Police Misconduct Catch All Thread

[Loren Pechtel]

I responded earlier but perhaps a better response would be: Maybe it's time to take the funds used by police departments for paramilitary training and start using them for mental health care. It will take a lot more than just that but how about we start there?

That ain't gonna happen. If we acknowledge that mental illness plays a role in crime and poverty, we can't blame capitalism.

That makes no sense.

The narrative in the PNW is that people are “unhoused” because rent is too high. It’s bullshit but noticing that people may be the cause of their own troubles is verboten.

Oh hell naw. I know one too many people who are the cause of their own troubles. Some Financial troubles others legal troubles. However I'd be living in the land of make-believe to think nobody falls on hard times as a result of things beyond their control. Medical events is one of the major ones for example. Getting priced out of your neighborhood is another one that's real. I'm shocked being the statistic lover you are you haven't run across the whole wage vs cost of living thing going on in all 50 states.

True, but most people in a bad way got themselves in the situation.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

I responded earlier but perhaps a better response would be: Maybe it's time to take the funds used by police departments for paramilitary training and start using them for mental health care. It will take a lot more than just that but how about we start there?

That ain't gonna happen. If we acknowledge that mental illness plays a role in crime and poverty, we can't blame capitalism.

That makes no sense.

The narrative in the PNW is that people are “unhoused” because rent is too high. It’s bullshit but noticing that people may be the cause of their own troubles is verboten.

That's like saying that it is verboten to recognize that crime victims may have enabled the crimes that they suffer by bad decisions that they had made.

Oh, my mistake. Yes, it's Amazon. Amazon is the reason for the "unhoused" crisis.

Kshama Sawant wants to tax Amazon so people can afford to live in Seattle. Can she pull it off?

New tax proposal by Seattle city council member would affect about 825 companies and is expected to raise $300m each year

www.theguardian.com

Another post that makes no sense.

Your failure to see sense doesn't mean there is none.

 

[Toni]

I responded earlier but perhaps a better response would be: Maybe it's time to take the funds used by police departments for paramilitary training and start using them for mental health care. It will take a lot more than just that but how about we start there?

That ain't gonna happen. If we acknowledge that mental illness plays a role in crime and poverty, we can't blame capitalism.

That makes no sense.

The narrative in the PNW is that people are “unhoused” because rent is too high. It’s bullshit but noticing that people may be the cause of their own troubles is verboten.

That's like saying that it is verboten to recognize that crime victims may have enabled the crimes that they suffer by bad decisions that they had made.

Oh, my mistake. Yes, it's Amazon. Amazon is the reason for the "unhoused" crisis.

Kshama Sawant wants to tax Amazon so people can afford to live in Seattle. Can she pull it off?

New tax proposal by Seattle city council member would affect about 825 companies and is expected to raise $300m each year

www.theguardian.com

Another post that makes no sense.

Your failure to see sense doesn't mean there is none.

How about you share some of your wisdom. Exactly how is a mentally I’ll man dead in a walk in freezer in a jail a better outcome than… anything other than the man dead?

 

[ZiprHead]

Man says he was shot in face, waterboarded by Mississippi deputies as FBI launches probe

The FBI is investigating the arrests two Black men by Rankin County Sheriff's deputies in Mississippi as civil rights activists call for justice for Michael Jenkins.

lawandcrime.com

The FBI has launched a federal civil rights investigation into the alleged beating and waterboarding torture of two Black men, one of whom miraculously survived a bullet to the face, by sheriff deputies in a drug raid in Mississippi.

The FBI announced its investigation into the arrests of Michael Corey Jenkins, 32, and Eddie Terrell Parker, 35, by Rankin County Sheriff’s deputies on Jan. 24 at a home in Braxton, Miss., 25 miles south of Jackson.

“The FBI will conduct the investigation in a fair, thorough, and impartial manner,” said the statement on Wednesday. “As this is an ongoing investigation, we are not able to comment further at this time.”

At a news conference on Wednesday, civil rights attorney Malik Shabazz said six white deputies raided the home without warning or warrants. They forced their way in and immediately subdued and handcuffed the men, he said.

Next was a 90-minute “intimidation and torture session,” where he said excessive force was used gratuitously on the handcuffed men.

He said deputies repeatedly punched, kicked and shocked them with Tasers before waterboarding them. He said racial slurs were used. Deputies repeatedly pointed guns at their heads and threatened to kill them, he said.

He said they were put on their backs and had “milk, alcohol, whatever could be found in the house” poured on their faces to “try to make the men believe that they were somehow drowning … to try to elicit some kind of confession,” Shabazz said.

He said at the end of it, while still in handcuffs, Jenkins had a gun placed in his mouth by a Rankin County deputy, and the trigger was pulled. A bullet went into his mouth and out of his ear.

 

[ZiprHead]

He was picking up his brother at school. Now his family is suing in a fatal police encounter.

The family of unarmed Colorado man Richard Ward fatally shot by police in a middle school pick-up line filed a federal civil rights lawsuit Tuesday.

www.usatoday.com

Asked about the deputies' claims that Ward was a danger, family attorney Mari Newman said the deputies were "simply making things up." She added: "The video doesn't show him doing anything except for being yanked out of the car and thrown to the ground."

Newman also noted the misleading statements made by law enforcement in the wake of the shooting. On the day of the incident, Pueblo County Sherriff David Lucero told local KKTV that Ward "jumped out of the vehicle." Bodycam video shows he was pulled out.

 

[lpetrich]

 List of countries with annual rates and counts for killings by law enforcement officers
The champion in killing rate is Venezuela, and I've yet to see any right-winger hold that nation's police killings against it.


Not just “a few bad apples”: U.S. police kill civilians at much higher rates than other countries | Prison Policy Initiative

There is no question that the number of police killings of civilians in the U.S. – who are disproportionately Black and other people of color – are the result of policies and practices that enable and even encourage police violence. Compared to police in other wealthy democracies, American police kill civilians at incredibly high rates:

About 3 or 4 times the rate of Canadian and Australian cops, and 15 to over 100 times the rate of cops in many European countries.


Mass Incarceration | American Civil Liberties Union

What you need to know

$80 billion
The United States spends over $80 billion on incarceration each year.

10
Blacks are incarcerated for drug offenses at a rate 10 times greater than that of whites, despite the fact that blacks and whites use drugs at roughly the same rates.

$20,000-$50,000
Local, state, and federal governments spend anywhere from $20,000 to $50,000 annually to keep an individual behind bars.

 

[Toni]

Man says he was shot in face, waterboarded by Mississippi deputies as FBI launches probe

The FBI is investigating the arrests two Black men by Rankin County Sheriff's deputies in Mississippi as civil rights activists call for justice for Michael Jenkins.

lawandcrime.com

The FBI has launched a federal civil rights investigation into the alleged beating and waterboarding torture of two Black men, one of whom miraculously survived a bullet to the face, by sheriff deputies in a drug raid in Mississippi.

The FBI announced its investigation into the arrests of Michael Corey Jenkins, 32, and Eddie Terrell Parker, 35, by Rankin County Sheriff’s deputies on Jan. 24 at a home in Braxton, Miss., 25 miles south of Jackson.

“The FBI will conduct the investigation in a fair, thorough, and impartial manner,” said the statement on Wednesday. “As this is an ongoing investigation, we are not able to comment further at this time.”

At a news conference on Wednesday, civil rights attorney Malik Shabazz said six white deputies raided the home without warning or warrants. They forced their way in and immediately subdued and handcuffed the men, he said.

Next was a 90-minute “intimidation and torture session,” where he said excessive force was used gratuitously on the handcuffed men.

He said deputies repeatedly punched, kicked and shocked them with Tasers before waterboarding them. He said racial slurs were used. Deputies repeatedly pointed guns at their heads and threatened to kill them, he said.

He said they were put on their backs and had “milk, alcohol, whatever could be found in the house” poured on their faces to “try to make the men believe that they were somehow drowning … to try to elicit some kind of confession,” Shabazz said.

He said at the end of it, while still in handcuffs, Jenkins had a gun placed in his mouth by a Rankin County deputy, and the trigger was pulled. A bullet went into his mouth and out of his ear.

Oh my god. This is absolutely so out of control it is difficult to comprehend. HOW could anyone justify such actions?

 

[Toni]

He was picking up his brother at school. Now his family is suing in a fatal police encounter.

The family of unarmed Colorado man Richard Ward fatally shot by police in a middle school pick-up line filed a federal civil rights lawsuit Tuesday.

www.usatoday.com

Asked about the deputies' claims that Ward was a danger, family attorney Mari Newman said the deputies were "simply making things up." She added: "The video doesn't show him doing anything except for being yanked out of the car and thrown to the ground."

Newman also noted the misleading statements made by law enforcement in the wake of the shooting. On the day of the incident, Pueblo County Sherriff David Lucero told local KKTV that Ward "jumped out of the vehicle." Bodycam video shows he was pulled out.

We cannot allow police officers to be armed. This is horrific.

 

[lpetrich]

He was picking up his brother at school. Now his family is suing in a fatal police encounter.

The family of unarmed Colorado man Richard Ward fatally shot by police in a middle school pick-up line filed a federal civil rights lawsuit Tuesday.

www.usatoday.com

Asked about the deputies' claims that Ward was a danger, family attorney Mari Newman said the deputies were "simply making things up." She added: "The video doesn't show him doing anything except for being yanked out of the car and thrown to the ground."

Newman also noted the misleading statements made by law enforcement in the wake of the shooting. On the day of the incident, Pueblo County Sherriff David Lucero told local KKTV that Ward "jumped out of the vehicle." Bodycam video shows he was pulled out.

We cannot allow police officers to be armed. This is horrific.

I'm not an absolutist on that. I'd prefer that they be armed with nonlethal weapons or low-lethality ones like Tasers. Guns should only be used as backup weapons, not as primary ones.

 

[Toni]

He was picking up his brother at school. Now his family is suing in a fatal police encounter.

The family of unarmed Colorado man Richard Ward fatally shot by police in a middle school pick-up line filed a federal civil rights lawsuit Tuesday.

www.usatoday.com

Asked about the deputies' claims that Ward was a danger, family attorney Mari Newman said the deputies were "simply making things up." She added: "The video doesn't show him doing anything except for being yanked out of the car and thrown to the ground."

Newman also noted the misleading statements made by law enforcement in the wake of the shooting. On the day of the incident, Pueblo County Sherriff David Lucero told local KKTV that Ward "jumped out of the vehicle." Bodycam video shows he was pulled out.

We cannot allow police officers to be armed. This is horrific.

I'm not an absolutist on that. I'd prefer that they be armed with nonlethal weapons or low-lethality ones like Tasers. Guns should only be used as backup weapons, not as primary ones.

This is so excessive that it is beyond belief. A kid mistakenly starts to get into the wrong car, apologizes and then returns to his mother's car. And he's dragged out of the vehicle and shot three times in the chest by police officers. WHY on earth did those police officers have guns??? WHY on earth did they utilize ANY weapon?

I'm not ordinarily an absolutist but I am on my way to becoming one.

 

[laughing dog]

Your failure to see sense doesn't mean there is none.

The irony of your handwaved claim is overwhelming. The fact you may find sense in something does not mean there is some.

I realize that this is difficult concept for the reasoning-impaired, but financing a policy via a specific tax on _____ does not necessarily mean that _____ is being held to blame for anything.

 

[Worldtraveller]

I responded earlier but perhaps a better response would be: Maybe it's time to take the funds used by police departments for paramilitary training and start using them for mental health care. It will take a lot more than just that but how about we start there?

That ain't gonna happen. If we acknowledge that mental illness plays a role in crime and poverty, we can't blame capitalism.

That makes no sense.

The narrative in the PNW is that people are “unhoused” because rent is too high. It’s bullshit but noticing that people may be the cause of their own troubles is verboten.

Oh hell naw. I know one too many people who are the cause of their own troubles. Some Financial troubles others legal troubles. However I'd be living in the land of make-believe to think nobody falls on hard times as a result of things beyond their control. Medical events is one of the major ones for example. Getting priced out of your neighborhood is another one that's real. I'm shocked being the statistic lover you are you haven't run across the whole wage vs cost of living thing going on in all 50 states.

True, but most people in a bad way got themselves in the situation.

I'd say you couldn't be more fucking wrong if you tried, but the day's still young.

 

[Derec]

This is so excessive that it is beyond belief. A kid

A "kid"? The guy was 32.

mistakenly starts to get into the wrong car, apologizes and then returns to his mother's car. And he's dragged out of the vehicle and shot three times in the chest by police officers.

The video also shows him scuffling with the officers.

WHY on earth did those police officers have guns???

US police carry firearms as standard equipment. This is not UK.

WHY on earth did they utilize ANY weapon?

It's not clear from the video, but police claim he went for one of their guns. That presents a lethal thread and would justify lethal force.
The only question is, is what police saying true?

I'm not ordinarily an absolutist but I am on my way to becoming one.

"We cannot allow police to be armed" is a very absolutist statement. You are not on your way, you have arrived at your destination.

 

[Elixir]

but police claim he went for one of their guns. That presents a lethal thread and would justify lethal force.

In a rational world, that would be a strong argument against giving cops guns.

 

[Derec]

In a rational world, that would be a strong argument against giving cops guns.

It wouldn't, since many perps are armed.
The world Toni et al appear to want is one in which only criminals are armed.

 

[Derec]

I'm not an absolutist on that. I'd prefer that they be armed with nonlethal weapons or low-lethality ones like Tasers. Guns should only be used as backup weapons, not as primary ones.

They usually carry both, unless prohibited like SFPD was when they were forced to shoot Mario Woods.
Police are usually supposed to use tasers when viable. But even that can go bad. Take the recent case of Keenan Anderson. He died several hours after getting tased. Even though police used tasers and not guns, and generally showed a lot of restraint, they are still being demonized by the activists and his greedy family is suing LAPD for $50M. Never mind that he was coked up out of his mind, caused a traffic accident, tried to steal a car, and resisted arrest. You can never please the anti-police crowd.

 

[lpetrich]

In a rational world, that would be a strong argument against giving cops guns.

It wouldn't, since many perps are armed.
The world Toni et al appear to want is one in which only criminals are armed.

"Bigger gun wins" naivete. It's more like "whoever shoots first wins". A Taser can bring down someone with an assault rifle.

 

[Derec]

We cannot allow police officers to be armed. This is horrific.

So only criminals should be armed then? And what should police do when they encounter armed perps?
Vast majority of police shootings involve armed perps, and most police shootings (at least 57% in 2022) involve perps armed with firearms.

 

[Derec]

"Bigger gun wins" naivete. It's more like "whoever shoots first wins".

And yet some on here want a rule where police are not allowed to shoot unless the perp fires first.

A Taser can bring down someone with an assault rifle.

Tasers have a high failure rate. Often the barbs do not connect for whatever reason. Even thick clothing can thwart tasers. If the taser does not incapacitate the perp wielding an assault rifle (rare in the US, did you mean to say semiauto rifle?) can start blasting. That's why police do not generally use tasers against gun-wielding perps. If they do, another officer will act as backup with his firearm.

 

[Derec]

Oh my god. This is absolutely so out of control it is difficult to comprehend. HOW could anyone justify such actions?

Horrible if true. But note that these are just unsubstantiated claims by the lawyer, who is a known black nationalist.