Woke is white arrogance

[KeepTalking]

And I think you have a preposterously single (simple?) minded view of woke. Your statement before made woke the reason for disliking the film, now we find that you dislike it for other reasons, and like some other woke films, but you still refuse to retract the statement. Why?

I didn't. Which defeats your following arguments. You read something into my post which I didn't say.

Now, getting back to that issue you seem to have identified with how I think taste in films should work. You are wrong. I am very aware of the complexity of human taste, and I did not for a second think that you disliked the film because it was woke. I do think you make absolute statements like that in order to bolster your argument against what you perceive to be woke. My responses have been to get you to see that making such absolute statements do not help your argument, and rather do it harm by making it very easy to poke holes in that argument. I would hope that pointing that out would get you to stop doing that, so we can really talk about the issue. Doing so might also help point out those errors to others. Either or both of those hopes might be entirely futile in this case, but what the hell, I enjoy clapping with one hand as much as the next guy.

You projected absolutism onto my posts. I'm sure you did it to make it easier to poke holes in them. But I'm not going to defend things I didn't say, or defend positions I never held just to make life easier for you.

Well, it's a good thing this board saves our posts, and provides a handy quote function for times like these:

BTW, Oldboy is a Korean, not woke, film which Lee made an awful American remake of, making it woke, and thereby stupid.

There is your absolute statement that the film is stupid because it is woke. You said it, own up to it.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

I'm curious, what is a woke movie anyway?

The Help, Hidden Figures, Guess Who's Coming to Dinner, Schindler's List, Annie (Jamie Fox film), Captain Marvel, Kramer v Kramer, That Thing You Do? What makes a movie "woke"?

It also doesn't help your case that you aren't even considering the currently most successful Black Director - Tyler Perry. He bypassed the gatekeepers and became a gatekeeper himself.

Tyler Perry is crazy. He has produced so much trash, like Oprah, but managed to do such a good job at it, he isn't quite a mogul yet, but he is heading there. He'll probably start producing great films in a few years.

 

[Gospel]

It also doesn't help your case that you aren't even considering the currently most successful Black Director - Tyler Perry. He bypassed the gatekeepers and became a gatekeeper himself.

Tyler Perry is crazy. He has produced so much trash, like Oprah, but managed to do such a good job at it, he isn't quite a mogul yet, but he is heading there. He'll probably start producing great films in a few years.

I agree he's crazy however I disagree with him not being a mogul. That depends on what your skin color is and whether Holywood wants your work.

 

[KeepTalking]

I'm curious, what is a woke movie anyway?

That's a damn good question, but I would not hold my breath waiting for an answer. We have yet to get a consistent definition of woke itself from DrZ, after all.

 

[laughing dog]

From what I can tell, "woke" is like pornography for some people because they know it when they see it. The problem is that they are often mistaken.

 

[Gospel]

I'm curious, what is a woke movie anyway?

That's a damn good question, but I would not hold my breath waiting for an answer. We have yet to get a consistent definition of woke itself from DrZ, after all.

It doesn't matter when he won't even consider any examples of Black Directors not doing the thing he claims they all do and only accepts his own examples. I wouldn't be shocked if DrZoidberg thought the Black Panther movie was woke because it was about a black superhero from Africa. The fact it was written and directed by Ryan Coogler (Black) and is considered the most successful Black directed film of all time isn't a worthy example against his "wokeness" controls what black directors can and can't do argument.

 

[Gospel]

It also doesn't help your case that you aren't even considering the currently most successful Black Director - Tyler Perry. He bypassed the gatekeepers and became a gatekeeper himself.

Tyler Perry is crazy. He has produced so much trash, like Oprah, but managed to do such a good job at it, he isn't quite a mogul yet, but he is heading there. He'll probably start producing great films in a few years.

I agree he's crazy however I disagree with him not being a mogul. That depends on what your skin color is and whether Holywood wants your work.

BTW, By crazy I mean amazing.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

I agree he's crazy however I disagree with him not being a mogul. That depends on what your skin color is and whether Holywood wants your work.

BTW, By crazy I mean amazing.

You need to be extraordinarily wealthy to be a mogul. He has accomplished ridiculous levels of success, which is what I meant by crazy... well that success with such awful films.

 

[Gospel]

I agree he's crazy however I disagree with him not being a mogul. That depends on what your skin color is and whether Holywood wants your work.

BTW, By crazy I mean amazing.

You need to be extraordinarily wealthy to be a mogul. He has accomplished ridiculous levels of success, which is what I meant by crazy... well that success with such awful films.

Yeah, awful films and an awful start from poverty to knocking on 10th most successful Director in the world in just 30 years. Have you been to Dinsey holly Wood Studios Orlando? Add about 70 Acres to that and that's His Studio in Atalanta. 30 years with crap movies... From Porverty. That's just Crazy. But, It's what "woke" gets ya I guess.

Edit: Mogul = an important or powerful person, especially in the motion picture or media industry.

Doesn't say wealth. And trust me, Perry is very important & powerful when it comes to a lot of current and up-and-coming Black Directors.

 

[Emily Lake]

Awe look, it's another take on history from a white person's point of view. Don't yall have enough of that already? Gosh.

Edit: Removed Curse

I'm just gonna flip that script on you for a moment, and point out that pretty much ALL of history is from a MALE point of view, which y'all certainly have enough of. But somehow y'all don't seem all that on board with giving more consideration and credence to the FEMALE point of view.

 

[Gospel]

Awe look, it's another take on history from a white person's point of view. Don't yall have enough of that already? Gosh.

Edit: Removed Curse

I'm just gonna flip that script on you for a moment, and point out that pretty much ALL of history is from a MALE point of view, which y'all certainly have enough of. But somehow y'all don't seem all that on board with giving more consideration and credence to the FEMALE point of view.

How is that a flip when I made no claim to the contrary?

 

[Emily Lake]

Awe look, it's another take on history from a white person's point of view. Don't yall have enough of that already? Gosh.

Edit: Removed Curse

I'm just gonna flip that script on you for a moment, and point out that pretty much ALL of history is from a MALE point of view, which y'all certainly have enough of. But somehow y'all don't seem all that on board with giving more consideration and credence to the FEMALE point of view.

How is that a flip when I made no claim to the contrary?

It's my complaint about the one-sidedness of the entire enchilada. I'm currently very dissatisfied with the treatment of women in developed nations, let alone in developing and distressed nations. In a discussion about racial dynamics in the US, everybody has an opinion, and most people want to fix things. Nobody seems to give a flying fuck about women though.

So I'm prickly.

 

[Politesse]

How is that a flip when I made no claim to the contrary?

It's my complaint about the one-sidedness of the entire enchilada. I'm currently very dissatisfied with the treatment of women in developed nations, let alone in developing and distressed nations. In a discussion about racial dynamics in the US, everybody has an opinion, and most people want to fix things. Nobody seems to give a flying fuck about women though.

So I'm prickly.

And apparently unaware that many Blacks are, in fact, women?

 

[ZiprHead]

How is that a flip when I made no claim to the contrary?

It's my complaint about the one-sidedness of the entire enchilada. I'm currently very dissatisfied with the treatment of women in developed nations, let alone in developing and distressed nations. In a discussion about racial dynamics in the US, everybody has an opinion, and most people want to fix things. Nobody seems to give a flying fuck about women though.

So I'm prickly.

And apparently unaware that many Blacks are, in fact, women?

You coulda' knocked me over with a feather.

 

[Trausti]

How is that a flip when I made no claim to the contrary?

It's my complaint about the one-sidedness of the entire enchilada. I'm currently very dissatisfied with the treatment of women in developed nations, let alone in developing and distressed nations. In a discussion about racial dynamics in the US, everybody has an opinion, and most people want to fix things. Nobody seems to give a flying fuck about women though.

So I'm prickly.

And apparently unaware that many Blacks are, in fact, women?

They’re on clearance now.

 

[WAB]

How is that a flip when I made no claim to the contrary?

It's my complaint about the one-sidedness of the entire enchilada. I'm currently very dissatisfied with the treatment of women in developed nations, let alone in developing and distressed nations. In a discussion about racial dynamics in the US, everybody has an opinion, and most people want to fix things. Nobody seems to give a flying fuck about women though.

So I'm prickly.

And apparently unaware that many Blacks are, in fact, women?

Sure, it's obvious Emily doesn't know that some women are black.

 

[Gospel]

How is that a flip when I made no claim to the contrary?

It's my complaint about the one-sidedness of the entire enchilada. I'm currently very dissatisfied with the treatment of women in developed nations, let alone in developing and distressed nations. In a discussion about racial dynamics in the US, everybody has an opinion, and most people want to fix things. Nobody seems to give a flying fuck about women though.

So I'm prickly.

I can dig it.

 

[Jarhyn]

And apparently unaware that many Blacks are, in fact, women?

They’re on clearance now.

Bullshit, that wine is white AF

 

[Arctish]

And apparently unaware that many Blacks are, in fact, women?

They’re on clearance now.

Bullshit, that wine is white AF

 

[DrZoidberg]

For the record DrZoidberg, I agree with your overall premise that there exists a selection bias, or as I'd put it, gatekeepers limiting access for Balck Directors. This has been going on long before the "woke" era so I don't care for including "wokeness" in the debate. My assertion is that regardless of said selection bias, Black Directors are making movies they want to make. Do you think it possible that just maybe the sort of movies Black Directors want to make is part of the reason why selection bias still exists?

Thanks for taking your time to understand the nuances in what I'm saying. You are a true hero among peers.

I never asserted it. I merely pointed out that, based on available evidence, either black American directors (almost) ONLY care about racism or there's a selection bias only allowing woke black directors to make movies. The second one is tokenism and racism, but held up by wokes as being evidence of a less racism. You know... structural racism.

Dousing the issue with "wokeness" is where our roads split DrZoidberg. Also, it's not as crazy as it used to be. More examples,

Woke is a project with a goal. Unless it's succeeding in that goal it's a waste of time. I maintain that all woke is, is replacing the real with the symbolic. And pretending like the repetition of woke slogans is actual progress. But all it does is making us all slaves to parroting the slogans. Maoism had the exact same psychological mechanic. People were so convinced that they were fighting for progress they were blind to the fact that they were making everything worse for everyone. As well as sacrificing freedom on the altar of progress.

It brings to mind feminist women bashing each other for not being feminist, solidarical or progressive enough, completely defeating the point of feminism to begin with, ie promoting increased freedoms for women.

I can name a few more but I'm at work and going off memory. Not to mention there are films I haven't watched or heard of. Another thing here is, you're going to see a lot of "woke" stuff in Black Films because there are real issues in the black community. Now I feel like I need to say the following for the All Lives Matter crowd, every community has its issues.

Well.. things aren't helped by that some people are actual racists. I do think that there's some in the All Lives Matter crowd who aren't racists. I know of one guy personally who chanted All Lives Matter during BLM who isn't racists. He's just sick of woke. I thought that was problematic. But not everybody's actions neatly match the ideological roadmap we have constructed for ourselves. We should all be free to try to understand the world as best we can, without being slammed with absolutes regarding what that MUST mean about us. There's nuances