Male patients asked if they are pregnant at NHS Trust

[Loren Pechtel]

You really don’t get it: people in radiology don’t necessarily read an entire chart. They do ask a set of questions. It is not always obvious who is male and who is female. A few individuals are intersex and don’t neatly fit into either category. A trans man may or may not have retained their uterus. They may or may not think of themselves as medically male or medically female. A trans woman may or may not think of themselves as medically male. Or they may. But the real issue from a radiologists’ POV is whether or not a patient may be or may intend to become pregnant.

Answering or not you are or might be pregnant will crystallize this salient issue for every single patient.

This. I have gotten a radiology report that identified me as female. Despite noting an incidental finding on male anatomy. I don't know if they were simply not paying attention or the thought I was trans, it doesn't matter. I did get it corrected because I do try to keep even harmless errors out of medical records even though I don't care about being misgendered.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

The point that you continue to ignore is the nurse clearly made a decision about my wife based on looks, not the chart. If the mistake can be made that someone whose chart clearly shows them to be non-fertile gets asked for a pregnancy test because they look like a reproductive age female, then someone who doesn't look like a reproductive age female can be missed.

And I'm telling you, as I've already said multiple times, there is no evidence that there was some deficiency in the NHS Trust previous practice. None. No evidence that the policy was that sex was done by 'sight' instead of patient record, or that the practice had deviated from the policy.

I'm giving you a case where a nurse most clearly went on sight, not the chart. A completely harmless failure, but the mistake could go the other direction.

 

[Emily Lake]

You are more confident than I am concerning hospital staff.
No disrespect, but I know for a fact that hospital staff are fallible human beings.

The fallibility of hospital staff is irrelevant to whether or not males can get pregnant.

 

[Toni]

You are more confident than I am concerning hospital staff.
No disrespect, but I know for a fact that hospital staff are fallible human beings.

The fallibility of hospital staff is irrelevant to whether or not males can get pregnant.

But not irrelevant as to whether or not they can make a mistake--they certainly can! Or whether they may think that a man is a woman or the reverse, or fail to recognize or even be decently informed about the anatomy and physiology of transgender persons.

If the real question is how fragile are male egos or how deep misogyny runs, I think this thread has contributed a great deal of evidence.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

You are more confident than I am concerning hospital staff.
No disrespect, but I know for a fact that hospital staff are fallible human beings.

The fallibility of hospital staff is irrelevant to whether or not males can get pregnant.

Is the patient pregnant?

Today on "Life was better when..."

 

[Gun Nut]

I am obviously male, even to a blind person. If someone reading from a list asked me if I could be pregnant, I would say "No" for two reasons:
1) It is not biologically possible and "No" is a very clear response.
2) "The question is not valid and you should have known better than to ask me" is 15x more words that provides a significantly less clear answer (since it was a yes or no question and neither yes nor no is in that response).

 

[TSwizzle]

I am obviously male, even to a blind person. If someone reading from a list asked me if I could be pregnant, I would say "No" for two reasons:
1) It is not biologically possible and "No" is a very clear response.
2) "The question is not valid and you should have known better than to ask me" is 15x more words that provides a significantly less clear answer (since it was a yes or no question and neither yes nor no is in that response).

That's cool.

But people shouldn't get so irate and lose their shit when others do not go along with absurdities.

The retreat of reason indeed.

 

[Jarhyn]

But people shouldn't get so irate and lose their shit when others do not go along with absurdities

Shiny Mirror on the wall...

People shouldn't get irate when others don't go along with absurdities, like asking to assume hidden information in a medical setting on the basis of appearances or "seeming" records, which is to say "seems right but who are we to know where that answer came from or why"

 

[TomC]

But people shouldn't get so irate and lose their shit when others do not go along with absurdities.

This thread was started by an OP who thinks a question on a medical questionnaire is a big problem.
Why should I go along with such absurdity?
Tom

 

[Gun Nut]

I am obviously male, even to a blind person. If someone reading from a list asked me if I could be pregnant, I would say "No" for two reasons:
1) It is not biologically possible and "No" is a very clear response.
2) "The question is not valid and you should have known better than to ask me" is 15x more words that provides a significantly less clear answer (since it was a yes or no question and neither yes nor no is in that response).

That's cool.

But people shouldn't get so irate and lose their shit when others do not go along with absurdities.

The retreat of reason indeed.

I am confused about who is loosing their shit... is it the OP that started with a rant about the possibility of being asked a medical question by a medical professional? Is that the lost shit?
It sounds like Karen is asking the Manager why THEY have "lost their shit". lol

 

[TSwizzle]

I am confused about who is loosing their shit...

It is the people that are vehemently denying reality and want to bully and shame folks into believing their fantasies.

 

[TomC]

I am confused about who is loosing their shit...

It is the people that are vehemently denying reality and want to bully and shame folks into believing their fantasies.

That's rather vague.

The people who are losing their shit and trying to bully and shame folks seem like the one's upset that they can no longer put absolutely everyone into a box defined by sex.
That's the reality.

At least that's what it looks like to me.
Tom

 

[Metaphor]

But people shouldn't get so irate and lose their shit when others do not go along with absurdities

Shiny Mirror on the wall...

People shouldn't get irate when others don't go along with absurdities, like asking to assume hidden information in a medical setting on the basis of appearances or "seeming" records, which is to say "seems right but who are we to know where that answer came from or why"

Jarhyn again pretending that hospitals do not ask for and record the sex of their patients.

 

[Jarhyn]

I will reiterate, a mark of M or F on a document is "seems right, but who are we to really know where that answer came from or why", on account of whoever it is looking at the mark on the piece of paper not really being there the last time it was asked and especially without understanding the meaning of the context of the response.

And even so, "are you pregnant or may you become pregnant" is a much more straightforward and unambiguous question than "are you male or female" especially when one has a y/n answer in all situations and the other may go so far as "I am not represented by either option".

 

[Metaphor]

I hope you are leading by example and refusing health care whenever you are asked your sex.

 

[TomC]

I hope you are leading by example and refusing health care whenever you are asked your sex.

I think Jarhyn was much more straightforward with

"are you pregnant or may you become pregnant" is a much more straightforward and unambiguous question than "are you male or female"

Because that's what is important. Nothing about refusing health care, just answering a simple Y/N question about the possibility of damaging an unborn child.
Tom

 

[Toni]

But people shouldn't get so irate and lose their shit when others do not go along with absurdities

Shiny Mirror on the wall...

People shouldn't get irate when others don't go along with absurdities, like asking to assume hidden information in a medical setting on the basis of appearances or "seeming" records, which is to say "seems right but who are we to know where that answer came from or why"

Jarhyn again pretending that hospitals do not ask for and record the sex of their patients.

Metaphor again pretending that all medical treatments involving xrays occur in hospital settings AND that all hospital personnel read everything on a patient's chart or even order slip.

 

[Metaphor]

I hope you are leading by example and refusing health care whenever you are asked your sex.

I think Jarhyn was much more straightforward with

"are you pregnant or may you become pregnant" is a much more straightforward and unambiguous question than "are you male or female"

Because that's what is important. Nothing about refusing health care, just answering a simple Y/N question about the possibility of damaging an unborn child.
Tom

Jarhyn thinks it is an egregious violation of privacy to be asked your sex. So I hope he is refusing health care services whenever he is asked, and telling them why.

 

[Metaphor]

But people shouldn't get so irate and lose their shit when others do not go along with absurdities

Shiny Mirror on the wall...

People shouldn't get irate when others don't go along with absurdities, like asking to assume hidden information in a medical setting on the basis of appearances or "seeming" records, which is to say "seems right but who are we to know where that answer came from or why"

Jarhyn again pretending that hospitals do not ask for and record the sex of their patients.

Metaphor again pretending that all medical treatments involving xrays occur in hospital settings AND that all hospital personnel read everything on a patient's chart or even order slip.

I have never received a medical service (including my vaccines) without the service provider knowing my sex.

 

[TomC]

Jarhyn thinks it is an egregious violation of privacy to be asked your sex. So I hope he is refusing health care services whenever he is asked, and telling them why.

This is your thread pumpkin.

If your local health care provider developed a policy of asking everyone "Could you be pregnant" before performing an MRI, would you refuse health care services?

I hope not. That might be literally "dying on that hill". Not a good choice.

As far as I can tell, your real reason for starting this thread is that you're outraged by the fact that people aren't always put into a box based on sex anymore. Sorry dude, that's the reality. Trans folks are rare and confusing, but they exist and are human beings.
Tom