January 6 Hearings Live

[Jimmy Higgins]

JR wants to abolish the Electoral College because it involves some procedures that are vulnerable to sabotage, like the choosing of electors and the counting of votes. Sabotage like what some of Trump's supporters planned for 2021 January 6.

I want the electoral college removed because it's undemocratic.

The electoral college does have an advantage -- there's no need for a runoff election, and no way a losing candidate can demand a nationwide recount. Imagine the chaos if that wasn't the case!

I'd propose a compromise -- keep the electoral college, but require every state to split their electoral votes in the same way that Maine and Nebraska do, so that the electoral votes more closely reflect the popular vote.

You mean allow states to take advantage of gerrymandered redistricting and apply it to the Electoral College?!

 

[Elixir]

The electoral college does have an advantage -- there's no need for a runoff election, and no way a losing candidate can demand a nationwide recount. Imagine the chaos if that wasn't the case!

Uh. Trump the Loser demanded all that and more.

 

[TLK Valentine]

JR wants to abolish the Electoral College because it involves some procedures that are vulnerable to sabotage, like the choosing of electors and the counting of votes. Sabotage like what some of Trump's supporters planned for 2021 January 6.

I want the electoral college removed because it's undemocratic.

The electoral college does have an advantage -- there's no need for a runoff election, and no way a losing candidate can demand a nationwide recount. Imagine the chaos if that wasn't the case!

I'd propose a compromise -- keep the electoral college, but require every state to split their electoral votes in the same way that Maine and Nebraska do, so that the electoral votes more closely reflect the popular vote.

You mean allow states to take advantage of gerrymandered redistricting and apply it to the Electoral College?!

It's a risk, but the alternative is worse:

Imagine that a candidate who happens to be a narcissistic megalomaniac (we'll call him "Donald" strictly for the sake of argument) loses the popular vote and insists that he's been cheated. How long would the nationwide recount that Donald would demand actually take? How about the second one he would demand? The third?

The electoral votes would be divided according to the statewide popular vote; there's no way to change those numbers. The Congressional districts can be used to determine which electors vote for whom, but the numbers must be reflective of the statewide totals, or the feds will hear about it.

 

[TLK Valentine]

The electoral college does have an advantage -- there's no need for a runoff election, and no way a losing candidate can demand a nationwide recount. Imagine the chaos if that wasn't the case!

Uh. Trump the Loser demanded all that and more.

And he didn't get it. Instead, he was laughed out of one state court after another, giving us all some much needed hilarity following a tense election.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

JR wants to abolish the Electoral College because it involves some procedures that are vulnerable to sabotage, like the choosing of electors and the counting of votes. Sabotage like what some of Trump's supporters planned for 2021 January 6.

I want the electoral college removed because it's undemocratic.

The electoral college does have an advantage -- there's no need for a runoff election, and no way a losing candidate can demand a nationwide recount. Imagine the chaos if that wasn't the case!

I'd propose a compromise -- keep the electoral college, but require every state to split their electoral votes in the same way that Maine and Nebraska do, so that the electoral votes more closely reflect the popular vote.

You mean allow states to take advantage of gerrymandered redistricting and apply it to the Electoral College?!

It's a risk, but the alternative is worse:

It isn't a risk, it is already done!

Imagine that a candidate who happens to be a narcissistic megalomaniac (we'll call him "Donald" strictly for the sake of argument) loses the popular vote and insists that he's been cheated. How long would the nationwide recount that Donald would demand actually take? How about the second one he would demand? The third?

The electoral votes would be divided according to the statewide popular vote; there's no way to change those numbers. The Congressional districts can be used to determine which electors vote for whom, but the numbers must be reflective of the statewide totals, or the feds will hear about it.

You could in theory have made it easier to cheat, as the GOP would have the EVs guaranteed and simply look in smaller pockets of closer districts to pluck EVs from.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

Now we are learning how DC centralized the organization for the fake electors scheme (gifted) was. Not only did it come from DC, it was thoroughly vetted by the Trump campaign lawyers and advisors, with some suggesting it'd be tough to pull off based on state law requirements. Ultimately, Eastman declared the mere existence of the second slate of electors was enough to put it into question in the US Congress, regardless if one slate wasn't remotely certified or even created legally.

At the time, the gatherings seemed a slapdash, desperate attempt to mimic President Donald Trump’s refusal to concede.

But internal campaign emails and memos reveal that the convening of the fake electors appeared to be a much more concerted strategy, intended to give Vice President Mike Pence a reason to declare the outcome of the election was somehow in doubt on Jan. 6, 2021, when he was to preside over the congressional counting of the electoral college votes.

They knew the election wasn't stolen, they knew fake electors weren't legitimate, but they moved forward with it anyway, to steal an election.

 

[jonatha]

JR wants to abolish the Electoral College because it involves some procedures that are vulnerable to sabotage, like the choosing of electors and the counting of votes. Sabotage like what some of Trump's supporters planned for 2021 January 6.

I want the electoral college removed because it's undemocratic.

The electoral college does have an advantage -- there's no need for a runoff election, and no way a losing candidate can demand a nationwide recount. Imagine the chaos if that wasn't the case!

I'd propose a compromise -- keep the electoral college, but require every state to split their electoral votes in the same way that Maine and Nebraska do, so that the electoral votes more closely reflect the popular vote.

IIRC no historical Presidential election would have changed had this system been in place.

(I still like it, but only if there's a constitutionally mandated algorithm for redistricting to eliminate political gerrymandering...)

 

[Harry Bosch]

Now we are learning how DC centralized the organization for the fake electors scheme (gifted) was. Not only did it come from DC, it was thoroughly vetted by the Trump campaign lawyers and advisors, with some suggesting it'd be tough to pull off based on state law requirements. Ultimately, Eastman declared the mere existence of the second slate of electors was enough to put it into question in the US Congress, regardless if one slate wasn't remotely certified or even created legally.

At the time, the gatherings seemed a slapdash, desperate attempt to mimic President Donald Trump’s refusal to concede.

But internal campaign emails and memos reveal that the convening of the fake electors appeared to be a much more concerted strategy, intended to give Vice President Mike Pence a reason to declare the outcome of the election was somehow in doubt on Jan. 6, 2021, when he was to preside over the congressional counting of the electoral college votes.

They knew the election wasn't stolen, they knew fake electors weren't legitimate, but they moved forward with it anyway, to steal an election.

Correct. To steal an election. It was also a great fund raiser for Trump. He scammed over 250 million from his followers to fight the election outcome.

 

[Gun Nut]

I'll admit I find Ivanka quite attractive, and Lauren Boebert too. But I know they possess very black hearts. I have no desire to get anywhere near those two.

Yeah. What's inside is far more important than what's outside.

I find her repulsive outside BECAUSE I have a notion of what is inside. I'm not Jack Black in Shallow Hal, but she is such a piece of garbage that it is impossible for me to see her as desirable in any way.

 

[Ford]

I'll admit I find Ivanka quite attractive, and Lauren Boebert too. But I know they possess very black hearts. I have no desire to get anywhere near those two.

Yeah. What's inside is far more important than what's outside.

I find her repulsive outside BECAUSE I have a notion of what is inside. I'm not Jack Black in Shallow Hal, but she is such a piece of garbage that it is impossible for me to see her as desirable in any way.

Boebert? I look at her and wonder if she actually made any real money as an "escort." She reminds me of someone I worked with at the store a couple years ago during the pandemic. I found out that she made money on the side with her "Only Fans" page, and I thought "okay...I guess some guys are into that." She eventually left (or was fired) and wound up doing that full-time with her tweaker boyfriend, but I digress...

When we last left the hearings, we learned that Eastman basically said "I don't care if it's illegal and unconstitutional...can't we do it anyway?" I suspect there will be more along the same lines today, and the right will respond with "but maybe we should be more concerned about the price at the pump?"

 

[southernhybrid]

I just watched the SOS of Arizona testify. He did an excellent job of describing how Trump, Eastman, and I think a few others asked him to change the results of the election by sending in a different set of electors. He asked them for evidence. They kept saying there was evidence of fraud and dead people voting but they never provided any evidence. He kept telling them that it would be illegal for him to do what they were asking and he intended to do what his roll as SOS demanded. He even mentioned his religious faith, proclaiming something like it would be wrong to go against God, by lying etc Too bad the other Christian Republicans don't follow the teachings of their Good Book, when it comes to lying.

He mentioned that he and his family have been targets of repeated threats etc. It got so bad at one point, that they couldn't work do to all of the interruptions.

It's sad that so many people still believe Trump's lies. Still, it good to see one more honest Republican, as they are so rare these days.

Now, the SOS chief operating officer of Georgia is testifying. Gotta go watch him.

 

[southernhybrid]

Georgia SOS in on the stand now. They are playing the phone calls from Trump. He literally threatened the SOS and his lawyer, with claims that they knew they were counting illegal votes. I had not heard some of these calls before. They were worse than I previously thought. I just wish Republicans would watch these hearings. Trump claims he won Georgia by over 400,000 votes. WTF!

 

[southernhybrid]

Now, an election worker in Fulton County is on the stand. She is talking about all of the threats she received from Trump and his supporters. They even threatened her and her mother with prison. Many of the threats were very racist. She was scared and felt as if she was a failure. Her mother also testified and she still feels very nervous and frightened by what transpired. The FBI told the two women that they needed to leave their home until after the inauguration for heir own safety. This is so outrageous. I do wonder how difficult it will be to find election workers in Fulton County this fall.

I think that probably pretty much sums up today's hearing, assuming the two women are the final witnesses for today. I had no idea that these women were directly threatened by Trump. It's all been recorded. How can anyone still support this horrible man is beyond me!

 

[Cheerful Charlie]

Next hearing will be Thursday, June 23 at 1 PM EST. I had to dig 5 minutes through Google to find that.

 

[Toni]

Ivanka looked gorgeous, as usual. She's a terrible human being and a stain on our history, but in her testimony recording, she looked even more beautiful than usual.

… in an unusually creepy way

The word everyone is searching for is unreal.

 

[steve_bank]

After today it is undeniable there was a conspiracy of many with Trump at the top to take over the governemt.

As bay boomer born into an optimistic American culture it s disheartening. It s disheartening to see the scope of the comspirtocy and how high the conspirators are in the system.

Thankully they were inept eld by an inept Trump, the system held, and there were enough republican true patriots who said no that made a differnce

 

[Toni]

The threats were also directed against the election workers mother and grandmother…,

Extremely upsetting to hear of the personal threats directed towards the family if the AZ SOS while their daughter was dying in their home! And against not only election workers but their elderly mother/grandmother.

 

[Artemus]

The CNN summary includes

After Michigan State Senate Majority Leader Mike Shirkey, a Republican, told Trump that he would not break the law to keep Trump in office, he said Trump posted Shirkey’s personal phone number for his millions of followers on Facebook, urging them to contact him and demand he decertify Michigan’s election results.

This and the Georgia phone call are critical because there is absolutely no way to deny that Trump was directly involved. (Can't claim "rogue attorneys freelancing.) How can these be interpreted as anything other than conspiracy to defraud the United States of America???

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

He was caught making with quid quo pro'ing it with the Ukrainian leader. And well.. *sigh*

Truth doesn't matter with Trump. He creates these alternate realities that have this terrible tendency of sticking... regardless how fake they are.

 

[Patooka]

Truth doesn't matter with Trump. He creates these alternate realities that have this terrible tendency of sticking... regardless how fake they are.

I suspect Trump is a symptom and not a cause. Say 3% of Americans are not just Trump supporters, but also believe in his style of playing politics as completely legitimate. And when I say believe, I mean fanatically. That's nearly 10 million dedicated highly motivated disciples who want to see their way come into being whatever it takes. Trump didn't create this, he was simply the first Republican to say the quiet part out loud and tap into that group.

Which means unfortunately, no matter what the outcome of this committee is, this will happen again. Going after Trump is very much like arresting the bomber and leaving all the explosives behind with the front door unlocked.