Mar-a-Largo raided by FBI?

[Ford]

When someone actually goes to jail for something I will accept that as more than just an allegation.

Spare me. You're still having difficulty believing Trump lost the 2020 election or the Jan 6 insurrection wasn't an antifa false flag operation. I have complete confidence in your ability to find some far right deep state bullshit that exonerates Trump. In fact, I'm looking forward to it.

Incidentally, Hillary never went to jail either. Why are you using a different standard towards her?

Just in case anyone has forgotten, the entire "Lock Her Up!" thing was a scam to dupe the gullible rubes. In four years in office - with hand-picked attorneys general and FBI directors - Trump never tried to pin so much as a parking ticket on Hillary. He did have the half-hearted (and half-assed) Durham investigation, but all his boasting about "Crooked Hillary" and investigating the "Rusher Hoax" was all bullshit.

Sad thing is, there are people who still believe he tried, but that "the Deep State" stymied his efforts.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

Trump lacks curiosity and can barely read, and it is highly improbable that he would have collected this vast horde of material so he could read them later at his leisure. Given the volume of the material recovered to date (50 boxes or more), this was clearly not a decision he made on the night before his departure from the White House - he must have been accumulating these documents over an extended period of time. That suggests premeditation.

Most of those boxes probably are not classified. The warrant was for classified material and anything found with it.

I do agree he took them for potential value, though--I'm sure he couldn't understand them.

 

[Elixir]

When someone actually goes to jail for something I will accept that as more than just an allegation.

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!

*deep breath*

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!

Spare me. You're still having difficulty believing Trump lost the 2020 election or the Jan 6 insurrection wasn't an antifa false flag operation. I have complete confidence in your ability to find some far right deep state bullshit that exonerates Trump. In fact, I'm looking forward to it.

Incidentally, Hillary never went to jail either. Why are you using a different standard towards her?

When you (RW ext) lack evidence to get a conviction, you lock ‘em up.
But if you HAVE evidence, it’s another story; you have to argue it in court. It’s tantamount to a large fine that goes into lawyers’ pockets. The more evidence, the more argument. If the charged party goes free because they die of old age during the arguments, c’est la vie/mort. Republican justice.
Lawn order. BINGOZZY!!

 

[Elixir]

I do not believe democracy can withstand voters (the ones at that point who can still vote) voters who have no stake and are more less nothing more than pheasents.

I agree. It would take forever to train those birds to operate the corrupt voting machines.
OTOH, their eventual choices would almost certainly be better than those made by Republitards.

 

[Patooka]

So let's see if I've got this right;

The raid, which was done because Trump's lawyers lied about no classified documents being stored at Mar-a-largo, is a witch hunt because the documents weren't classified, but even if they were they were planted by the FBI, but even if there is no footage of this Trump saw it all happen on CCTV, but even so he had no idea what was in those boxes anyway because apparently the US General Services Administration packed those boxes, which really doesn't matter because according to Rand Paul storing classified material near the pool in the shed is simply exercising your First Amendment Rights.

Which doesn't really matter because the documents are protected by attorney-client privilege.

Now I know why Q-tards are comparing the FBI to Nazis. You have to be on Heisenberg quality meth to think that's a coherent argument.

 

[Toni]

No, it won't.

The claim by Trump's attorney sounds more like throwing Trump's less astute followers a bone.

"This isn't about national security. It's all about keeping Trump from running for president in 2024."
Tom

Yes. Yes it is.

Trump should be kept as far away as possible from any classified documents, because national security. If all he did was gather up (or have his staff gather up) some documents and put them in a store room at his resort, that would be a national security risk the likes of which hasn't been seen since...um...when was the last time boxes of highly classified documents critical to national security were taken to an unlocked store room in the clubhouse of a golf resort?

It reminds me of my ex mother in law's second husband. Like Trump, he was old and unpleasant. Unlike Trump, he was a recovered raging alcoholic. Before he came over to visit, my ex mother in law (mother outlaw?) implored us to remove any and all alcoholic beverages from our house whether it was a couple beers in the fridge or cooking wine, because he couldn't even be in the presence of alcohol. Was he going to get up out of his wheelchair and fight us over that Bud Light in the fridge? Maybe not...but in any case it was a threat to his exceedingly fragile sobriety, so we complied.

This is like that, but instead of booze, it's the military, intelligence, and nuclear capabilities of the most powerful country on the planet that need to be kept from the unpleasant old man.

But the exact same argument was made about HRC and her emails. One side swears she couldn't be trusted with government data but the other sweared she was getting the raw business over it because of politics.

And there are a couple more data points which still can not be argued around politically. Trump has not yet so far launched any nuclear weapons or given away their secrets to North Korea. And HRC never had the opportunity to do so.

First of all, it is faulty reasoning to consider Hillary Clinton’s email server on par with Trump’s theft of classified documents, some of which are top secret/sensitive enough that they cannot be described without revealing too much info. This is like comparing missing curfew by five minutes to mass murder. I’m really not exaggerating here.

We have no idea what Trump has shared or with whom, whether copies have been made or whether the security of the US and frankly the world has been offered for sale to curry favor or as a big FU to the US for failing to re-elect him or to allow his little coup to succeed.

You are not actually stupid and you are older than 12. As upsetting as you might find it that Trump did not win, please accept that defeat with some version of grace and open your eyes and recognize the grave danger he has put the entire world in. The works is a far, far more dangerous place because Donald Trump was elected as POTUS. We may not survive this. By we, I mean the entire world. It’s really that serious.

 

[bilby]

Trump has not yet so far launched any nuclear weapons or given away their secrets to North Korea.

How do you know?

In fact, how would HE know?

Once you store secret materials in an unsecure location, you cannot possibly know who might have gotten hold of them.

Is it so very unlikely that DPRK might have a spy or spies at (or passing through) Mar a Lago? The place is a fucking golf resort. The only 'clearance' needed to access it is a big wad of cash and some seriously ugly (but expensive) clothing.

Trump could have given away secrets to North Korea, and not even realise that he did.

Or, of course, he could have been fully aware that he was doing it.

Either way, it's a serious crime.

 

[Ford]

No, it won't.

The claim by Trump's attorney sounds more like throwing Trump's less astute followers a bone.

"This isn't about national security. It's all about keeping Trump from running for president in 2024."
Tom

Yes. Yes it is.

Trump should be kept as far away as possible from any classified documents, because national security. If all he did was gather up (or have his staff gather up) some documents and put them in a store room at his resort, that would be a national security risk the likes of which hasn't been seen since...um...when was the last time boxes of highly classified documents critical to national security were taken to an unlocked store room in the clubhouse of a golf resort?

It reminds me of my ex mother in law's second husband. Like Trump, he was old and unpleasant. Unlike Trump, he was a recovered raging alcoholic. Before he came over to visit, my ex mother in law (mother outlaw?) implored us to remove any and all alcoholic beverages from our house whether it was a couple beers in the fridge or cooking wine, because he couldn't even be in the presence of alcohol. Was he going to get up out of his wheelchair and fight us over that Bud Light in the fridge? Maybe not...but in any case it was a threat to his exceedingly fragile sobriety, so we complied.

This is like that, but instead of booze, it's the military, intelligence, and nuclear capabilities of the most powerful country on the planet that need to be kept from the unpleasant old man.

But the exact same argument was made about HRC and her emails. One side swears she couldn't be trusted with government data but the other sweared she was getting the raw business over it because of politics.

And there are a couple more data points which still can not be argued around politically. Trump has not yet so far launched any nuclear weapons or given away their secrets to North Korea. And HRC never had the opportunity to do so.

First of all, it is faulty reasoning to consider Hillary Clinton’s email server on par with Trump’s theft of classified documents, some of which are top secret/sensitive enough that they cannot be described without revealing too much info. This is like comparing missing curfew by five minutes to mass murder. I’m really not exaggerating here.

We have no idea what Trump has shared or with whom, whether copies have been made or whether the security of the US and frankly the world has been offered for sale to curry favor or as a big FU to the US for failing to re-elect him or to allow his little coup to succeed.

You are not actually stupid and you are older than 12. As upsetting as you might find it that Trump did not win, please accept that defeat with some version of grace and open your eyes and recognize the grave danger he has put the entire world in. The works is a far, far more dangerous place because Donald Trump was elected as POTUS. We may not survive this. By we, I mean the entire world. It’s really that serious.

Hillary's situation was thoroughly investigated and while it was found that she was irresponsible, there was nothing that rose to the level of a crime. Trump's house was searched in pursuit of evidence of multiple crimes including possible espionage.

Furthermore, Clinton's house was not open to guests, the material was as secure as could be expected, and again, no wrongdoing was found.

What's more, we know that Trump has already given classified information to foreign nationals while in the White House, had private unrecorded meetings with Russian spies, showed off classified documents at a dinner with the Chinese president while at his resort, and a Chinese spy was arrested there.

Butter emails? Seriously?

 

[Swammerdami]

Another side of this story. Assuming you are even opened minded enough to read any it. https://www.paulcraigroberts.org/2022/08/13/the-democrat-police-state-imposes-its-tyranny/

I was open-minded enough to click and read any of it.

Now, ask yourself how these charges could have been known prior to the seizure of the documents that allegedly are the evidence, documents to which the FBI had previous access but no interest in? Whatever documents needed to sustain the charges will be faked and inserted into the seized boxes.

Because the wimp Mitch McConnell Republicans let the Democrats openly steal the last election, being too fearful of a partisan media to make a fuss, the Democrats currently control the Executive Branch and its military, police, and prosecutorial agencies, the Senate, and the House, and the media serves as the Propaganda Ministry for the frame-up of President Trump. We are now witnessing and experiencing a bold open coup to establish a one-party state.

But I guess I wasn't "open-minded" enough to read past this.

@ RVonse — Do you endorse the comments quoted?

No proof of either of those just allegations. You are part of the problem.

What do you think of the allegations just quoted from paulcraigroberts.org? Is he part of the solution?

 

[Swammerdami]

Remember the old joke:

Dog bites man. That's not news.
Man bites dog. That would be news.​

That joke will need to be revised.

Well, someone just crashed their car into a barricade near the capital in DC. Got out of his car and started firing a weapon. Then he killed himself.

This story seemed interesting so I went to Google News. Not in the headlines. I typed "Washington" into the Search box. Still no hit. Google did have the story, but it was such an ordinary sort of event these days it took very specific search terms to find.

Crazed Trumpist tries to kill his Congressman and ends up as cop-assisted suicide. That's not news.
Crazed Trumpist tries to kill his Congressman and is able to actually articulate a purpose. That would be news.​

 

[Ford]

paulcraigroberts.org said:


Because the wimp Mitch McConnell Republicans let the Democrats openly steal the last election, being too fearful of a partisan media to make a fuss, the Democrats currently control the Executive Branch and its military, police, and prosecutorial agencies, the Senate, and the House, and the media serves as the Propaganda Ministry for the frame-up of President Trump. We are now witnessing and experiencing a bold open coup to establish a one-party state.

(emphasis added)

Um...what?

What do we know about Mitch? Well, aside from the fact that he may be a half-turtle, he is very much about maintaining power. Specifically political power. Folks will remember when he held up an Obama Supreme Court pick for almost a year simply because he wanted to be able to fill that seat with his hand-picked choice if the GOP got the White House back in 2016. Mitch - turtle or not - is a political animal.

So is this idiot telling us that Mitch "I kept Garland off the bench to own the libs" McConnell has all the necessary evidence that could have stopped the Democrats from "stealing" the 2020 election? But wait...there's more! You wanna talk power? If he had the ability to (in Trump's words) "Stop the Steal," then he could not only have kept Trump in office (or returned him when the legal dust settled), but McConnell, McCarthy, and the rest of the GOP leadership could have easily used all that "proof" that the Democrats tried to "openly steal the election" to (here comes some much needed emphasis) utterly destroy the Democratic Party as a political force in the United States.

They could easily present all this "evidence," probably land the leaders of this "plot" in jail, and for probably the next decade or even generation paint the Democrats as "the Party of Voter Fraud" or the "Party that Tried to Overthrow Democracy Itself." Scare words like "liberal" or "socialist" or even "woke" would be secondary or maybe even irrelevant, because they could hammer the Democrats with the undeniable "proof of massive voter fraud" at every turn and make it so that Nancy Pelosi couldn't get elected dog catcher in Berkeley. They'd splash it on every TV, radio, and internet ad for years, send out flyers every election cycle, and make it so that the GOP would become the permanent majority party for at least a generation.

Yet Mitch the Power-mad Turtle didn't do that. He settled meekly into minority status (which he hates more than...minorities, probably) and even came out to denounce the claims of "massive voter fraud" as false. Why did he shrink into his shell rather than splashing all this "proof" of the Democrats' attempt to "steal" the election on every platform and put his party into power forever?

Because he knows - and so do all the Republican "establishment" leaders - that all the claims of "massive voter fraud" are bullshit. If they had the proof from the get-go, they'd have brought it out long before the electoral votes were even cast, and if they "discovered" fraud subsequently they'd have brought the proof hard and fast sometime in the past 18 months.

"Yeah, but what about the media?!"

Hey paulcraigdumbfuck.org...you know the Republican Party has media, right? In fact they've got the mainstreamest of all the mainstream media in their back pocket: Fox News. The number one cable news outlet by a long shot that just happens to be owned by one of the biggest mainstream media conglomerates on the planet. Furthermore - and I say this as a former employee of two of the biggest mainstream media companies in America - "the media" you have paranoid delusions about cares about exactly two things: Ratings and Revenue.

"The Democrats Stole The Election And There's Undeniable Proof" would be the biggest media story in American history, and CNN, MSNBC, CBS, ABC, and other legacy outfits like the New York Times and Washington Post would splash that scoop on an endless loop (hey, I'm rhyming!) for as long as the advertising dollars kept flowing. They'd dance around the flaming ruins of the Democratic Party in a heartbeat if it would make their revenue spike, because at the end of the day these companies are all about the money.

Now...what were we talking about? Oh yeah...the fact that Donald Trump took "homework" to Mar-A-Largo so he could study up on it for a job he was no longer going to fucking have.


p.s. Hey Mitch...don't you wish now you'd have let Garland at least get a hearing? How's that working out for ya, champ?

 

[Elixir]

For all the spoon feeding we have afforded the right wing morons on this forum, none of them seems to have digested any of it.
It's as if Mangoman told them that up is down, the sky is green and Hillary is under their bed -
AND THEY STILL BELIEVE IT!

 

[RVonse]

What do you think of the allegations just quoted from paulcraigroberts.org? Is he part of the solution?

What he said is not likely but can not be completely dismissed like you would prefer either. None of us can know what really happened without having been there ourselves, all we can infer is a probability based on our own judgement. And although I believe Roberts version of events is a low probability it is still a probability greater than zero IMO.

 

[starwater]

Trump may also have something on Rand Paul and is using him as a pawn.

 

[RVonse]

Trump has not yet so far launched any nuclear weapons or given away their secrets to North Korea.

How do you know?

In fact, how would HE know?

Once you store secret materials in an unsecure location, you cannot possibly know who might have gotten hold of them.

Is it so very unlikely that DPRK might have a spy or spies at (or passing through) Mar a Lago? The place is a fucking golf resort. The only 'clearance' needed to access it is a big wad of cash and some seriously ugly (but expensive) clothing.

Trump could have given away secrets to North Korea, and not even realise that he did.

Or, of course, he could have been fully aware that he was doing it.

Either way, it's a serious crime.

That is a good point well taken. And if really guilty of this deserves whatever justice comes his way.

 

[Jarhyn]

Trump may also have something on Rand Paul and is using him as a pawn.

So, Rand Paul stumping against the espionage act specifically as an act of espionage, committed a long the most common lines on which espionage happens (blackmail/extortion escalation and the Sunk Cost fallacy).

It would be a violation of the espionage act to stump against the espionage act on behalf of someone for whom there can be no good faith as to whether they are doing things for the sake of espionage.

if really guilty of this

The guy had boxes of classified documents. They were there. They were found. The documents found were classified and the classification forbids storing them where they were found, and forbids declassification prior to copy-removal of classification markings. I worked in an Intel office, with classified information. This is common knowledge to anyone with so much as a SECRET clearance.

Trump is undeniably guilty. You can stop hedging your language. You can stop pretending it is in any way a question.

It is a fact of nature that Trump had the documents where Trump had the documents when Trump had the documents.

It does not matter why he had them.

It matters how he had them: through illegal removal from secured places.

It matters THAT he had them. And he did.

There is NO question.

There might be some courtroom politics over the matter, but there is no reason in all the rhetorical lands of good faith for doubt here.

 

[Swammerdami]

Now, ask yourself how these charges could have been known prior to the seizure of the documents that allegedly are the evidence, documents to which the FBI had previous access but no interest in? Whatever documents needed to sustain the charges will be faked and inserted into the seized boxes.

Because the wimp Mitch McConnell Republicans let the Democrats openly steal the last election, being too fearful of a partisan media to make a fuss, the Democrats currently control the Executive Branch and its military, police, and prosecutorial agencies, the Senate, and the House, and the media serves as the Propaganda Ministry for the frame-up of President Trump. We are now witnessing and experiencing a bold open coup to establish a one-party state.

What about "to which the FBI had previous access but no interest in"? Wasn't this the first FBI visit to Mar-a-Lago?

BTW, since when are Republioturds too fearful to make a fuss?

What do you think of the allegations just quoted from paulcraigroberts.org? Is he part of the solution?

What he said is not likely but can not be completely dismissed like you would prefer either. None of us can know what really happened without having been there ourselves, all we can infer is a probability based on our own judgement. And although I believe Roberts version of events is a low probability it is still a probability greater than zero IMO.

"Can not be completely dismissed"? The Ds openly stole the election? Can Hillary's sex slaves in the pizzeria basement be dismissed yet? Is Bill Gates putting nanobots in the vaccines? Can we dismiss the idea that the Chinese or the Jews can reroute hurrricanes with their space lasers? Just Asking Questions.

Much of the Ilk gets all their Truth from Trump. Is he your preferred information source as well?

 

[RVonse]

Now, ask yourself how these charges could have been known prior to the seizure of the documents that allegedly are the evidence, documents to which the FBI had previous access but no interest in? Whatever documents needed to sustain the charges will be faked and inserted into the seized boxes.

Because the wimp Mitch McConnell Republicans let the Democrats openly steal the last election, being too fearful of a partisan media to make a fuss, the Democrats currently control the Executive Branch and its military, police, and prosecutorial agencies, the Senate, and the House, and the media serves as the Propaganda Ministry for the frame-up of President Trump. We are now witnessing and experiencing a bold open coup to establish a one-party state.

What about "to which the FBI had previous access but no interest in"? Wasn't this the first FBI visit to Mar-a-Lago?

BTW, since when are Republioturds too fearful to make a fuss?

What do you think of the allegations just quoted from paulcraigroberts.org? Is he part of the solution?

What he said is not likely but can not be completely dismissed like you would prefer either. None of us can know what really happened without having been there ourselves, all we can infer is a probability based on our own judgement. And although I believe Roberts version of events is a low probability it is still a probability greater than zero IMO.

"Can not be completely dismissed"? The Ds openly stole the election? Can Hillary's sex slaves in the pizzeria basement be dismissed yet? Is Bill Gates putting nanobots in the vaccines? Can we dismiss the idea that the Chinese or the Jews can reroute hurrricanes with their space lasers? Just Asking Questions.

Much of the Ilk gets all their Truth from Trump. Is he your preferred information source as well?

As far as I know, Roberts has never made any claims regarding pizzeria, Bill Gates, or Chinese space lasers. But since you brought these up, yes those would justify an extreme lower probability approaching dismissal.... still probably greater than the existance of Big Foot though.

As far as the alleged stealing of the election, I have said in the past and still would say today that the Democrats should have litigated that in court instead of dissmissing it like they did (like you are dissmissing Roberts). Trumpsters could have seen the evidence for themselves, would have seen the Democrats were not hiding anything if it would have been investigated. But it is what it is at this point.

 

[laughing dog]

Now, ask yourself how these charges could have been known prior to the seizure of the documents that allegedly are the evidence, documents to which the FBI had previous access but no interest in? Whatever documents needed to sustain the charges will be faked and inserted into the seized boxes.

Because the wimp Mitch McConnell Republicans let the Democrats openly steal the last election, being too fearful of a partisan media to make a fuss, the Democrats currently control the Executive Branch and its military, police, and prosecutorial agencies, the Senate, and the House, and the media serves as the Propaganda Ministry for the frame-up of President Trump. We are now witnessing and experiencing a bold open coup to establish a one-party state.

The delusional "election was stolen" tinfoil conspiracy theory should destroy whatever little credibility Mr. Roberts once had.

 

[ZiprHead]