Poll Dem VP Pic: your choice?

[Derec]

I know you don’t quite grasp but until 2020, there were ZERO women as VP or POTUS. Until 2008, there were ZERO persons of color as POTUS or VP.

That doesn't mean that now there should be some sort of "payback" in excluding white men from being presidential, vice-presidential or SCOTUS nominees in the Democratic Party.

I will admit that I threw in that bit about AOC specifically for you but it’s not a bad idea.

Not a bad idea ... if you want to lose.

 

[Derec]

Didn't former SCOTUS Justice Ginsberg make a note about wanting nine women on the SCOTUS bench.

Well, all of the Democratic justices are women, so it seems Democrats have embraced her sexist notion.

Btw, her name is Ginsburg. Fortified city, not a hill.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

I've demonstrated the geographic and electoral benefit of Whitmer being on the ticket and Harris being on the ticket. I have not suggested the ticket has to be all female, rather I'm suggesting it could be possible to reduce the misogyny with it being all-female.

It sure sounded to me like you were advocating for an all-female ticket.

Yes, I can understand how you would think that. And one would need to ignore most of my posts in this thread to come to that conclusion.

Putting a male running mate with Harris going to swing the male vote?

It would reduce the perception that Dems are ignoring men, especially white men.

Ignoring?! Is it time to grab our Tiki Torches? Wait, isn't the current President a white male?!

Look at SCOTUS. Biden pledged to only consider black women, even though the last two Dem justices were women as well. Same for Veep when he nominated Kamala - no men needed to apply. Same when Gov. Goodhair pledged to only consider black women to replace Diane Feinstein in the Senate.
There is a clear pattern of bias, and saying that an all-female ticket would be preferable is perpetuating it.

Yes, having the first ever major party all female ticket in the history of our country will perpetuate that men don't matter and they will fling themselves off of tall buildings because they are all being replaced!

PA is in the Northeast. Michigan is in the Midwest. The average Midwestern voter is more conservative than the average Northeast voter.

That does not explain why the electoral help would be unidirectional.

Because NE Libs will likely be good with a more "moderate" selection, than a Midwest Lib would be with a more "liberal" selection.

 

[Toni]

I know you don’t quite grasp but until 2020, there were ZERO women as VP or POTUS. Until 2008, there were ZERO persons of color as POTUS or VP.

That doesn't mean that now there should be some sort of "payback" in excluding white men from being presidential, vice-presidential or SCOTUS nominees in the Democratic Party.

I will admit that I threw in that bit about AOC specifically for you but it’s not a bad idea.

Not a bad idea ... if you want to lose.

Payback??? Excluding men???

What about the notion that we should choose the best people for the job, regardless of their race or gender? That was just fine to say as long as everyone understood that the ‘best people’ were white men or at least, men.

But if you actually read my posts you’d see that I have worried that having two women on the top two slots of the ticket would be a bridge too far for too many people, just as having an openly gay person might be a bridge too far if the ticket also includes a woman, especially a woman of color.

It should NOT be an issue but here you are, proving my point.

 

[Toni]

I've demonstrated the geographic and electoral benefit of Whitmer being on the ticket and Harris being on the ticket. I have not suggested the ticket has to be all female, rather I'm suggesting it could be possible to reduce the misogyny with it being all-female.

It sure sounded to me like you were advocating for an all-female ticket.

Yes, I can understand how you would think that. And one would need to ignore most of my posts in this thread to come to that conclusion.

Putting a male running mate with Harris going to swing the male vote?

It would reduce the perception that Dems are ignoring men, especially white men.

Ignoring?! Is it time to grab our Tiki Torches? Isn't the current President a white male?!

Look at SCOTUS. Biden pledged to only consider black women, even though the last two Dem justices were women as well. Same for Veep when he nominated Kamala - no men needed to apply. Same when Gov. Goodhair pledged to only consider black women to replace Diane Feinstein in the Senate.
There is a clear pattern of bias, and saying that an all-female ticket would be preferable is perpetuating it.

Yes, having the first ever major party all female ticket in the history of our country will perpetuate that men don't matter and they will fling themselves off of tall buildings because they are all being replaced!

PA is in the Northeast. Michigan is in the Midwest. The average Midwestern voter is more conservative than the average Northeast voter.

That does not explain why the electoral help would be unidirectional.

Because NE Libs will likely be good with a more "moderate" selection, than a Midwest Lib would be with a more "liberal" selection.

Not sure I agree with that bolded part.

 

[Derec]

Payback??? Excluding men???

You said that it would be "misogyny" to pass over Whitmer. You also said that Dems should double down on women and POC candidates.

What about the notion that we should choose the best people for the job, regardless of their race or gender?

I agree with that. And yet most discussions of merits of Whitmer on here have been about how great an all-female ticket would be.

That was just fine to say as long as everyone understood that the ‘best people’ were white men or at least, men.

Never said that. But Dems have been excluding men from consideration lately. Biden refused to consider any men for running mate or for SCOTUS. Newsom only considered black women for Senate.

It should NOT be an issue but here you are, proving my point.

I agree that it should not be. At the same time, it is not "misogyny" if a man is selected as KH's running mate.

 

[pood]

This is still politics and in politics tickets are balanced. There is not going to be another woman on the ticket or a gay man. There is going to be a straight white man.

 

[Derec]

Yes, I can understand how you would think that. And one would need to ignore most of my posts in this thread to come to that conclusion.

You were not talking much about how great Whitmer as an individual would be, just how great a two-woman ticket would be.
So it is not a stretch to come to the conclusion I did.

Ignoring?! Is it time to grab our Tiki Torches? Wait, isn't the current President a white male?!

Probably the last white male Dem nominee for a while.

Because NE Libs will likely be good with a more "moderate" selection, than a Midwest Lib would be with a more "liberal" selection.

Even if we accept this claim, is Shapiro more left than Whitmer? She opposed a quite sensible pipeline after all.

 

[Derec]

Not sure I agree with that bolded part.

It's not bolded. There is still time to edit and add the missing ']' though.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

There is also the other route. VP Harris could name:

Spoiler

A GREAT WHITE SHARK

...as her running mate.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

Yes, I can understand how you would think that. And one would need to ignore most of my posts in this thread to come to that conclusion.

You were not talking much about how great Whitmer as an individual would be, just how great a two-woman ticket would be.

Again, you aren't reading my posts.

So it is not a stretch to come to the conclusion I did.

Yes it was. I hope your back is okay.

Ignoring?! Is it time to grab our Tiki Torches? Wait, isn't the current President a white male?!

Probably the last white male Dem nominee for a while.

Maybe. I'm not losing sleep over who the next Democrat nominee is going to be with Project 2025 on the horizon.

Because NE Libs will likely be good with a more "moderate" selection, than a Midwest Lib would be with a more "liberal" selection.

Even if we accept this claim, is Shapiro more left than Whitmer? She opposed a quite sensible pipeline after all.

I love laying pipe as much as the next guy, but jesus will you drop it?

 

[Toni]

Not sure I agree with that bolded part.

It's not bolded. There is still time to edit and add the missing ']' though.

Did it before I saw your post.

 

[Tigers!]

There is also the other route. VP Harris could name:

Spoiler

A GREAT WHITE SHARK

...as her running mate.

That would be a swimming mate

 

[Tigers!]

You probably need to select a non-white, illegal, pregnant, left-handed, non-binary, disabled, tree hugging, EV driving, EA2L whale as the VP pick.

That should tick pretty well all the boxes.

(EA2L = English as 2nd language)

 

[Toni]

Payback??? Excluding men???

You said that it would be "misogyny" to pass over Whitmer. You also said that Dems should double down on women and POC candidates.

What about the notion that we should choose the best people for the job, regardless of their race or gender?

I agree with that. And yet most discussions of merits of Whitmer on here have been about how great an all-female ticket would be.

That was just fine to say as long as everyone understood that the ‘best people’ were white men or at least, men.

Never said that. But Dems have been excluding men from consideration lately. Biden refused to consider any men for running mate or for SCOTUS. Newsom only considered black women for Senate.

It should NOT be an issue but here you are, proving my point.

I agree that it should not be. At the same time, it is not "misogyny" if a man is selected as KH's running mate.

No, I said that having two women in the ticket ( second one being Whitmer) might be a bridge too far because of misogyny. On the part of too many voters.

Having a male, preferably white, might be more palatable to people wit unconscious biases against persons of color or women, I don’t like it but the absolute fact is that such things as where a candidate is from, whether they are married and who their spouse is and their children, what religion they are all become part of the calculus—the marketing strategy, if you will, for putting together a ticket that the most voters will vote for.

We’ve heard endlessly about Hunter Biden’s problems ( and silence on Don Jr.’s obvious drug use), the marriageability of Bush’s daughters, Carter’s daughter’s ‘plainness’ and much more. It’s awful and does not serve us well. Plus it’s really really unfair to the kids and extended family.

 

[ZiprHead]

Whitmer? She opposed a quite sensible pipeline after all.

Those pipes have been laying in that water under the straits for 70 years. They are a disaster just waiting to happen and Enbridge has continually refused to do anything about it.

 

[Politesse]

I thought you meant Human Rights Campaign in the sense that they are not radical enough for you.

I suppose you consider the Human Rights Campaign to be some sort of terrifying communist threat?

 

[pood]

The only people on the poll list that have any chance at all of being picked are Shapiro and Beshear. Whitmer ruled herself out and the others are non-starters for various reasons. I think we need an updated list.

 

[blastula]

This is still politics and in politics tickets are balanced. There is not going to be another woman on the ticket or a gay man. There is going to be a straight white man.

Can he be in the closet?

 

[blastula]

The only people on the poll list that have any chance at all of being picked are Shapiro and Beshear. Whitmer ruled herself out and the others are non-starters for various reasons. I think we need an updated list.

Whitmer only allegedly ruled herself out. No politician ever effectively rules themselves out from a campaign with any finality until they have no more choice.