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Merged So what's next for Trump?

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Politesse said:
As they would certainly have already done if it were anyone but him.

He continues to get special favors and kid glove treatment at every turn, even as he whines about being "persecuted".
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I wonder if he will continue to get such treatment over this latest raft of indictments. He's definitely getting treated well by his pet Judge Cannon, but Judge Chutkan doesn't seem in the mood to play his games. So far she's rejected his attempt to delay the hearing on the protective order, and Smith has requested a pretty speedy trial date of January 2nd. He flipped out about both, and has (and will continue) to go on ALL CAPS rants about the judge on his little social media site.

He doesn't seem to understand that publicly attacking this judge is not going to scare her into submission. I wonder at what point she will say "okay, I've had enough with you." It reminds me a bit of those "sovereign citizen" cases, where the defendant is in court because he refused to comply when pulled over for expired tags and no license, insists that police and traffic laws have no jurisdiction over him, and continues to throw up ridiculous defenses until the judge throws the book at 'em.
 
Ford said:
He doesn't seem to understand that publicly attacking this judge is not going to scare her into submission.
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He understands that. She is never going to be his buddy. But that doesn’t matter; if he can convince just ONE juror of ONE SHRED of his bullshit, he will walk.
 
Elixir said:
Ford said:
He doesn't seem to understand that publicly attacking this judge is not going to scare her into submission.
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He understands that. She is never going to be his buddy. But that doesn’t matter; if he can convince just ONE juror of ONE SHRED of his bullshit, he will walk.
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I'm not entirely sure that it has anything to do with attempting to successfully intimidate judge or jury. I think he's playing to his audience and trying to convince them that he's still one tough mf--although we all know he means df. In any case, with a bit of luck, he will be, in all legal and political senses, completely fucked.
 
Politesse said:
As they would certainly have already done if it were anyone but him.

He continues to get special favors and kid glove treatment at every turn, even as he whines about being "persecuted".
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This is true. But the court is showing admirable restraint. If he were immediately taken into custody and they had NOT done everything possible to demonstrate lack of bias, it could well trigger many more violent attacks from his supporters. And give his supporters reasons to believe his claims of unfair treatment.
 
My 460 mile route from my home through Iowa and northeastern Missouri to visit my family in St. Louis takes me through Trump country. Until this year, there were a fair amount of various signs supporting Trump that were visible. I just completed a round trip along the route, and there were none. There was an unhitched empty hay wagon with a hand painted Dump Trump sign attached to it.

Call me a cock-eyed optimist, but I take it as a harbinger of the shrinking of the support for Trump. Yes, the hard core MAGAs are not going away, but the other ones are.

I think Mr. Trump is in for a very unpleasant couple of years.
 
Judge Chutkan continued the kid gloves treatment by giving Trump a green light to say anything he pleased about public officials and others, knowing full well that he was using his lack of restraint to intimidate her and everyone else. She herself now has to be surrounded by US marshals whenever she goes out in public. Chutkan claimed that she wasn't being guided by politics, but the fact is that no normal defendant would be allowed to carry on in public the way that Trump is. Her only attempt to rein Trump in was to claim that she would rush to select the jury and start the trial earlier, if Trump continued to carry on with his intimidation. However, that strikes me as totally naïve. The prosecution is not asking for jury selection to start until December and for the trial to start until January. Between now and then, Trump is essentially free to do whatever he pleases to gum up the works. He is very skilled at manipulating the system to serve his ends.

Judge warns of restraints to what evidence Trump can talk about, agrees to limited protective order​


Chutkan stressed that political considerations wouldn’t guide her decisions. She also repeatedly said Trump was subject to the court’s rules as a defendant before trial even as he runs for the 2024 Republican nomination for president.

“Your client’s defense is supposed to happen in this courtroom, not on the internet,” Chutkan told Trump’s lawyers.

The judge said that the more anyone makes “inflammatory” statements about the case, the greater her urgency will be to move the case more quickly to trial to prevent the contamination of the jury pool. She noted that “arguably ambiguous statements” could be construed as intimidation or harassment of potential witnesses.

“I will take whatever measures are necessary to safeguard the integrity of the case,” she said.

Chutkan agreed with Trump’s defense team on a looser version of a protective order for evidence in the case, but she largely sided with the prosecution on what sensitive materials should be protected.

She rejected prosecutors’ broader protective order proposal that sought to prevent the public release of all evidence they hand over to Trump’s defense as they prepare for trial. She instead seemed poised to impose a more limited protective order that would bar the public release only of materials deemed “sensitive,” such as grand jury materials. Trump made his move to defy the system, and the judge blinked.
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In my opinion, the jury pool is already contaminated, and Trump will do everything he can in the coming months to contaminate it further. I won't be surprised if some government witnesses start withdrawing their cooperation with the prosecution. The intimidation is going to get much worse. Trump made his move to defy the court's warning not to intimidate public officials and witnesses, and the judge blinked.
 
Toni said:
I'm not entirely sure that it has anything to do with attempting to successfully intimidate judge or jury.
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It doesn’t. It has to do with contaminating the jury pool so at least one juror is convinced it has to be a witch hunt, because Trump revealed it to be The Truth.
 
I wonder what Melania is getting up to these days?

Consulting attorneys in New York concerning the exact details of pre-nups?
Tom
 
The GOP is blowing their lungs out about Biden corruption, yadda, yadda. Well, if they want to have investigations...

......
Amid GOP howls over the Hunter Biden case, lawmakers are scrutinizing former President Donald Trump’s business dealings during his time in office, Rep. Jamie Raskin said Sunday.

The Maryland Democrat promised a new report on cash that foreign governments gave to Trump businesses, though he did not go into detail.

“We’re going to release a report about all of the foreign government emoluments — millions of dollars — we can document that Donald Trump pocketed at the hotels, at the golf courses (and) business deals when he was president and that his family got,” Raskin told ABC’s “This Week.”
.....

www.yahoo.com

As GOP attacks Bidens, Rep. Jamie Raskin promises report on ‘foreign government emoluments’ to Trump

Amid GOP howls over the Hunter Biden case, lawmakers are scrutinizing former President Donald Trump’s business dealings during his time in office, Rep. Jamie Raskin said Sunday. The Maryland Democrat promised a new report on cash that foreign governments gave to Trump businesses, though he did...
www.yahoo.com www.yahoo.com
 
Cheerful Charlie said:
Strapped to a gurney and wearing a spit mask while being wheeled out to a paddy wagon. Am I being cruel?
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Or when this thug is being thrown into the back of a paddy wagon, just throw him in rough. Please don’t be too nice.

When they put him in the car and they’re protecting his head you know, the way they put their hand over their head, like, don’t hit his head, don’t hit his head. You can take the hand away, okay?

I have to tell you, you know, the laws are so horrendously stacked against us, because for years and years, they've been made to protect this criminal. Totally made to protect this criminal. Not the officers. You do something wrong, you're in more jeopardy than they are.
 
From two weeks ago,
How Jack Smith Quickly Brought Two Indictments Against Trump - The New York Times
Moving at High Velocity, Special Counsel Brings 2nd Indictment Against Trump

The special counsel Jack Smith has undertaken two historic investigations with remarkable speed, aggressiveness and apparent indifference to collateral political consequences.
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Nice that he did it as fast as he did. I was worried that that would not happen in time for the election. :(

But I'm sure that he wanted to be super careful.

As to political consequences, Republicans are squealing that this is political persecution, going after a political opponent, even as they do the exact same thing with Hunter Biden and by extension his President father.

Watch: Special counsel Jack Smith speaks about the indictment against Trump : NPR
"The attack on our nation's Capitol on Jan. 6, 2021, was an unprecedented assault on the seat of American democracy. As described in the indictment, it was fueled by lies," Smith said. "Lies by the defendant, targeted at obstructing a bedrock function of the U.S. government."

Before a room of cameras and reporters, he delivered a two-minute statement, then left without taking questions.
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Read the Trump indictment - POLITICO
Count 1: 18 U.S.C. § 371 (Conspiracy to Defraud the United States)

Count 2: 18 U.S.C. § 1512(k) (Conspiracy to Obstruct an Official Proceeding)

Count 3: 18 U.S.C. §§ 1512(c)(2), 2 (Obstruction of and Attempt to Obstruct an Official Proceeding)

Count 4: 18 U.S.C. § 241 (Conspiracy Against Rights)
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I used OwlOCR, a MacOS app, to copy out the text by OCRing it.
2. Despite having lost, the Defendant was determined to remain in power. So for more than two months following election day on November 3, 2020, the Defendant spread lies that there had been outcome-determinative fraud in the election and that he had actually won. These claims were false, and the Defendant knew that they were false. But the Defendant repeated and widely disseminated them anyway-to make his knowingly false claims appear legitimate, create an intense national atmosphere of mistrust and anger, and erode public faith in the administration of the election.
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The indictment named some co-conspirators, though without indicting them.
a. Co-Conspirator 1, an attorney who was willing to spread knowingly false claims and pursue strategies that the Defendant's 2020 re-election campaign attorneys would not.

b. Co-Conspirator 2, an attorney who devised and attempted to implement a strategy to leverage the Vice President's ceremonial role overseeing the certification proceeding to obstruct the certification of the presidential election.

c. Co-Conspirator 3, an attorney whose unfounded claims of election fraud the Defendant privately acknowledged to others sounded "crazy." Nonetheless, the Defendant embraced and publicly amplified Co-Conspirator 3's disinformation.

d. Co-Conspirator 4, a Justice Department official who worked on civil matters and who, with the Defendant, attempted to use the Justice Department to open sham election crime investigations and influence state legislatures with knowingly false claims of election fraud.

e. Co-Conspirator 5, an attorney who assisted in devising and attempting to implement a plan to submit fraudulent slates of presidential electors to obstruct the certification proceeding.

f. Co-Conspirator 6, political consultant who helped implement a plan to submit fraudulent slates of presidential electors to obstruct the certification proceeding.
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I've seen some speculation on who these co-conspirators might be.

I should mention Special Counsel investigation of Trump part 2 | Internet Infidels Discussion Board
 
Cheerful Charlie said:
The GOP is blowing their lungs out about Biden corruption, yadda, yadda. Well, if they want to have investigations...
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What corruption?

news.yahoo.com

Republican Congressman Accidentally Admits There’s No Proof of Biden Corruption

Republican Representative Nick Langworthy tried to defend the GOP investigation into Joe Biden’s alleged corruption—only to end up admitting that they still don’t have any proof.Republicans have insisted for months that Biden is guilty of corruption and influence peddling overseas, despite...
news.yahoo.com news.yahoo.com

One admitted they don't actually have anything.
 
I honestly believe that Joe Biden doesn't love America.

Right now, our once great country is falling apart. Inflation is ravaging our economy. Our border is in complete disarray. Our enemies are openly spying on us and getting away with it. And our justice system has been replaced by a weaponized legal system that criminalizes dissent.

We are a nation in decline.

If I were in the White House right now, I would dedicate every waking hour and every fiber of my being to fix this mess.

But what's Crooked Joe doing as America burns?

… Spending millions and millions of YOUR taxpayer dollars to wrongly indict, arrest, and possibly even JAIL his leading opponent.

The truth is: Crooked Joe doesn't care if our country burns to the ground. He only cares about his own power.

But I trust you know that I truly care about America. Nothing motivates me more than my endless love for our country.

Look, I didn't have to run for president. I didn't have to challenge the Deep State.

I'm not in this battle for fame or fortune. I'm in this battle to save our country and nothing else.
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From here:
www.salon.com

Our collective malady: Trump's mental health is America's problem

Experts: Trump's "denial of reality" and "primitive projections" are imploding. He's even more dangerous
www.salon.com www.salon.com
 
Trump vows massive new tariffs if elected, risking global economic war

Trump and top aides, including former senior White House officials Larry Kudlow and Brooke Rollins, as well as outside advisers Stephen Moore and former House speaker Newt Gingrich, spent the dinner discussing how Trump could attack President Biden in the 2024 election on the economy, amid a recent spate of positive economic news that has buoyed Biden’s fortunes, according to three people familiar with the meeting, who spoke on the condition of anonymity to describe the private event.

Among the ideas they discussed was Trump’s plan to enact a “universal baseline tariff” on virtually all imports to the United States, the people said. This idea, which Trump has taken to describing as the creation of a “ring around the U.S. economy,” could represent a massive escalation of global economic chaos, surpassing the international trade discord that marked much of his first administration. Trump advisers have for months discussed various potential levels to set the tariff rate, and they said the plan remains a work in progress with major questions left unresolved, the people said.
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