Police Misconduct Catch All Thread

[Loren Pechtel]

If nothing else, the case of Anthony Mitchell points out again that families and friends need a safe resource to call for welfare checks or when their loved one is obviously not rational and is a danger to themselves. No one's loved one should die as a result of a welfare check. Having kept him incarcerated for 2 weeks seems unreasonable and irrational.

Unfortunately, we don't have enough psychiatric funding. If all the secure psychiatric beds are full it very well might be that jail is preferable to leaving them at home. A cell with food, water and climate control could easily be better than a house lacking one or more of these things.

I loathe the Defund the Police slogan but: if we stopped ficussing so much on incarceration. we could have more funds to treatment of psychiatric illnesses, addiction and other mental health needs.

But we se to have convinced police and significant portion of the public that their job is to punish those they take into custody. There is zero reason this man was held fir two weeks. There is NO good reason for this man to be dead.

Welfare checks should not result in incarceration and they should never result in deaths. It is shameful that such happens. Shameful and disgusting.

Which completely doesn't address my point that a cell might have been less bad than what the police found in doing the welfare check.

 

[Toni]

If nothing else, the case of Anthony Mitchell points out again that families and friends need a safe resource to call for welfare checks or when their loved one is obviously not rational and is a danger to themselves. No one's loved one should die as a result of a welfare check. Having kept him incarcerated for 2 weeks seems unreasonable and irrational.

Unfortunately, we don't have enough psychiatric funding. If all the secure psychiatric beds are full it very well might be that jail is preferable to leaving them at home. A cell with food, water and climate control could easily be better than a house lacking one or more of these things.

I loathe the Defund the Police slogan but: if we stopped ficussing so much on incarceration. we could have more funds to treatment of psychiatric illnesses, addiction and other mental health needs.

But we se to have convinced police and significant portion of the public that their job is to punish those they take into custody. There is zero reason this man was held fir two weeks. There is NO good reason for this man to be dead.

Welfare checks should not result in incarceration and they should never result in deaths. It is shameful that such happens. Shameful and disgusting.

Which completely doesn't address my point that a cell might have been less bad than what the police found in doing the welfare check.

Apparently you are quite wrong, as he is dead and was either held in some type of freezer or refrigerator or left unattended for hours.

Jail is NOT the place for someone in the middle of a medical or mental health crisis. It is ONLY for those who are credibly accused of crimes until such time as they can post bail or be held for trial. Police officers and jail house attendants are NOT trained in providing medical or mental health care or in evaluating people for such needs.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

If nothing else, the case of Anthony Mitchell points out again that families and friends need a safe resource to call for welfare checks or when their loved one is obviously not rational and is a danger to themselves. No one's loved one should die as a result of a welfare check. Having kept him incarcerated for 2 weeks seems unreasonable and irrational.

Unfortunately, we don't have enough psychiatric funding. If all the secure psychiatric beds are full it very well might be that jail is preferable to leaving them at home. A cell with food, water and climate control could easily be better than a house lacking one or more of these things.

I loathe the Defund the Police slogan but: if we stopped ficussing so much on incarceration. we could have more funds to treatment of psychiatric illnesses, addiction and other mental health needs.

But we se to have convinced police and significant portion of the public that their job is to punish those they take into custody. There is zero reason this man was held fir two weeks. There is NO good reason for this man to be dead.

Welfare checks should not result in incarceration and they should never result in deaths. It is shameful that such happens. Shameful and disgusting.

Which completely doesn't address my point that a cell might have been less bad than what the police found in doing the welfare check.

Apparently you are quite wrong, as he is dead and was either held in some type of freezer or refrigerator or left unattended for hours.

Jail is NOT the place for someone in the middle of a medical or mental health crisis. It is ONLY for those who are credibly accused of crimes until such time as they can post bail or be held for trial. Police officers and jail house attendants are NOT trained in providing medical or mental health care or in evaluating people for such needs.

Of course it's not the right place--the question is whether there was a better place available. There are severe shortages of better spaces.

 

[Toni]

If nothing else, the case of Anthony Mitchell points out again that families and friends need a safe resource to call for welfare checks or when their loved one is obviously not rational and is a danger to themselves. No one's loved one should die as a result of a welfare check. Having kept him incarcerated for 2 weeks seems unreasonable and irrational.

Unfortunately, we don't have enough psychiatric funding. If all the secure psychiatric beds are full it very well might be that jail is preferable to leaving them at home. A cell with food, water and climate control could easily be better than a house lacking one or more of these things.

I loathe the Defund the Police slogan but: if we stopped ficussing so much on incarceration. we could have more funds to treatment of psychiatric illnesses, addiction and other mental health needs.

But we se to have convinced police and significant portion of the public that their job is to punish those they take into custody. There is zero reason this man was held fir two weeks. There is NO good reason for this man to be dead.

Welfare checks should not result in incarceration and they should never result in deaths. It is shameful that such happens. Shameful and disgusting.

Which completely doesn't address my point that a cell might have been less bad than what the police found in doing the welfare check.

Apparently you are quite wrong, as he is dead and was either held in some type of freezer or refrigerator or left unattended for hours.

Jail is NOT the place for someone in the middle of a medical or mental health crisis. It is ONLY for those who are credibly accused of crimes until such time as they can post bail or be held for trial. Police officers and jail house attendants are NOT trained in providing medical or mental health care or in evaluating people for such needs.

Of course it's not the right place--the question is whether there was a better place available. There are severe shortages of better spaces.

Yes there is a severe shortage of appropriate places and personnel to help people in a mental health crises.

An adequate or acceptable way to help people in crisis does not include putting them at risk of death or serious harm.

 

[Toni]

If nothing else, the case of Anthony Mitchell points out again that families and friends need a safe resource to call for welfare checks or when their loved one is obviously not rational and is a danger to themselves. No one's loved one should die as a result of a welfare check. Having kept him incarcerated for 2 weeks seems unreasonable and irrational.

Unfortunately, we don't have enough psychiatric funding. If all the secure psychiatric beds are full it very well might be that jail is preferable to leaving them at home. A cell with food, water and climate control could easily be better than a house lacking one or more of these things.

I loathe the Defund the Police slogan but: if we stopped ficussing so much on incarceration. we could have more funds to treatment of psychiatric illnesses, addiction and other mental health needs.

But we se to have convinced police and significant portion of the public that their job is to punish those they take into custody. There is zero reason this man was held fir two weeks. There is NO good reason for this man to be dead.

Welfare checks should not result in incarceration and they should never result in deaths. It is shameful that such happens. Shameful and disgusting.

Which completely doesn't address my point that a cell might have been less bad than what the police found in doing the welfare check.

Apparently you are quite wrong, as he is dead and was either held in some type of freezer or refrigerator or left unattended for hours.

Jail is NOT the place for someone in the middle of a medical or mental health crisis. It is ONLY for those who are credibly accused of crimes until such time as they can post bail or be held for trial. Police officers and jail house attendants are NOT trained in providing medical or mental health care or in evaluating people for such needs.

Of course it's not the right place--the question is whether there was a better place available. There are severe shortages of better spaces.

I responded earlier but perhaps a better response would be: Maybe it's time to take the funds used by police departments for paramilitary training and start using them for mental health care. It will take a lot more than just that but how about we start there?

 

[Oleg]

I responded earlier but perhaps a better response would be: Maybe it's time to take the funds used by police departments for paramilitary training and start using them for mental health care. It will take a lot more than just that but how about we start there?

That ain't gonna happen. If we acknowledge that mental illness plays a role in crime and poverty, we can't blame capitalism.

 

[laughing dog]

I responded earlier but perhaps a better response would be: Maybe it's time to take the funds used by police departments for paramilitary training and start using them for mental health care. It will take a lot more than just that but how about we start there?

That ain't gonna happen. If we acknowledge that mental illness plays a role in crime and poverty, we can't blame capitalism.

That makes no sense.

 

[Gospel]

I responded earlier but perhaps a better response would be: Maybe it's time to take the funds used by police departments for paramilitary training and start using them for mental health care. It will take a lot more than just that but how about we start there?

That ain't gonna happen. If we acknowledge that mental illness plays a role in crime and poverty, we can't blame capitalism.

But we need capitalism to fund America's struggle against mental illness. Most American's wont do it for free. Side note, capitalism is inefficient without socialism. Unless you want corporations policing the US with mercenaries like they do in Africa when extracting resources.

 

[Oleg]

I responded earlier but perhaps a better response would be: Maybe it's time to take the funds used by police departments for paramilitary training and start using them for mental health care. It will take a lot more than just that but how about we start there?

That ain't gonna happen. If we acknowledge that mental illness plays a role in crime and poverty, we can't blame capitalism.

That makes no sense.

The narrative in the PNW is that people are “unhoused” because rent is too high. It’s bullshit but noticing that people may be the cause of their own troubles is verboten.

 

[Gospel]

I responded earlier but perhaps a better response would be: Maybe it's time to take the funds used by police departments for paramilitary training and start using them for mental health care. It will take a lot more than just that but how about we start there?

That ain't gonna happen. If we acknowledge that mental illness plays a role in crime and poverty, we can't blame capitalism.

That makes no sense.

The narrative in the PNW is that people are “unhoused” because rent is too high. It’s bullshit but noticing that people may be the cause of their own troubles is verboten.

Oh hell naw. I know one too many people who are the cause of their own troubles. Some Financial troubles others legal troubles. However I'd be living in the land of make-believe to think nobody falls on hard times as a result of things beyond their control. Medical events is one of the major ones for example. Getting priced out of your neighborhood is another one that's real. I'm shocked being the statistic lover you are you haven't run across the whole wage vs cost of living thing going on in all 50 states.

 

[laughing dog]

I responded earlier but perhaps a better response would be: Maybe it's time to take the funds used by police departments for paramilitary training and start using them for mental health care. It will take a lot more than just that but how about we start there?

That ain't gonna happen. If we acknowledge that mental illness plays a role in crime and poverty, we can't blame capitalism.

That makes no sense.

The narrative in the PNW is that people are “unhoused” because rent is too high. It’s bullshit but noticing that people may be the cause of their own troubles is verboten.

Your "we can't blame capitalism" does not follow from your "If we acknowledge that mental illness plays a role in crime and poverty". The fact some people make that error does not make it legitimate. Nor is your broadbrush description of those with whom you disagree.

 

[lpetrich]

I responded earlier but perhaps a better response would be: Maybe it's time to take the funds used by police departments for paramilitary training and start using them for mental health care. It will take a lot more than just that but how about we start there?

That ain't gonna happen. If we acknowledge that mental illness plays a role in crime and poverty, we can't blame capitalism.

That makes no sense.

The narrative in the PNW is that people are “unhoused” because rent is too high. It’s bullshit but noticing that people may be the cause of their own troubles is verboten.

That's like saying that it is verboten to recognize that crime victims may have enabled the crimes that they suffer by bad decisions that they had made.

 

[lpetrich]

I will phrase what I'm saying as a syllogism, a form of reasoning recognized by a Dead White European Male some 2300 years ago, Aristoteles of Stagira, more usually called Aristotle.

All misery is self-inflicted.
Crime victimhood is misery.
Crime victimhood is self-inflicted.

 

[Oleg]

I responded earlier but perhaps a better response would be: Maybe it's time to take the funds used by police departments for paramilitary training and start using them for mental health care. It will take a lot more than just that but how about we start there?

That ain't gonna happen. If we acknowledge that mental illness plays a role in crime and poverty, we can't blame capitalism.

That makes no sense.

The narrative in the PNW is that people are “unhoused” because rent is too high. It’s bullshit but noticing that people may be the cause of their own troubles is verboten.

That's like saying that it is verboten to recognize that crime victims may have enabled the crimes that they suffer by bad decisions that they had made.

Oh, my mistake. Yes, it's Amazon. Amazon is the reason for the "unhoused" crisis.

Kshama Sawant wants to tax Amazon so people can afford to live in Seattle. Can she pull it off?

New tax proposal by Seattle city council member would affect about 825 companies and is expected to raise $300m each year

www.theguardian.com

 

[Gospel]

You are resilient I give you that.

 

[laughing dog]

I responded earlier but perhaps a better response would be: Maybe it's time to take the funds used by police departments for paramilitary training and start using them for mental health care. It will take a lot more than just that but how about we start there?

That ain't gonna happen. If we acknowledge that mental illness plays a role in crime and poverty, we can't blame capitalism.

That makes no sense.

The narrative in the PNW is that people are “unhoused” because rent is too high. It’s bullshit but noticing that people may be the cause of their own troubles is verboten.

That's like saying that it is verboten to recognize that crime victims may have enabled the crimes that they suffer by bad decisions that they had made.

Oh, my mistake. Yes, it's Amazon. Amazon is the reason for the "unhoused" crisis.

Kshama Sawant wants to tax Amazon so people can afford to live in Seattle. Can she pull it off?

New tax proposal by Seattle city council member would affect about 825 companies and is expected to raise $300m each year

www.theguardian.com

Another post that makes no sense.

 

[Shadowy Man]

I responded earlier but perhaps a better response would be: Maybe it's time to take the funds used by police departments for paramilitary training and start using them for mental health care. It will take a lot more than just that but how about we start there?

That ain't gonna happen. If we acknowledge that mental illness plays a role in crime and poverty, we can't blame capitalism.

That makes no sense.

The narrative in the PNW is that people are “unhoused” because rent is too high. It’s bullshit but noticing that people may be the cause of their own troubles is verboten.

That's like saying that it is verboten to recognize that crime victims may have enabled the crimes that they suffer by bad decisions that they had made.

Oh, my mistake. Yes, it's Amazon. Amazon is the reason for the "unhoused" crisis.

Kshama Sawant wants to tax Amazon so people can afford to live in Seattle. Can she pull it off?

New tax proposal by Seattle city council member would affect about 825 companies and is expected to raise $300m each year

www.theguardian.com

It’s amazing that no one has yet realized that by having Amazon pay virtually no taxes the money has trickled down to increase the wealth of the poorest members of Seattle. They must just want to be homeless and poor.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

If nothing else, the case of Anthony Mitchell points out again that families and friends need a safe resource to call for welfare checks or when their loved one is obviously not rational and is a danger to themselves. No one's loved one should die as a result of a welfare check. Having kept him incarcerated for 2 weeks seems unreasonable and irrational.

Unfortunately, we don't have enough psychiatric funding. If all the secure psychiatric beds are full it very well might be that jail is preferable to leaving them at home. A cell with food, water and climate control could easily be better than a house lacking one or more of these things.

I loathe the Defund the Police slogan but: if we stopped ficussing so much on incarceration. we could have more funds to treatment of psychiatric illnesses, addiction and other mental health needs.

But we se to have convinced police and significant portion of the public that their job is to punish those they take into custody. There is zero reason this man was held fir two weeks. There is NO good reason for this man to be dead.

Welfare checks should not result in incarceration and they should never result in deaths. It is shameful that such happens. Shameful and disgusting.

Which completely doesn't address my point that a cell might have been less bad than what the police found in doing the welfare check.

Apparently you are quite wrong, as he is dead and was either held in some type of freezer or refrigerator or left unattended for hours.

Jail is NOT the place for someone in the middle of a medical or mental health crisis. It is ONLY for those who are credibly accused of crimes until such time as they can post bail or be held for trial. Police officers and jail house attendants are NOT trained in providing medical or mental health care or in evaluating people for such needs.

Of course it's not the right place--the question is whether there was a better place available. There are severe shortages of better spaces.

Yes there is a severe shortage of appropriate places and personnel to help people in a mental health crises.

An adequate or acceptable way to help people in crisis does not include putting them at risk of death or serious harm.

You continue to fail to produce the slightest evidence that a better place existed. This is just the standard leftist faith that when there is a bad outcome the side with the most power is automatically in the wrong. It's very hard to comprehend a blasphemous situation, chanting your holy faith is easier.

 

[laughing dog]

If nothing else, the case of Anthony Mitchell points out again that families and friends need a safe resource to call for welfare checks or when their loved one is obviously not rational and is a danger to themselves. No one's loved one should die as a result of a welfare check. Having kept him incarcerated for 2 weeks seems unreasonable and irrational.

Unfortunately, we don't have enough psychiatric funding. If all the secure psychiatric beds are full it very well might be that jail is preferable to leaving them at home. A cell with food, water and climate control could easily be better than a house lacking one or more of these things.

I loathe the Defund the Police slogan but: if we stopped ficussing so much on incarceration. we could have more funds to treatment of psychiatric illnesses, addiction and other mental health needs.

But we se to have convinced police and significant portion of the public that their job is to punish those they take into custody. There is zero reason this man was held fir two weeks. There is NO good reason for this man to be dead.

Welfare checks should not result in incarceration and they should never result in deaths. It is shameful that such happens. Shameful and disgusting.

Which completely doesn't address my point that a cell might have been less bad than what the police found in doing the welfare check.

Apparently you are quite wrong, as he is dead and was either held in some type of freezer or refrigerator or left unattended for hours.

Jail is NOT the place for someone in the middle of a medical or mental health crisis. It is ONLY for those who are credibly accused of crimes until such time as they can post bail or be held for trial. Police officers and jail house attendants are NOT trained in providing medical or mental health care or in evaluating people for such needs.

Of course it's not the right place--the question is whether there was a better place available. There are severe shortages of better spaces.

Yes there is a severe shortage of appropriate places and personnel to help people in a mental health crises.

An adequate or acceptable way to help people in crisis does not include putting them at risk of death or serious harm.

You continue to fail to produce the slightest evidence that a better place existed. This is just the standard leftist faith that when there is a bad outcome the side with the most power is automatically in the wrong. It's very hard to comprehend a blasphemous situation, chanting your holy faith is easier.

One would think it is obvious that hospitals are a better place for someone in a physical or mental health crisis than a jail.

Do you usually ask people for evidence that water is wet?

 

[Toni]

If nothing else, the case of Anthony Mitchell points out again that families and friends need a safe resource to call for welfare checks or when their loved one is obviously not rational and is a danger to themselves. No one's loved one should die as a result of a welfare check. Having kept him incarcerated for 2 weeks seems unreasonable and irrational.

Unfortunately, we don't have enough psychiatric funding. If all the secure psychiatric beds are full it very well might be that jail is preferable to leaving them at home. A cell with food, water and climate control could easily be better than a house lacking one or more of these things.

I loathe the Defund the Police slogan but: if we stopped ficussing so much on incarceration. we could have more funds to treatment of psychiatric illnesses, addiction and other mental health needs.

But we se to have convinced police and significant portion of the public that their job is to punish those they take into custody. There is zero reason this man was held fir two weeks. There is NO good reason for this man to be dead.

Welfare checks should not result in incarceration and they should never result in deaths. It is shameful that such happens. Shameful and disgusting.

Which completely doesn't address my point that a cell might have been less bad than what the police found in doing the welfare check.

Apparently you are quite wrong, as he is dead and was either held in some type of freezer or refrigerator or left unattended for hours.

Jail is NOT the place for someone in the middle of a medical or mental health crisis. It is ONLY for those who are credibly accused of crimes until such time as they can post bail or be held for trial. Police officers and jail house attendants are NOT trained in providing medical or mental health care or in evaluating people for such needs.

Of course it's not the right place--the question is whether there was a better place available. There are severe shortages of better spaces.

Yes there is a severe shortage of appropriate places and personnel to help people in a mental health crises.

An adequate or acceptable way to help people in crisis does not include putting them at risk of death or serious harm.

You continue to fail to produce the slightest evidence that a better place existed. This is just the standard leftist faith that when there is a bad outcome the side with the most power is automatically in the wrong. It's very hard to comprehend a blasphemous situation, chanting your holy faith is easier.

Oh fucking bullshit Loren. The choice isn’t: take the guy in the middle of a break down to jail and throw him in the walk in fridge/freeze if he doesn’t straighten up PDQ or do nothing at all.

The police took the man into custody. Yes it absolutely sucks that there was not a better choice. I absolutely think there SHOULD be a much better choice. But given that was the choice made the police had an absolute duty and responsibility to ensure the safety of any person in their custody.

The FACT that they not only FAILED to keep him safe but are most likely actually responsible for his death should be a cause for outrage for even the most boot licking cop lover out there. And you’re telling me I’m religious for thinking there had to be a better solution??

How about not fucking killing the person in police custody, Loren? How about that for a better place. Or are you trying to claim that being dead is the ‘better place’ like they do in church?