Paris: Dozens Killed In Terrorist Attack

[abaddon]

Waleed Aly is using an old propaganda canard, favored by journalists and opinion shapers because of its appearance of pseudo profundity. Like many superficial tropes, it's nonsense - along the lines that a victim ought to oppose an an action because, it is claimed, that action is what his enemy wants.

What absurdity in this line of so-called reasoning. You see, a targeted society does what is necessary to do to protect its security, whether or not it comports with the enemy's irrational, perverse, or self-defeating wants.

To make clear the intent of a “don’t do what they want” argument: It's the exact same point as when telling a schoolkid “don’t show your fear of the bully cuz fear is what he wants”. The point of which isn’t that the bully should not get what he wants but that you, for your own sake, should not become the easy-to-manipulate tool that he wants you to be.

 

[Crazy Eddie]

Waleed Aly is using an old propaganda canard, favored by journalists and opinion shapers because of its appearance of pseudo profundity. Like many superficial tropes, it's nonsense - along the lines that a victim ought to oppose an an action because, it is claimed, that action is what his enemy wants.

What absurdity in this line of so-called reasoning. You see, a targeted society does what is necessary to do to protect its security, whether or not it comports with the enemy's irrational, perverse, or self-defeating wants.

Japan and Germany wanted war in 1941, but only a fool would have blubbered that the US should have promptly offered a conditional surrender to 'deny' them their wants. Hitler wanted to dump German Jews on other non-European nations, but that does that mean the US (among others) were justified in not accepting "what Hitler wanted". Saddam did not want iraq to be invaded in either gulf war, but only a moron might think that somehow creates an argument to invade.

And ISIS had not hidden what they want behind fanciful sociological rationals - they want a return to a 7th century view of Islam and jihad - convert, obey, or be put to the sword. They want infidels dead. They want to behead anyone not converting, and anyone else (including children) that violates one of their religious injunctions. What about their wants don't you get?

There was a twitter message I read, along these lines, that exemplified the delusional excuse making mindset of the Western liberal:

ISIS: We want you to convert or die by beheading...your choice.
Liberal: Oh no, you just want to provoke a war.
ISIS: No, we want you to convert or die.
Liberal: Oh no, you really want is for us to punish Muslim refugees to provoke division.
ISIS: No, we just want you to convert or die. Have you seen the infidel heads on our stakes?
Liberal: I am sure you just want to drive a wedge between the West and the Muslim World.
ISIS: Actually, we just want to kill you by beheading, unless you convert.
LIberal: No...no...no. You're just frustrated by a lack of jobs and climate change...right?
ISIS: No, we want you to convert. So will you?
Liberal: Well, no because that's what you want.
ISIS: Okay, you die. (swipe).

Got it?

Small point: ISIS doesn't actually WANT non-Muslims to convert, they're pretty much 100% committed on the "We want to kill all of you" thing. Converting to Islam specifically for the purpose of joining ISIS would probably result in you being tortured to death and/or sold into sexual slavery (in that order, if you're lucky).

 

[angelo]

ISIS is islam in it's purest fundamental form. A suicide bomber shouts " allah akabar" on detonation of his/hers bomb, and the turds who were killing those innocents at the concert in Paris also were shouting that phrase.
Those who are trying to divert from this fact by saying ISIS has nothing to do with the islamic religion per se, are only deluding themselves, and their audience.

 

[Crazy Eddie]

ISIS is islam in it's purest fundamental form.

No, ISIS is Islam what Gangsters are to Christianity. It's pretty much the "Chaotic Evil" of the middle east. The extent to which their ideology is actually based on an interpretation of Islam is difficult to judge because they don't spend a lot of time trying to justify themselves by any coherent religious precepts.

A suicide bomber shouts " allah akabar" on detonation of his/hers bomb, and the turds who were killing those innocents at the concert in Paris also were shouting that phrase.

And my wife shouted "OH JESUS!" the first time I fucked her in the ass. I think, perhaps, a lot more women than not actually exclaim something to the effect of "Oh my god!" or "Jesus fucking christ!" during a powerful orgasm.

Perhaps sex is Christianity in its purest form? That would explain a lot of things.

Those who are trying to divert from this fact by saying ISIS has nothing to do with the islamic religion per se

It has a lot to do with the Islamic religion. Just a not as much as it has to do with pissed off disaffected losers finally having an excuse to loot and pillage across the mid east at their leisure.

If I'm not mistaken, upwards of 90% of the looters in the Ferguson Riots were, in fact, Christians. Looting has a lot to do with Christianity, but not as much as it has to do with pissed off disaffected niggers finally having an excuse to loot and pillage across the mid west.

 

[Jokodo]

ISIS is islam in it's purest fundamental form. A suicide bomber shouts " allah akabar" on detonation of his/hers bomb, and the turds who were killing those innocents at the concert in Paris also were shouting that phrase.
Those who are trying to divert from this fact by saying ISIS has nothing to do with the islamic religion per se, are only deluding themselves, and their audience.

You know who else shouts "allahu akbar"? the victims' relatives at the funerals of the vast majority of ISIS's victims. By that same logic, you could just as easily argue that this proves ISIS is anti-Islam. What's good for the goose is good for the gander.

 

[barbos]

Are they? Moslems are permitted to lie if it furthers the cause. They say one thing in Arabic for Arabic ears, another for the Western pc brigades.
The grand mufti of Australia Ibrahim Abu Mohammed issued a statement soon after the attacks saying "Islamophobia was to blame for the attacks. Shifting the blame is this guys hallmark.

If only it was possible for non-Arabs to learn Arabic; It would only take a tiny handful of us, and their cunning ruse would become impossible.

But sadly, Arabic is incapable of being understood by non-Arabs, so they can get away with this darstadly trick.

Either that, or your assertion would be obviously COMPLETE BOLLOCKS.

But muslims ARE permitted to lie to their enemies in their fucking Koran. I don't why are you so surprised.
Islamist preachers in the western countries routinely lie. They say one thing during their sermons and then another on camera. Everybody knows that I don't understand why are you so surprised.

 

[Jokodo]

If only it was possible for non-Arabs to learn Arabic; It would only take a tiny handful of us, and their cunning ruse would become impossible.

But sadly, Arabic is incapable of being understood by non-Arabs, so they can get away with this darstadly trick.

Either that, or your assertion would be obviously COMPLETE BOLLOCKS.

But muslims ARE permitted to lie to their enemies in their fucking Koran. I don't why are you so surprised.
Islamist preachers in the western countries routinely lie. They say one thing during their sermons and then another on camera. Everybody knows that I don't understand why are you so surprised.

Everyone knows the Earth is flat.

 

[bilby]

If only it was possible for non-Arabs to learn Arabic; It would only take a tiny handful of us, and their cunning ruse would become impossible.

But sadly, Arabic is incapable of being understood by non-Arabs, so they can get away with this darstadly trick.

Either that, or your assertion would be obviously COMPLETE BOLLOCKS.

But muslims ARE permitted to lie to their enemies in their fucking Koran. I don't why are you so surprised.
Islamist preachers in the western countries routinely lie. They say one thing during their sermons and then another on camera. Everybody knows that I don't understand why are you so surprised.

I am not 'surprised' that they lie; I didn't even address that part of the stupidity, so you don't know how I feel about it.

What would surprise me is if anyone thinks that any activist on any side in any conflict is 100% truthful at all times.

I have no doubt whatsoever that people who think nothing of killing also do not hesitate to lie; but the idea that they can get away with lying in English while publicly contradicting themselves in Arabic is fucking retarded. Lots of people who don't support ISIS speak Arabic. Were this the case, they would immediately be exposed.

Of course they fucking lie. But the idea that when they are speaking Arabic, they are doing so with the intention of concealing something from the rest of us is paranoid bullshit that bears no examination at all.

 

[Cheerful Charlie]

http://www.alternet.org/election-20...pocalyptic-vision-and-desire-end-times-battle

[h=1]6 Keys to Understanding ISIS' Barbarism, Apocalyptic Vision and Desire for an End-Times Battle in Syria[/h]
Top prophecy: they’re in the battle for end times. In America, some evangelical Christians are among Israel’s biggest defenders because they believe it will hasten the end times foretold in the biblical Book of Revelation. ISIS believes in an Islamic version of a similar end-times prophecy, of which it is a central actor. This is key to understanding what the terrorist attacks in Paris and Beirut are in part about, which according to Wood is baiting Islam’s enemies to fight them where the end-times battle has been foretold.

 

[Toni]

ISIS is islam in it's purest fundamental form. A suicide bomber shouts " allah akabar" on detonation of his/hers bomb, and the turds who were killing those innocents at the concert in Paris also were shouting that phrase.
Those who are trying to divert from this fact by saying ISIS has nothing to do with the islamic religion per se, are only deluding themselves, and their audience.

That's like saying that the crusaders were Christianity at it's purest form.

Which is to say that ISIS and the crusades had little to do with religion or faith and a lot to do with an enormous attempt at a power grab and served to shore up and solidify --and surpress-the faithful 'at home.'

 

[barbos]

But muslims ARE permitted to lie to their enemies in their fucking Koran. I don't why are you so surprised.
Islamist preachers in the western countries routinely lie. They say one thing during their sermons and then another on camera. Everybody knows that I don't understand why are you so surprised.

I am not 'surprised' that they lie; I didn't even address that part of the stupidity, so you don't know how I feel about it.

What would surprise me is if anyone thinks that any activist on any side in any conflict is 100% truthful at all times.

I have no doubt whatsoever that people who think nothing of killing also do not hesitate to lie; but the idea that they can get away with lying in English while publicly contradicting themselves in Arabic is fucking retarded. Lots of people who don't support ISIS speak Arabic. Were this the case, they would immediately be exposed.

Of course they fucking lie. But the idea that when they are speaking Arabic, they are doing so with the intention of concealing something from the rest of us is paranoid bullshit that bears no examination at all.

One side at least feels bad about lying, muslims don't feel bad about lying, they expect to be rewarded by their fucking Allah for lying.

 

[untermensche]

ISIS is Islam after a massive foreign terrorist invasion and a decade of terror and torture was unleashed upon a region.

Look at the insanity in the US after 911. Look at the psychotic things people allowed, like the invasion of Iraq.

How much insanity do people think rose to the top after the US decade of terror and torture?

 

[Tom Sawyer]

ISIS is Islam after a massive foreign terrorist invasion and a decade of terror and torture was unleashed upon a region.

Look at the insanity in the US after 911. Look at the psychotic things people allowed, like the invasion of Iraq.

How much insanity do people think rose to the top after the US decade of terror and torture?

So, you're saying that we should stop blaming Bush for the Iraq invasion and start blaming Bin Laden, since Bush was just reacting to foreign aggression and can't be held responsible for his own actions? Or does this lack of culpability for one's behaviour not apply to Westerners?

 

[iolo]

ISIS is Islam after a massive foreign terrorist invasion and a decade of terror and torture was unleashed upon a region.

Look at the insanity in the US after 911. Look at the psychotic things people allowed, like the invasion of Iraq.

How much insanity do people think rose to the top after the US decade of terror and torture?

All you need is the Final Solution of the Muslim Problem, the elimination of democracy and a few simple little reforms of that sort, and our masters will have no problems. Meanwhile, they have to work up the mugs.

 

[untermensche]

ISIS is Islam after a massive foreign terrorist invasion and a decade of terror and torture was unleashed upon a region.

Look at the insanity in the US after 911. Look at the psychotic things people allowed, like the invasion of Iraq.

How much insanity do people think rose to the top after the US decade of terror and torture?

So, you're saying that we should stop blaming Bush for the Iraq invasion and start blaming Bin Laden, since Bush was just reacting to foreign aggression and can't be held responsible for his own actions? Or does this lack of culpability for one's behaviour not apply to Westerners?

911 was a singular event. It happened and then the world went back to exactly what it was. Saddam Hussein was a violent dictator and well contained. There were some Al Qaeda in Afghanistan that should have also been contained, had the neocons in Bush's administration not been drooling for an invasion of Iraq for over a decade.

But Iraq was completely destroyed and the world WAS changed and ISIS grew in that new world.

 

[Nice Squirrel]

So, you're saying that we should stop blaming Bush for the Iraq invasion and start blaming Bin Laden, since Bush was just reacting to foreign aggression and can't be held responsible for his own actions? Or does this lack of culpability for one's behaviour not apply to Westerners?

911 was a singular event. It happened and then the world went back to exactly what it was. Saddam Hussein was a violent dictator and well contained. There were some Al Qaeda in Afghanistan that should have also been contained, had the neocons in Bush's administration not been drooling for an invasion of Iraq for over a decade.

But Iraq was completely destroyed and the world WAS changed and ISIS grew in that new world.

^This. And when questioned on why we weren't concentrating on Afghanistan the answer was, "They are not a concern."

 

[dismal]

ISIS is Islam after a massive foreign terrorist invasion and a decade of terror and torture was unleashed upon a region.

Well, the French rock concert goers certainly deserved what they got for unleashing that decade of terror on Belgium.

They were like a girl wearing a short skirt to a fraternity party. Just asking for it.

 

[untermensche]

ISIS is Islam after a massive foreign terrorist invasion and a decade of terror and torture was unleashed upon a region.

Well, the French rock concert goers certainly deserved what they got for unleashing that decade of terror on Belgium.

They were like a girl wearing a short skirt to a fraternity party. Just asking for it.

I don't recall ever claiming that this monster we created was rational.

 

[Tom Sawyer]

So, you're saying that we should stop blaming Bush for the Iraq invasion and start blaming Bin Laden, since Bush was just reacting to foreign aggression and can't be held responsible for his own actions? Or does this lack of culpability for one's behaviour not apply to Westerners?

911 was a singular event. It happened and then the world went back to exactly what it was. Saddam Hussein was a violent dictator and well contained. There were some Al Qaeda in Afghanistan that should have also been contained, had the neocons in Bush's administration not been drooling for an invasion of Iraq for over a decade.

But Iraq was completely destroyed and the world WAS changed and ISIS grew in that new world.

So, how long and/or devastating a series of attacks against Americans would make it justifiable for Americans to go and kill a bunch of ... say Pakistanis?

I mean, I get what you think makes it cool for ISIS to go and kill some French people as payback for American actions, since the French were so supportive of the US war in Iraq that the Congress renamed french fries into freedom fries in their honour, but what would be the level of attack against the US by Arabs which would make it justifiable for some dudes from Alabama to go and gun down a bunch of civilians in Islamabad?

 

[Derec]

The suburb in which police are searching for and clashing with Islamic terrorists right now, St. Denis, is the same suburb which named a street after infamous US cop-killer and black radical Mumia Abu Jamal. So it's not like there weren't warning signs for years - the French just chose to ignore them in the name of political correctness.