Another Trump Rape Surfaces

[Toni]

Again, there's a pattern of behavior.

Again, pattern of behavior can work both ways. It can inspire somebody to make up claims that conform to the real or perceived pattern.

I may have mentioned it before, but I knew someone who was on his show as a contestant. This was before it became the "D List Celebrity Apprentice." He was a creep. As I recall, she said he told her that she was pretty, but "we gotta do something about those" and pointed at her chest. That's the sort of person he is. The Access Hollywood tape was a window into how he views women. He wasn't joking.

This isn't like the "well he always seemed like a quiet, nice person" case of the guy who turns out to be a serial killer. This is nobody being the least bit surprised that he tried to rape someone in a dressing room. Along with the women who have come forward, there's a lot of others who are nodding their heads and saying "yeah, that's the guy I met."

Is that enough to prosecute him for this incident? No, but it should be enough to disqualify him for the Presidency. Hell, it would disqualify him to be a mid level manager at any company with a semi-competent HR department.

Yes, Trump is an ass. Everybody knows that. But that does not prove he actually raped that particular woman in that particular department store.
The woman capitalizing on the 'pattern of behavior' in order to sell books fits the facts just as well.

Oh, sweetie: I realize you have never heard of her but I was so excited to hear she had a book coming out! She did not need this story to generate excitement or publicity for her book.

Trump is the one capitalizing on the latter of behavior: whatever he does, however repugnant or disgusting or treasonous, or criminal, there are people like you to make excuses for him and to blame women.

 

[Ford]

Again, pattern of behavior can work both ways. It can inspire somebody to make up claims that conform to the real or perceived pattern.



Yes, Trump is an ass. Everybody knows that. But that does not prove he actually raped that particular woman in that particular department store.
The woman capitalizing on the 'pattern of behavior' in order to sell books fits the facts just as well.

Oh, sweetie: I realize you have never heard of her but I was so excited to hear she had a book coming out! She did not need this story to generate excitement or publicity for her book.

Notice the fact that he excused sexual harassment as Trump merely being "an ass." And the fact that "everybody knows" makes it okay.

That's the mindset that's at work in both men. Leering at women, publicly judging their physical appearance, grabbing them, or attempting to force yourself on them are merely "locker room talk." The women were "asking for it." Or it's just no big deal because, hey, women, right?

And if it goes over the line into assault, attempted rape, or rape, the woman always has an ulterior motive. Or she's lying. Or she's bought into some radical feminist narrative. In any case, it's never the man's fault.

 

[Derec]

Notice the fact that he excused sexual harassment as Trump merely being "an ass." And the fact that "everybody knows" makes it okay.

Did I say it was ok? No, I did not.

And if it goes over the line into assault, attempted rape, or rape, the woman always has an ulterior motive. Or she's lying. Or she's bought into some radical feminist narrative. In any case, it's never the man's fault.

Nonsense. My point is that allegations need evidence. Even against Trump. And evidence for an allegation 23 years old is going to be impossible to get.

 

[Koyaanisqatsi]

Notice the fact that he excused sexual harassment as Trump merely being "an ass." And the fact that "everybody knows" makes it okay.

Did I say it was ok? No, I did not.

And if it goes over the line into assault, attempted rape, or rape, the woman always has an ulterior motive. Or she's lying. Or she's bought into some radical feminist narrative. In any case, it's never the man's fault.

Nonsense. My point is that allegations need evidence. Even against Trump. And evidence for an allegation 23 years old is going to be impossible to get.

Then just accept it as true in light of the fact that Trump has unquestionably molested other women. You can't even do that, can you? It means absolutely nothing, yet...

 

[laughing dog]

Notice the fact that he excused sexual harassment as Trump merely being "an ass." And the fact that "everybody knows" makes it okay.

Did I say it was ok? No, I did not.

And if it goes over the line into assault, attempted rape, or rape, the woman always has an ulterior motive. Or she's lying. Or she's bought into some radical feminist narrative. In any case, it's never the man's fault.

Nonsense. My point is that allegations need evidence. Even against Trump. And evidence for an allegation 23 years old is going to be impossible to get.

It will probably be impossible. But, as usual, you miss the point by nitpicking. Mr. Trump is not being arraigned in court of law. He is being judged in the court of opinion. While you are free to treat every allegation as a separate event, others are free to look at this allegation in the context of the many other allegations of sexual misconduct made against Mr. Trump and his own statements about his sex life. Most people think it is reasonable to judge this allegation in that context.

Is it believable that Mr. Trump actually raped this woman? I'd say given his history, the answer is yes.

 

[Toni]

Notice the fact that he excused sexual harassment as Trump merely being "an ass." And the fact that "everybody knows" makes it okay.

Did I say it was ok? No, I did not.

And if it goes over the line into assault, attempted rape, or rape, the woman always has an ulterior motive. Or she's lying. Or she's bought into some radical feminist narrative. In any case, it's never the man's fault.

Nonsense. My point is that allegations need evidence. Even against Trump. And evidence for an allegation 23 years old is going to be impossible to get.

This is not a criminal trial. She never pressed charges and does not intend to do so now. But she wrote about it in response to having so many women write about their own sexual assaults. She says she began to feel like a hypocrite for not disclosing. I listened to her interview on a long drive home. She sounded like she is still in a bit of denial. The opposite of trying to make a big deal of a minor incident that happened long ago. I understand that all too well.

 

[Ford]

Did I say it was ok? No, I did not.



Nonsense. My point is that allegations need evidence. Even against Trump. And evidence for an allegation 23 years old is going to be impossible to get.

This is not a criminal trial.

Yes, but you see...it was 23 years ago, which is well past the statute of limitations for the He Man Woman-Hater's Club.

Apparently, unless you rush right over to your local police department with photographic evidence, multiple witnesses, and you do it all before the...um...physical evidence dries, you were not in fact raped. Otherwise shut the fuck up and don't you ever dare accuse a man of sexual assault.

See how easy it is? hash tag sarcasm?

 

[Derec]

Yes, but you see...it was 23 years ago, which is well past the statute of limitations for the He Man Woman-Hater's Club.

It's also past the statute of limitations for the State of New York.

Apparently, unless you rush right over to your local police department with photographic evidence, multiple witnesses, and you do it all before the...um...physical evidence dries, you were not in fact raped. Otherwise shut the fuck up and don't you ever dare accuse a man of sexual assault.

See how easy it is? hash tag sarcasm?

The She Man Self-Hater's Club doesn't need evidence. If a woman says she was raped, that's all you people need.

 

[Patooka]

The only thing I can see in Trumps' defense is that E. Jean Carroll would have been 52 at the time of the assault. Not exactly Trumps' type. Everything else (including his ham fisted bullshit denial) however, is classic Trump.

 

[Derec]

This is not a criminal trial. She never pressed charges and does not intend to do so now. But she wrote about it in response to having so many women write about their own sexual assaults. She says she began to feel like a hypocrite for not disclosing. I listened to her interview on a long drive home. She sounded like she is still in a bit of denial. The opposite of trying to make a big deal of a minor incident that happened long ago. I understand that all too well.

I think her account is unbelievable. She wanted him to try some lingerie over his suit? That's why she followed him into the changing room? And then he was supposed to have raped her? And there were absolutely no sales associates anywhere around?
And note that she makes similar accusations against more than 10 other men, as well as a seven year old boy. In a book she titled "what are men good for". She strikes me as a man-hating radfem. Andrea Dworkin herself, a few years before her death, made up a fantastical story about being raped as well. At the same age too, although Dworkin looked much much worse. And she didn't accuse a president, just a French bartender.

 

[Derec]

It will probably be impossible. But, as usual, you miss the point by nitpicking. Mr. Trump is not being arraigned in court of law. He is being judged in the court of opinion.

Ah yes, the court of public opinion. Where what actually happened is irrelevant and the evidence doesn't matter.

While you are free to treat every allegation as a separate event, others are free to look at this allegation in the context of the many other allegations of sexual misconduct made against Mr. Trump and his own statements about his sex life. Most people think it is reasonable to judge this allegation in that context.

That's a fallacy, because the accuser is aware of these other allegations too. Thus, it could be a copycat allegation.

Is it believable that Mr. Trump actually raped this woman? I'd say given his history, the answer is yes.

Is it believable that President Trump actually raped a woman? Yes. This woman? I doubt it very much. The timing is suspect, and the story doesn't make much sense. Also, kind of like Dr. Ford, she has a hard time remembering when exactly the alleged assault allegedly happened. Was in 1995 or perhaps 1996? She doesn't know.

 

[Trausti]

The face of the #resistance. Think of the fantasies. Egad.

 

[Derec]

The only thing I can see in Trumps' defense is that E. Jean Carroll would have been 52 at the time of the assault. Not exactly Trumps' type. Everything else (including his ham fisted bullshit denial) however, is classic Trump.

She looks rough now, but if this photo is really from mid-90s she didn't look bad back then. So that is not an argument really. The timing, her lack of memory about when it's supposed to have happened and the sheer unbelievability of the scenario are arguments against the credibility of the accusation.

 

[Koyaanisqatsi]

If a woman says she was raped, that's all you people need.

To accept that she's probably not lying. Do you understand the difference between accepting someone may not be lying, while at the same time understanding that something has not been proved in a court of law beyond a reasonable degree of doubt?

No, you clearly do not. I can easily believe her story based on who she is and who Trump is in a "yeah, that's worth investigating" kind of way; i.e., a temporary acceptance for the sake of exploring the allegation further. She has zero reason to lie about something like that. She is already a well-respected, nationally famous author. Has been one for decades. It wasn't just Trump she accused, but no one's focusing on that of course.

Does that mean I believe it's been proved beyond a reasonable doubt? Of course not. I believe it enough for there to be an investigation if she were to press charges.

You don't believe her at all. Fine. But the reason you don't is very clearly tied to your history of misogyny, not some noble legal crusade.

See how that works? You have no credibility based on your posting history. She has--for now at least--full credibility, based on her years of being a journalist and author.

Does that just axiomatically mean I think the case has been proved? Of course not.

You are ironically doing precisely what you accuse us of doing, just in reverse. But that's not what's going on. No one here thinks that her claim is just automatically proved true because she spoke.

Now by all means, point to others out there in the world that may think that way as a justification for your own summary dismissal, but all you're doing is saying you're as bad as they are.

I believe she's credible. I believe she has no reason to lie, but know it's possible. I believe Trump is more than capable of doing such an act. I do not believe this has all been proved beyond a reasonable doubt in a court of law.

 

[Elixir]

"She's not the woman I would rape - I'd definitely rape someone else instead."

- Donald Trump

There are fine arguments on both sides, obviously. Maybe he would have raped her, maybe he would have raped someone else.
Meanwhile, the economy is almost as good as it was under Obama, so let's re-elect the rapist.

 

[southernhybrid]

Do some of you men not understand that rape has nothing to do with a woman being someone's type? Women in their 80s have been raped by much younger men. Are 80 year women a younger man's type? Or do they consider 80 year old women just easy prey?

When I was working in long term care, a 60 year old man convinced an 85 year old woman who suffered from fairly advanced dementia, to perform oral sex on him. One of the aides walked into the room late at night and witnessed this, but management blamed the woman for what happened. Eventually, after the man was found attempting to harass other women, he was removed from the facility. Sadly, that is very common and that is why so many women don't even bother to report rape to the police, and instead only tell a close female friend or two. They are often treated as if they are the criminals. Rape kits aren't used in many cases. Hospital staff are sometimes part of the problem too, and just about every single male predator strongly denies that he raped the victim. Without the evidence that a rape kit can often provide, it's all he said/she said. Sadly, many people choose to believe the man, regardless of any circumstantial evidence.

And then, there's always the victim blaming. Why was she out so late at night? Why was she wearing that sexy outfit. Why did she agree to enter the dressing room with a man? Why did she take a ride from someone she barely knew? And, the thing is that what a woman is wearing rarely if ever has a thing to do with why a man rapes a particular woman. Sexual predators are looking for easy targets. Men who are celebrities or very wealthy etc. often seem to have the idea that women are there for them to use and abuse. Trump bragged how his status allowed him to sexually assault women. Why on earth would anyone believe this serial rapist, who has told over 10,000 lies since taking office, is telling the truth? These women have a lot more credibility than Trump does.

 

[Koyaanisqatsi]

Indeed. A LOT of idiots still don't understand that sex has nothing to do with rape. It's just the weapon used.

 

[laughing dog]

Ah yes, the court of public opinion. Where what actually happened is irrelevant and the evidence doesn't matter.

I realize that is true in your world.

That's a fallacy, because the accuser is aware of these other allegations too. Thus, it could be a copycat allegation.

You don't know what the accuser is aware of. And, of course, any kind of reasoning without complete knowledge can lead to wrong conclusion.

Is it believable that President Trump actually raped a woman? Yes. This woman? I doubt it very much. The timing is suspect, and the story doesn't make much sense. Also, kind of like Dr. Ford, she has a hard time remembering when exactly the alleged assault allegedly happened. Was in 1995 or perhaps 1996? She doesn't know.

It is believable that Mr. Trump actually raped women. You are free to doubt whatever you want. As am I, and I doubt you would believe this woman even if she had a videotape of the alleged rape.

 

[Keith&Co.]

If they're aware of other allegations, then it could be assumed they're aware of the death threats those allegators have suffered through exactly because of those allegations.
So far, I'm unaware of anyone gaining one dollar from a rape allegation aimed at Bonespurs.
So what would be the motivation in leveling a false allegation? A desire for death threats, a need to move houses, no profits, no impact on Trump's freedom/wealth/reputation among fans...?

I could kinda see copycat efforts at something that was successful, but copying something that just gets you shit upon? Why?

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

"She's not the woman I would rape - I'd definitely rape someone else instead."

- Donald Trump

There are fine arguments on both sides, obviously. Maybe he would have raped her, maybe he would have raped someone else.
Meanwhile, the economy is almost as good as it was under Obama, so let's re-elect the rapist.

Trump went to that well before... "She isn't my type". Which is pretty much a confession.