Covid-19 miscellany

[Don2 (Don1 Revised)]

This maskhole is what is known in the business as a piece of work.


[TWEET]https://twitter.com/jfreewright/status/1384177048030089227?s=20[/TWEET]


Fuller video here, and a news report here.

Police officer: "Do you have a middle name?"
Qaren: "Do YOU have a middle name?"

 

[ZiprHead]

I like how she's got the circular Karen head movement down pat.

 

[blastula]

“I have had flu symptoms for the last 10 days. I thought I was dying. I mean, just a clusterfuck,” Nugent said in the video. “I got the Chinese shit.”

One might say the Chinese shit fever has got a stranglehold on him baby.

*I do not wish him well.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

Maybe this will help poor Ted choose.

View attachment 33034

Needs updating--the Chinese stuff is also crap.

 

[DrZoidberg]

Today Denmark went back to normal. In order to go to restaurants and anything involving crowds you need to be able to show a recent test. There's a handy app for it put out by the Danish government.


https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-56812293

 

[Angra Mainyu]

Maybe this will help poor Ted choose.

View attachment 33034

Needs updating--the Chinese stuff is also crap.

Evidence of all of the above?

1. Why is Pfizer better than Moderna?
2. Why is AstraZeneca better than Sputnik, and both crap (or at least Sputnik) ?
3. Why are all Chinese vaccines crap?

I'm interested particularly in 2. and 3., so I will decline a vaccine when I'm finally eligible (probably in a rather distant future, anyway), and will recommend my mother not to get one (right now).

(of course, I'm not actually going to do that unless you support the above claims, which seems pretty improbable but I'm all ears).

 

[DrZoidberg]

Maybe this will help poor Ted choose.

View attachment 33034

Needs updating--the Chinese stuff is also crap.

Evidence of all of the above?

1. Why is Pfizer better than Moderna?
2. Why is AstraZeneca better than Sputnik, and both crap (or at least Sputnik) ?
3. Why are all Chinese vaccines crap?

I'm interested particularly in 2. and 3., so I will decline a vaccine when I'm finally eligible (probably in a rather distant future, anyway), and will recommend my mother not to get one (right now).

(of course, I'm not actually going to do that unless you support the above claims, which seems pretty improbable but I'm all ears).

It's just racism, or rather Euro-/Americentricsm. Anything western is good. Anything produced by those who talk funny in action movies is bad.

The development of Sputnik is interesting. When Moderna and Pfizer announced they had a vaccine candidate we were cool with it. But when Russia announced it, we all got suspicious. Because of the fact that Russia has a bad image. A deserved bad image. Then Russia released their test results. And it was above board. Most of us didn't want to believe it. So they were scrutinized very closely by western scientists. Turned out the Sputnik was fine. But the image has stuck

 

[Loren Pechtel]

Needs updating--the Chinese stuff is also crap.

Evidence of all of the above?

1. Why is Pfizer better than Moderna?

There isn't really much difference. They came out 1% apart which could easily be statistical noise.

2. Why is AstraZeneca better than Sputnik, and both crap (or at least Sputnik) ?

Haven't you seen the reports of wildly inconsistent product being labeled Sputnik V? One manufacturer, every dose should look alike. Something is seriously wrong.

3. Why are all Chinese vaccines crap?

Because of how little protection they provide. Amazingly, China has even admitted they aren't very good.

I'm interested particularly in 2. and 3., so I will decline a vaccine when I'm finally eligible (probably in a rather distant future, anyway), and will recommend my mother not to get one (right now).

(of course, I'm not actually going to do that unless you support the above claims, which seems pretty improbable but I'm all ears).

This leaves a bit to be desired as the yardsticks to measure effectiveness vary:

part of:

https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jama/fullarticle/2777059

As for declining a vaccine: The only one of these I would actually decline is Sputnik V and that's because I don't trust that you're getting what you're supposed to be getting. All of these are far better than nothing. Sure, there's a slight risk--but that's nothing compared to the risk of Covid.

 

[Angra Mainyu]

There isn't really much difference. They came out 1% apart which could easily be statistical noise.

Yeah, that's what I read. There seems to be a big difference in terms of preservation requirements, though. Moderna's can be kept at much higher temperatures and for much longer (unless Pfizer messed up and required much stricter conditions than actually needed to preserve the vaccine).

Haven't you seen the reports of wildly inconsistent product being labeled Sputnik V? One manufacturer, every dose should look alike. Something is seriously wrong.

I have seen a claim by Slovakia that Sputnik vaccines they were given were different from those used in other samples. That would not imply the Sputnik vaccine is crap, but - if the claims are true - those given to Slovakia are probably not as good as the ones tested, and I'm not sure how good or bad they would be. As for those in other countries, well that would require testing. Again, that would not imply it's crap, or come anywhere near establishing it's crap. For all I know, the ones used over here might be as good as those tested, or worse but still far from crap. Or they might be crap, but that does not appear probable.

On the other hand, I've also seen plenty of claims against AstraZeneca, including quality issues, blod clots, among others.

That aside, the overall effectiveness in tests is higher for Sputnik than AstraZeneca so far.

Because of how little protection they provide. Amazingly, China has even admitted they aren't very good.

There are several different Chinese vaccines, and they show different degrees of effectivness in tests. At any rate, the amount of protection any of these vaccines provides against serious disease and death is usually higher than it is against symptomatic infection, and the latter higher than it is against infection. Something that makes you far less likely to die of covid without significant side effects isn't crap.

A Chinese official said they do not have high protection rates; probably that was not authorized, so nothing amazing here. It is of course evidence against them, but saying they're crap is jumping to conclusions. If the effectiveness is the lowest in known tests so far (79% against symptomatic infections), Sinopharm still is considerably better than AZ and J&J. And if it's a whole 10 percentage points lower than the worst trial results, it's still about on par with AZ (see the data in your post). Now, that might not pan out in the end, but crap level seems pretty improbable.

This leaves a bit to be desired as the yardsticks to measure effectiveness vary:

From what I read, the 50.38% was against infection, not against mild disease. Another source here https://edition.cnn.com/2021/01/17/asia/sinovac-vaccine-asia-efficacy-intl-hnk/index.html says "very mild", but 78% in "mild to severe". This may be a case of apples to oranges, since the other vaccines are less effective against symptomatic cases.

At any rate, that's Sinovac. Let's say that one is crap. Sinopharm is a different animal. Not all Chinese vaccines are the same. Your own link shows an efficacy for SF greater than that of AZ and J&J in trials so far. Granted, that is preliminary evidence, not conclusive. But it certainly is not evidence that SP is crap.

As for declining a vaccine: The only one of these I would actually decline is Sputnik V and that's because I don't trust that you're getting what you're supposed to be getting. All of these are far better than nothing. Sure, there's a slight risk--but that's nothing compared to the risk of Covid.

But again, the risk that the Sputnik vaccine would be bad and significantly hurt you (you don't see people getting killed or seriously ill as a result of using it, right?) is almost zero, whereas the probability that it will provide a good degree of protection is high. If people here did what you would, we would very probably have more fatalities, though it's unclear how many more; after all, there are still too few Sputnik doses anyway.


By the way, the vaccines that are sometimes available here (now they're out, it seems, but eventually more will come) are Sputnik, AZ and SP. People who qualify to get one cannot choose which one, and probably most people will not be eligible for any of them for a long time. Eventually, if the Sputnik vaccines begin to be produced locally - partially at first, completely eventually - (and that's a big if; that's the plan, but plans here often fail), I might have a chance of getting one (there is a good chance I'll get infected before that happens if I didn't already, of course, as it's likely to take a very long time). Getting a Sinopharm or AZ seems considerably less likely, though it might happen. The rest are completely out of reach.

 

[Jokodo]

There isn't really much difference. They came out 1% apart which could easily be statistical noise.

2. Why is AstraZeneca better than Sputnik, and both crap (or at least Sputnik) ?

Haven't you seen the reports of wildly inconsistent product being labeled Sputnik V? One manufacturer, every dose should look alike. Something is seriously wrong.

3. Why are all Chinese vaccines crap?

Because of how little protection they provide. Amazingly, China has even admitted they aren't very good.

I'm interested particularly in 2. and 3., so I will decline a vaccine when I'm finally eligible (probably in a rather distant future, anyway), and will recommend my mother not to get one (right now).

(of course, I'm not actually going to do that unless you support the above claims, which seems pretty improbable but I'm all ears).

This leaves a bit to be desired as the yardsticks to measure effectiveness vary:

part of:

https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jama/fullarticle/2777059

As for declining a vaccine: The only one of these I would actually decline is Sputnik V and that's because I don't trust that you're getting what you're supposed to be getting. All of these are far better than nothing. Sure, there's a slight risk--but that's nothing compared to the risk of Covid.

Unless I'm misreading, according to your table, the efficacy of Sputnik V is actually higher than AZ and J&J and in the same reagion as Biontech-Pfizer/Moderna...

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

I think Loren is saying Sputnik V works, but you don't actually know if that vile contains Sputnik V.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

Unless I'm misreading, according to your table, the efficacy of Sputnik V is actually higher than AZ and J&J and in the same reagion as Biontech-Pfizer/Moderna...

My problem with Sputink is quality control--what Slovakia reported is a shut-down-the-production-lines-now type event and Russia dismissed it. I also want to see effectiveness numbers from someone other than Russia--we've already seen the Chinese vaccine didn't perform nearly as well as claimed.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

I think Loren is saying Sputnik V works, but you don't actually know if that vile contains Sputnik V.

Yeah, that's my biggest problem with it. I don't really trust the Russian numbers but that wouldn't stop me from getting it. Not trusting what was in the vial, though, is quite another matter.

 

[Elixir]

a slight risk--but that's nothing compared to the risk of Covid.

That's what I don't get about turning down a vaccination - especially from the "I don't know what's in it" crowd.
Not only is it rather easy to find out what's in it, but there is more than sufficient data to indicate that the most severe reactions known, after after hundreds of millions of doses administered, are minuscule threats compared to what accrues to COVID patients, and even the asymptomatic cases.
I see declining the vaccine as an abdication of responsibility to the human race, as well as a stupid decision.
And they (we) are not even my favorite species.

 

[ZiprHead]

John Fugelsang has a nightly show on Sirius XM. He got his second covid vaccination yesterday morning. He had to leave his program last night because he was so ill, the first time he's ever done that. He was on the Stephanie Miller show this morning and said he felt much better.

 

[TSwizzle]

You wouldn’t know it from the msm but tens of thousands (probably a lot more) marched in protest in London (and other cities in the UK) against the lockdown, vaccine passports and the “new normal”.

 

[ZiprHead]

Tens of thousands of idiots.

 

[lpetrich]

I marvel at some right-wingers' hostility to lower-face masks and vaccine passports, because it's stuff like those things that make lockdowns much less necessary. I also marvel at such people pooh-poohing the COVID-19 virus as nothing serious while calling it the "China Virus" and insisting that the ChiComs are somehow to blame with it. That virus is either very horrible or not very horrible. Which is it?

 

[TomC]

You wouldn’t know it from the msm but tens of thousands (probably a lot more) marched in protest in London (and other cities in the UK) against the lockdown, vaccine passports and the “new normal”.

Well, of course, they're not worried about it.

With the extra £315,000,000/ wk for NHS they got from Brexit they can build a new hospital every time someone gets sick.
Tom

 

[TSwizzle]

32 “covid deaths” in the UK, “ cases” falling but the anti science authoritarians still cling to power.