Black Jogger Gunned Down In The Street

[repoman]

Let's say the video was longer with the father saying some pdicey things. Like they can't wait until the lowlife scum runs by because they will show him who is boss.

A solid police force would get warrant to get computer specialist to try and extract more video from the filmer.

On the other hand, should rhe police have searched the home of the deceased for possible stolen property from previous burglaries in that area?

 

[Patooka]

On the other hand, should rhe police have searched the home of the deceased for possible stolen property from previous burglaries in that area?

For what fucking reason?

 

[repoman]

I think you mean for what justification, because the reason is clear.

 

[Toni]

What white people did to his ancestors--including his parents, grandparents and even to him certainly has a role in every aspect of his life.

A lot of people had bad things happen to them when they were growing up. We don't use that to excuse bad behavior in other situations, why should race be treated differently?

Bad things continue to happen to black people all their lives. Including, apparently, being shot for running in the wrong neighborhood if you are black.

Because you are presumed to have committed a crime. Because you are black.

Because you are presumed to be violent. Because you are black.

Because you are presumed to be on welfare. Because you are black. As if being on welfare were a crime because as it happens, most welfare recipients (even discounting corporate welfare) are not black. Or brown. They're white. And btw, they're children. At least we're not gunning down children. Oh, wait: we are. Black children are not allowed to play in a public park without being shot down by police.

Because you are presumed to be lying. Because you're black.

Because you are presumed to be older than you are if you are a child and stronger and faster and more impervious to pain. Because you are black.

Because you are assumed to have gotten a job/scholarship/seat at a school because you are black and not because you are a well qualified candidate.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

How can you say that they didn't chase him with the intent to kill? They ran after him with guns in their hands. They claimed that they wanted to talk to him about a string of robberies. However, I heard that there were no robberies?

That they armed themselves before they went out to stop this guy is not sufficient evidence of their intent. If it was their intent, then they wouldn’t have done anything but simply shoot him when they saw him. But that’s not what the video shows. The shooting didn’t occur until Arbery grabbed the gun. There’s no real self defense argument because they created the situation illegally. But it’s not a premeditated murder. It’s manslaughter.

Any specific intent would need to be proved beyond a reasonable doubt. You need a statement from them beforehand or some other evidence to show that.

Definitely would need to get someone to admit it was premeditated. But I don't see the cops pushing that in an interrogation. These are good ole boys and they killed themselves a thug

I think it comes down to the video. Why in the heck did they record this thing?

There is definitely some pre-planning here. This doesn't seem like an out-of-the-blue sort of action by them. I know some people just love the power of being able to apprehend and force their will on others. So it could be as simple of wanting to play cops. But the video... why was that part of their plan? And of course, they could have originally intended to kill, but then the reality starts sinking in and it stops sounding like a good idea.

 

[Koyaanisqatsi]

Apparently, there is more evidence to support the charges.

https://www.ajc.com/news/crime--law/gbi-reviewing-new-video-footage-ahmaud-arbery-case/xvSWFTbaD0k9cr80R7CTnL/
...

“Ahmaud Arbery did not take part in any felony, had no illegal substances in his system, was not armed yet was shot three times with a shotgun at close range.”

How do you get shot three times with a shotgun accidentally? Once, maybe. Three times is not due to a struggle.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

Watching the surveillance video, I doubt very much that this guy was jogging. He walked up to the house, stops, waits a little and goes inside. It appears his "jogging" occurred after he noticed someone took notice of what he was doing.

He didn't commit much of a crime, other than trespassing, maybe looking for tools or something (not much to steal in a house under construction). And he certainly didn't deserve an armed couple going after him. Yes, he was probably nervous about getting caught. Yes, the armed neighbors broke the law in trying to apprehend a person who committed an act that likely wouldn't have meant much by a stern talking to by a cop.

 

[Koyaanisqatsi]

Watching the surveillance video, I doubt very much that this guy was jogging. He walked up to the house, stops, waits a little and goes inside. It appears his "jogging" occurred after he noticed someone took notice of what he was doing.

OR, he was jogging along, so the construction going on in the distance and simply decided to take a break from the job to look at the new place being built before continuing on his way. He's certainly not casing the joint as there is no joint yet to case. I have often gone up to construction sites to look at the floor plans and see what kinds of materials are being used, etc. But I'm white, so evidently I can do that without being killed or suspected of trying to steal tools.

Regardless, that footage in no way shows anyone clearly enough for any kind of positive ID, let alone barely plausible ID, let alone plausible enough ID that it justifies armed pursuit and three shotgun blasts.

 

[Trausti]

Ya know, that he wasn't jogging and that the father and son were criminally reckless can both be true.

 

[Elixir]

Ya know, that he wasn't jogging and that the father and son were criminally reckless can both be true.

That he wasn't jogging and that the father and son were racist bastards committing a heinous hate crime known as premeditated murder-1, can both be true.
Or, as a libberpublican might say - they were possibly criminally negligent in their pursuit of justice.

 

[Trausti]

Ya know, that he wasn't jogging and that the father and son were criminally reckless can both be true.

That he wasn't jogging and that the father and son were racist bastards committing a heinous hate crime known as premeditated murder-1, can both be true.
Or, as a libberpublican might say - they were possibly criminally negligent in their pursuit of justice.

Well, not premeditated murder. Recklessness for sure.

 

[ZiprHead]

Watching the surveillance video, I doubt very much that this guy was jogging. He walked up to the house, stops, waits a little and goes inside. It appears his "jogging" occurred after he noticed someone took notice of what he was doing.

OR, he was jogging along, so the construction going on in the distance and simply decided to take a break from the job to look at the new place being built before continuing on his way. He's certainly not casing the joint as there is no joint yet to case. I have often gone up to construction sites to look at the floor plans and see what kinds of materials are being used, etc. But I'm white, so evidently I can do that without being killed or suspected of trying to steal tools.

Regardless, that footage in no way shows anyone clearly enough for any kind of positive ID, let alone barely plausible ID, let alone plausible enough ID that it justifies armed pursuit and three shotgun blasts.

Some friends of mine and I went into a house under construction once when we were teenagers. Not to steal anything, just cuz we were bored teenagers and wanted to look around.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

Watching the surveillance video, I doubt very much that this guy was jogging. He walked up to the house, stops, waits a little and goes inside. It appears his "jogging" occurred after he noticed someone took notice of what he was doing.

OR, he was jogging along, so the construction going on in the distance and simply decided to take a break from the job to look at the new place being built before continuing on his way.

He was walking. The video shows him clearly not running, and arguably not dressed for running. He walks past the house to where the driveway is, turns, ponders a little then walks into it.

He's certainly not casing the joint as there is no joint yet to case.

My guess is that he was looking for construction tools.

I have often gone up to construction sites to look at the floor plans and see what kinds of materials are being used, etc. But I'm white, so evidently I can do that without being killed or suspected of trying to steal tools.

The other part is that he storms out of the home, likely after he noticed someone was looking at him and on a phone. This implies what he mindset was.

Regardless, that footage in no way shows anyone clearly enough for any kind of positive ID, let alone barely plausible ID, let alone plausible enough ID that it justifies armed pursuit and three shotgun blasts.

It does fit the timeline tightly. It does NOT provide a single shred of evidence he committed a felony. And it certainly doesn't demonstrate his death was in any imaginable way justified.

But, after looking at the video, I have significant doubts that he was jogging. This matters to me because it presents a cause of a person being out, independent of anything, being confronted by armed idiots and then dying. This story doesn't seem that simple from this additional video. Though I'd love to find out why this video was leaked in the first place, as it seems to have been done at the shooter's benefit.

So once again, black person shot and killed needlessly in a confrontation started by others... and the investigators are making the case for the defense.

 

[Toni]

No, the intent to kill is not a requirement for felony murder. The rather, as long as you are committing an inherently dangerous felony that results in the death of someone, then you have committed felony murder. Suppose, you commit armed burglary and your gun goes off, it's felony murder. Or suppose you rob a bank and then while fleeing, you run over a pedestrian, that is felony murder. Indeed, this is one of the reasons these statutes are controversial.

But they weren’t committing a felony in stopping him. They weren’t trying to rob him. They wanted to stop him. They had no right to stop him, but asking someone to stop is not a felony.

What’s the specific felony?

It seems likely that they were committing a felony by demanding he stop while they were obviously armed: https://www.criminaldefenselawyer.c...minal-offense/georgia-aggravated-assault-laws

 

[blastula]

Watching the surveillance video, I doubt very much that this guy was jogging. He walked up to the house, stops, waits a little and goes inside. It appears his "jogging" occurred after he noticed someone took notice of what he was doing.

Regardless, that footage in no way shows anyone clearly enough for any kind of positive ID, let alone barely plausible ID, let alone plausible enough ID that it justifies armed pursuit and three shotgun blasts.

It's a definite ID. The footage shows someone who looks like Arbery wearing the same clothes that Arbery was wearing when he was shot minutes later in same neighborhood.

 

[barbos]

No, the intent to kill is not a requirement for felony murder. The rather, as long as you are committing an inherently dangerous felony that results in the death of someone, then you have committed felony murder. Suppose, you commit armed burglary and your gun goes off, it's felony murder. Or suppose you rob a bank and then while fleeing, you run over a pedestrian, that is felony murder. Indeed, this is one of the reasons these statutes are controversial.

But they weren’t committing a felony in stopping him. They weren’t trying to rob him. They wanted to stop him. They had no right to stop him, but asking someone to stop is not a felony.

What’s the specific felony?

It seems likely that they were committing a felony by demanding he stop while they were obviously armed: https://www.criminaldefenselawyer.c...minal-offense/georgia-aggravated-assault-laws

your link does not forbid demanding to stop while armed. Police does it all the time. And these two assholes claim they were making citizen arrest which is legal in Georgia.

 

[Jokodo]

Watching the surveillance video, I doubt very much that this guy was jogging. He walked up to the house, stops, waits a little and goes inside. It appears his "jogging" occurred after he noticed someone took notice of what he was doing.

OR, he was jogging along, so the construction going on in the distance and simply decided to take a break from the job to look at the new place being built before continuing on his way. He's certainly not casing the joint as there is no joint yet to case. I have often gone up to construction sites to look at the floor plans and see what kinds of materials are being used, etc. But I'm white, so evidently I can do that without being killed or suspected of trying to steal tools.

Regardless, that footage in no way shows anyone clearly enough for any kind of positive ID, let alone barely plausible ID, let alone plausible enough ID that it justifies armed pursuit and three shotgun blasts.

Some friends of mine and I went into a house under construction once when we were teenagers. Not to steal anything, just cuz we were bored teenagers and wanted to look around.

My ex-girlfriend, going home drunk one night, climbed the fence of a construction site and stole a shovel (only to leave it behind in a dark corner two streets when she got a bad case of "what the fuck am I doing here"), just because it seemed like a good idea to her drunken self.

A good thing she wasn't a black man, or I'd have had to shoot her dead in self-defense as soon as she told me.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

Young white people doing it, "Boys will be boys".

Young black people doing it, "THUGS!!!"

 

[Toni]

He was walking. The video shows him clearly not running, and arguably not dressed for running. He walks past the house to where the driveway is, turns, ponders a little then walks into it.

He's certainly not casing the joint as there is no joint yet to case.

My guess is that he was looking for construction tools.

I have often gone up to construction sites to look at the floor plans and see what kinds of materials are being used, etc. But I'm white, so evidently I can do that without being killed or suspected of trying to steal tools.

The other part is that he storms out of the home, likely after he noticed someone was looking at him and on a phone. This implies what he mindset was.

Regardless, that footage in no way shows anyone clearly enough for any kind of positive ID, let alone barely plausible ID, let alone plausible enough ID that it justifies armed pursuit and three shotgun blasts.

It does fit the timeline tightly. It does NOT provide a single shred of evidence he committed a felony. And it certainly doesn't demonstrate his death was in any imaginable way justified.

But, after looking at the video, I have significant doubts that he was jogging. This matters to me because it presents a cause of a person being out, independent of anything, being confronted by armed idiots and then dying. This story doesn't seem that simple from this additional video. Though I'd love to find out why this video was leaked in the first place, as it seems to have been done at the shooter's benefit.

So once again, black person shot and killed needlessly in a confrontation started by others... and the investigators are making the case for the defense.

He was hoping to be an electrician. I don't see him look around for tools but look instead at studs, etc. where he might be looking at electrical work.

 

[Toni]

It seems likely that they were committing a felony by demanding he stop while they were obviously armed: https://www.criminaldefenselawyer.c...minal-offense/georgia-aggravated-assault-laws

your link does not forbid demanding to stop while armed. Police does it all the time. And these two assholes claim they were making citizen arrest which is legal in Georgia.

From my link:

Assault is also any intentional act or threat of action that reasonably causes a person to feel afraid of impending violence. Threatening to beat up someone or to “break your arm,” when said in a menacing or angry manner, is assault if it appears that the assailant has the ability to carry out the threat and the victim believes or could reasonably believe that he is about to be struck or injured.

Aubery would only have considered they were trying to make a citizen's arrest if a) he had done anything criminal in nature and b) if his murderers had actually said: We're making a citizen's arrest and holding you here until the police arrive.