starwater
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It is wrong to do so, disrespectful, lacking respect and dignity.
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Moved Medical school admissions and race - was: VP pick
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To denote the thread has been moved
Shadowy Man
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And so it tells you something interesting about society that it is so “commonly used”. Especially when “boy” does not seem as commonly used for young adult men.
Whites are only under-represented because of the over-representation of Asians, while Blacks and Hispanics are even more under-represented. Whites are actually over-represented relative to Blacks and Hispanics. There are 4.6 times as many whites compared to blacks in the US, but there are 5.2 times as many whites in med school. Similarly, there are 3.07 times as many whites as Hispanics in the US, but 6.4 times as many whites in med school.
And Toni's reference to the unqualified whites is because their average MCAT CPBS score is lower than Asians, and that difference is in fact highly statistically significant at p < .0001.
Blacks are highly under represented among med students and doctors. This is a problem, because there is evidence that black patients have superior health outcomes when treated by black doctors. There are multiple factors for that, one being that a black doctor is more likely to be familiar with the typical lives of black people, and understanding of a patient is important. Even infant mortality rates are impacted.
Another factor is that black people often have a distrust of the medical community for very rational reasons, they have been abused by highly unethical practices in medicine and medical research. The most famous but far from only example being the Tuskegee study (which was still happening into the 1970's). where poor black men were promised free medical care for being in a study, but were not told they had syphilis and were given fake treatments so their disease went untreated while they assumed they didn't need to see any other doctors because they were getting care already. It is no mystery why black men were selected to be deceived in order to examine long term effects of untreated syphilis. The extreme lack of ethics in that research is what led to the creation of the national internal ethics review board system that now must approve all research on human subjects.
And yes, black people know about it, surveys show 80% of blacks know about Tuskegee, and it has contributed to a culture of distrust. Evidence suggests that such distrust is somewhat lessened when blacks are treated by a black doctor, which lead patients to disclose more personal information to their doctor and follow doctor advice.
https://www.aamc.org/news/do-black-... we say that if,of physician and patient race.
That all matters for this med school issue, because it is highly plausible that the health benefits of having more black doctors outweigh any impact of lower entrance exam scores on the quality of the doctors post med school. And improving actual health outcomes of people is the most important basis for med school admissions decisions.
Another factor is that black people often have a distrust of the medical community for very rational reasons, they have been abused by highly unethical practices in medicine and medical research. The most famous but far from only example being the Tuskegee study (which was still happening into the 1970's). where poor black men were promised free medical care for being in a study, but were not told they had syphilis and were given fake treatments so their disease went untreated while they assumed they didn't need to see any other doctors because they were getting care already. It is no mystery why black men were selected to be deceived in order to examine long term effects of untreated syphilis. The extreme lack of ethics in that research is what led to the creation of the national internal ethics review board system that now must approve all research on human subjects.
And yes, black people know about it, surveys show 80% of blacks know about Tuskegee, and it has contributed to a culture of distrust. Evidence suggests that such distrust is somewhat lessened when blacks are treated by a black doctor, which lead patients to disclose more personal information to their doctor and follow doctor advice.
https://www.aamc.org/news/do-black-... we say that if,of physician and patient race.
That all matters for this med school issue, because it is highly plausible that the health benefits of having more black doctors outweigh any impact of lower entrance exam scores on the quality of the doctors post med school. And improving actual health outcomes of people is the most important basis for med school admissions decisions.
thebeave
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The Golden Girls and That Girl would like to have a word with you.
Jimmy Higgins
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TomC
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Yeah, I was definitely dating myself when I liked the post.
Oh well, get off my lawn! I'm busy yelling at clouds.
Tom
Derec
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Derec
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The Left just loves to police language in most weird of ways ...
That is not true.
These two studies do control for pretty much all other possible confounders, and still show that black people have better health outcomes when treated by black doctors.
The first one focuses on infant mortality. For many reasons black infants have higher mortality rates than whites. But when black mothers and their infants are treated by black doctors, the infant mortality rate difference is cut in half. They control for insurance provider, which hospital, time of year, and the 65 most prevalent predictors of infant mortality.
The second study is a longitudinal study over 10 years examining 1600 different US counties for the life expectancy and mortality rate differences between whites and blacks in those counties (every county in the USA with at least a single black PCP).
"Between-county influence results indicated that greater Black workforce representation was associated with higher life expectancy and was inversely associated with all-cause Black mortality and mortality rate disparities between Black and White individuals."
"Black workforce representation" was measured by dividing the % of PCP in a country who are black by the % of residents of that county who are black (so equal representation among PCPs and the population would be 1.0.
In addition to controlling for difference in total number of doctors, they controlled for all the following: rural or urban designation, percentage living under the poverty threshold, percentage of uninsured individuals, median age, percentage who identified as Hispanic, ratio of men per women, percentage with less than a high school degree, median home value, unemployment percentage, percentage of Medicare-enrolled individuals, age-adjusted percentage of adult tobacco smokers, percentage of adults with obesity, average daily density of fine particulate matter (air pollution), and number of hospital beds.
Also, since they are also comparing within-county differences between whites and blacks, that eliminates between county confounds for those analyses.
They not only observe that counties with higher black representation among PCPs have better health outcomes for blacks and reduce the outcome gap between blacks and whites within the same county, but that in years when a county saw an increase in black representation, mortality for blacks went down, then back up when that representation declined again.
In addition to this strong evidence of better health outcomes for blacks with access to black doctors, see my post above on this page about the evidence that black patients who have access to black doctors are more willing to seek medical care, honestly disclose to their doctor, and follow doctor advice. This is a result of both general culturally widespread white supremacy that leads to their distrust, and also the long and recent history of abhorrently unethical (nazi-like) experimentation on blacks causing the pain and death (with Tuskegee being just one example).
laughing dog
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My mother (who no one would have thought was part of "the Left") took being called a "girl" as an insult back in the 1980s. But hey, you keep doing you.
starwater
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Shadowy Man
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So, you think the Right doesn’t police language? Or only in “not weird” ways?
Toni
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Speaking from personal experience, your suppositions are absolutely incorrect. Data does not support your 'guess' either.
Toni
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Girl is commonly used between friends who are women. In other people's mouths, it is demeaning and insulting and intended as such.
Don2 (Don1 Revised)
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...says the guy who flipped out when Trayvon Martin's mother called him her child.
A person has some choices when people gently tell them that certain language is demeaning and disrespectful.
- They can realize for the first time that their words make people feel demeaned and disrespected, and respond with a desire to stop being someone who disrespects and demeans, and decide to change their language, since that is free and easy when one wants to,
- They can realize the first time and try to change, yet keep making mistakes, but each time be genuinely contrite and say so, and slowly get better over time,
- They can realize for the first time, but think that being someone who is disrespectful and demeaning is less bad than putting in effort and therefore continue it, continuing to carelessly demean and disrespect,
- They can be utterly stumped by the idea and truly not have any understanding of what’s going on and thereafter be confused and hurt by why everyone seems to “get on their case” about it
- They can realize for the first time and quickly decide that respecting people who are women has no value and thence continue to use the words whenever they feel like it because they don’t care about the consequences,
- This group will usually come up with a bunch of edge cases that they think give them permission to continue using the words without censure, because they think of women as a monolith anyway, so if one woman wants it, all women want it, thereby showing themselves to be someone who despises and blames women for all that is wrong in their world, instead of just accepting that they hate women and becoming gay.
- They can realize that it is disrepectful and demeaning and revel in this power, throwing it around as often as possible to feast on the discomfort of their listeners
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Figure 11. Percentage of U.S. medical school matriculants planning to practice in an underserved area by race/ethnicity, academic year 2018-2019
Figure 11 displays the percentage of 2018-2019 matriculants planning to practice in an underserved area by race/ethnicity.www.aamc.org
And I also do not think that justifies discriminating against white and Asian students. Regardless of one's declarations when applying to med school, where one works depends on how many jobs are open in certain areas. You can't hire a physician at Bumfuck Medical Center unless that position exists and is funded. And if it exists and is funded, somebody will be hired for it. Sure, most people will apply in desirable urban areas, more than positions are available, and those that don't get hired will apply elsewhere. Whether or not they indicated desire to work in Bumfuck.
The goal of medical schools is not to make you feel warm and fuzzy about a delusional belief that the USA is or ever has been anything resembling a meritocracy. They exist to ensure that the public is being optimally served by medical professionals, and that means the whole public. Bumfuck USA and poor areas of almost all cities have a dangerous shortage of doctors that is costing health and lives. And it is yet another of the countless ways that blacks are fucked by the still continuing long term impact of centuries of violent oppression, not just informally, but written into law up through most of the 20th century, into the lifetimes everyone over 60 and the parents or grandparents of almost every American alive today.
If allowing more blacks into med school with slightly lower admission scores increases doctors in those underserved areas, then it is not only okay, by an ethical requirement of med schools to do so.
In addition, there is the fact supported by strong evidence (see my recent posts) that black doctors in particular are able to provide superior medical care to black patients from infancy through end of life. And black doctors are massively under-represented (far more than white doctors). So, that also justifies admitting black students with slightly lower scores.
Finally, note that the prior stats I presented about your original data shows that white people are being admitted at the expense of Asian students. That is, if your going to to use the same data to claim blacks are admitted at the expense of whites and Asians.
thebeave
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There's also The Gilmore Girls (which I never watched), but I think at least some of the "girls" in the show were adults.