranks. This is frightening. I really hope Trump is dead by 2024.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

We’re fucked. The “socialists” campaigning by the GOP in FL was super successful and it is everywhere now. Socialist Joe Biden.

 

[barbos]

If nobody receives 270 electoral votes, the Presidential election is turned over to the U.S. House of Reps, which chooses, one vote per state, among the three top electoral vote getters. It is the newly elected House, in this case the 117th Congress of the United States which votes

What if there are more than one representative in the state?
For example 2 - one democrat and one piece of shit?

 

[lpetrich]

The entire delegation then decides on what its vote will be.

 

[barbos]

The entire delegation then decides on what its vote will be.

What if it splits between humans and trumpers?

Anyway, that scenario is for normal elections where no one got 270, for example 3 candidates. What Rick Perry suggested in his message to Meadow was State Senates sending alternate slate of electors and then going to SCOTUS if necessary.

 

[lpetrich]

January 6 committee to ask telecommunications companies to preserve phone records of members of Congress who participated in 'Stop the Steal' rally - CNNPolitics

According to the sources, this group was targeted because the committee concluded each of these lawmakers played some role in the "Stop the Steal" rally. They either attended, spoke, actively planned or encouraged people to attend.

The list is said to be evolving and could be added to as the investigation steps up. As of now it includes Republican Reps. Lauren Boebert of Colorado, Marjorie Taylor Greene of Georgia, Jim Jordan of Ohio, Andy Biggs of Arizona, Paul Gosar also of Arizona, Mo Brooks of Alabama, Madison Cawthorn of North Carolina, Matt Gaetz of Florida, Louie Gohmert of Texas, Jody Hice of Georgia and Scott Perry of Pennsylvania.

In addition to their connection to the rally, this group also represents some of former Trump's most loyal supporters in Congress, many of whom continue to peddle Trump's false claims about the 2020 election. Many of these members also voted to object to the election results on the day of the insurrection.

Good choices. Lauren Boebert acted like a 5th columnist during the attacks -- what else was she in on?

‘Stop the Steal’ founder told Jan. 6 committee about contacts with GOP lawmakers - POLITICO

Ali Alexander, who founded the pro-Trump “Stop the Steal” movement and attended the rally that preceded the Capitol attack, told congressional investigators that he recalls “a few phone conversations” with Rep. Paul Gosar and a text exchange with Rep. Mo Brooks about his efforts in the run-up to Jan. 6, his lawyers confirmed in a late Friday court filing.

Alexander also told the Jan. 6 House select committee that he spoke to Rep. Andy Biggs (R-Ariz.) in person “and never by phone, to the best of his recollection,” his lawyers say.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

And now there’s this story. Three generals warn that the military is as divided as the country, and the 2024 could trigger a serious crisis in the ranks. This is frightening. I really hope Trump is dead by 2024.

Satan, please call him home!

 

[lpetrich]

Hugo Lowell on Twitter: "Jan. 6 committee member Adam Kinzinger says on ABC’s This Week they have more incriminating messages involving the Trump White House: “There are more texts out there that we haven’t released.”" / Twitter

Marjorie Taylor Greene perversely says Trump texts show he shoulders no blame in Capitol riot | The Independent

Georgia Republican Representative Marjorie Taylor Greene has said that the text messages sent to Trump White House Chief of Staff Mark Meadows during the 6 January Capitol riot urging him to get then-President Donald Trump to call off his supporters prove that Mr Trump is innocent of any wrongdoing in connection to the riot.

...
“I think the text messages just completely show that President Trump is innocent,” Ms Greene told right-wing network OAN on Tuesday. “All of us are innocent. The riot shouldn’t have happened and we were all against it just like we’ve said all along.”

The Hill on Twitter: "Rep. Marjorie Taylor Greene: "I rise in opposition to this resolution to hold Mark Meadows in contempt of Congress because it's being held by nothing but a kangaroo court. Congress' job is to make laws, not enforce them." (vid link)" / Twitter

 

[TLK Valentine]

And the FOX responseis, "How dare they rrad our emails!"

Of course, if they didn't want their messages read, they shouldn't have shared them with a White House stooge.

 

[WAB]

And the FOX responseis, "How dare they rrad our emails!"

Of course, if they didn't want their messages read, they shouldn't have shared them with a White House stooge.

And the FOX responseis, "How dare they rrad our emails!"

Of course, if they didn't want their messages read, they shouldn't have shared them with a White House stooge.

Your signature is a perfect example of ignorance, Valentine.

"May we think of freedom, not as the right to do as we please, but as the opportunity to do what is right." -- Peter Marshall (1902-1949)

Lol! No, no, no, Mr. Marshall. Freedom is the right to do as we please, within the limits of the law of the state, and within the limits of natural law.

Who decides what is "right", Mr. Marshall? You? Well of course. And that presumed and delusional privilege is at the heart of your theory. But what happens if I decide that you are not capable of determining what is "right"? What happens if I or someone else determines that what you think is "right", is actually terribly, terribly wrong?

Lol!

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

Hugo Lowell on Twitter: "Jan. 6 committee member Adam Kinzinger says on ABC’s This Week they have more incriminating messages involving the Trump White House: “There are more texts out there that we haven’t released.”" / Twitter

Marjorie Taylor Greene perversely says Trump texts show he shoulders no blame in Capitol riot | The Independent

Georgia Republican Representative Marjorie Taylor Greene has said that the text messages sent to Trump White House Chief of Staff Mark Meadows during the 6 January Capitol riot urging him to get then-President Donald Trump to call off his supporters prove that Mr Trump is innocent of any wrongdoing in connection to the riot.

...
“I think the text messages just completely show that President Trump is innocent,” Ms Greene told right-wing network OAN on Tuesday. “All of us are innocent. The riot shouldn’t have happened and we were all against it just like we’ve said all along.”

The Hill on Twitter: "Rep. Marjorie Taylor Greene: "I rise in opposition to this resolution to hold Mark Meadows in contempt of Congress because it's being held by nothing but a kangaroo court. Congress' job is to make laws, not enforce them." (vid link)" / Twitter

So it is a "riot" right now. So in another 72 hours it'll become an Antifa conspiracy... then a few bad apples, then Pelosi responsible, back to a riot that shouldn't have happened...

 

[SLD]

The entire delegation then decides on what its vote will be.

What if it splits between humans and trumpers?

Anyway, that scenario is for normal elections where no one got 270, for example 3 candidates. What Rick Perry suggested in his message to Meadow was State Senates sending alternate slate of electors and then going to SCOTUS if necessary.

It would be redone until someone has 26 states. But that’s my question, even if the delegation is Republican or split, that doesn’t mean that each delegate would be loyal to party. If Lynn Cheney and Gonzalez, who voted for impeachment, didn’t toe the party line, they might have given it back to Biden. Trump’s plan may not have worked regardless.

 

[barbos]

The entire delegation then decides on what its vote will be.

What if it splits between humans and trumpers?

Anyway, that scenario is for normal elections where no one got 270, for example 3 candidates. What Rick Perry suggested in his message to Meadow was State Senates sending alternate slate of electors and then going to SCOTUS if necessary.

It would be redone until someone has 26 states. But that’s my question, even if the delegation is Republican or split, that doesn’t mean that each delegate would be loyal to party. If Lynn Cheney and Gonzalez, who voted for impeachment, didn’t toe the party line, they might have given it back to Biden. Trump’s plan may not have worked regardless.

True, but that was not their plan.

 

[ZiprHead]

Ex-Police Captain Indicted for Holding Man at Gunpoint Under False Belief That 'Hispanic Children' Signed 750,000 Fake Ballots

A former police captain with the Houston Police Department was indicted on Tuesday for allegedly holding an innocent AC repairman at gunpoint over a baseless voter fraud claim that Hispanic children were signing ballots. Mark Anthony Aguirre, 64, faces a count of aggravated assault with a deadly...

lawandcrime.com

A former police captain with the Houston Police Department was indicted on Tuesday for allegedly holding an innocent AC repairman at gunpoint over a baseless voter fraud claim that Hispanic children were signing ballots. Mark Anthony Aguirre, 64, faces a count of aggravated assault with a deadly weapon, records show.

“According to Aguirre, he had been conducting surveillance on the victim for four days under a theory the victim was the mastermind of a giant fraud, and there were 750,000 fraudulent ballots in a truck he was driving,” the Office of the Harris County District Attorney said. “Instead, the victim turned out to be an innocent and ordinary air conditioner repairman.”

Aguirre rammed his SUV into the back of the victim’s truck to force him to stop in the Oct. 19, 2020 incident, prosecutors said. The repairman stepped out, but Aguirre pointed a gun at him, forced him to the ground, and put a knee on the man’s back, authorities said.

There were no ballots in the truck — only air conditioning parts and tools, the D.A.’s office said.

Aguirre got $266,400 from the right-wing group Liberty Center for God and Country to do his work, authorities said.