The Race For 2024

[TomC]

Yeah, I wasn’t referring to 2016. just 2020 and the years since.

Trump might still be useful, if not electable*, if Biden hadn't chosen Harris to replace him on the Democratic ticket.
But he did.
So now Trump is not even useful for most purposes.

*Trump has never been elected because he is not electable. He has never been elected by the American people to anything. The closest he came was in 2016 when the Electoral College overruled the People and appointed Trump POTUS.

 

[blastula]

Oh boy! Trump is threatening to sue the New York Times for fact checking his story about the helicopter and Willy Brown. Getting a deposition from Willie Brown will be an embarrassment for Trump. This just keeps getting better.

....
“We have the flight records of the helicopter,” that it landed in "a field," and that he is "probably going to sue" the news outlet for suggesting otherwise.
....

Trump threatens to sue New York Times for debunking helicopter story in furious phone call

Former President Donald Trump doubled down on his assertion that he was in a near-helicopter crash with former San Francisco Mayor Willie Brown, calling The New York Times and threatening to sue over their coverage of his news conference, in which he made the claim, reported Maggie Haberman on...

www.rawstory.com

There was a helicopter emergency landing but it was with someone else.

Loading…

www.politico.com

“Willie is the short Black guy living in San Francisco,” Holden said. “I’m a tall Black guy living in Los Angeles.

“I guess we all look alike,” Holden told POLITICO, letting out a loud laugh.

Over the phone Friday, Res said Trump liked to tell a joke about Holden on the helicopter — “you turned white,” he said. But she said it was Trump’s face that was white.

“He was white as snow,” Holden added. “And he was scared shitless.”

Trump is losing it bigly.

 

[Swammerdami]

I've been reporting on the prediction markets so am happy to announce that Polymarket and Betfair now each show Harris as a very slight favorite over the Orange Buffoon.

I think the popularity of Harris-Walz will continue to grow. My big concern is the criminal^* cheating already planned by election officials in Georgia and Arizona. (* - Technically, their actions may not be "criminal", but that's only because these criminals rewrote their laws.)

 

[unapologetic]

Each of Trump's four suggested budgets over his 4 years demanded large cuts to Social Security and Medicare. Especially Medicare.

Several of the postcards I've gotten from the Rump campaign in the last few months said that Biden would cut Medicare.
This is typical of Rump. Accusing other people of the shit he does. Calling everything about him that is negative "fake news".

Effectively says he was paid off.

Of course... Something I heard online in 2016 "Trump is so rich he can't be bought."
HA. How do you think he gets rich? (After going bankrupt 4 times) He uses other peoples money for everything he does. He actually wrote the book.

Truth Details | Truth Social

Kamabla Harris is afraid to Debate me on FoxNews.

She is not stupid. Fox would edit the shit out of it, to make Rump look good, no matter what.

For some reason in Australia we are not being drowned in a torrent of nonsense about the forthcoming election

Go ahead, rub it in. Lucky basterd.

If the negative things some men have said ... originated with female sources, does that absolve them of being misogynistic?

If you don't quote your sources, you take responsibility for the statement.

I'm starting to wonder if Trump will still be the Republican candidate come November. ...

How hard would it be for the rich and powerful who want to back a Republican winner in November to get rid of him?

It is too late to change, in Ohio. Each state has a different deadline for 'printing' the ballet. Ohio's deadline just past. This is why Harris had to poll the delegates before the Dem convention. A candidate would have to die to get off the ballet at this point. ...er... oops.
Which leads me to the question... What if a candidate should die too close to the election to change. (for some hypothetical reason
not at all attributable to the secret powers in charge) What happens? Does the opposition automatically win? Does the VP candidate automatically win? Do they postpone or rerun the election?
- Asking for a friend.

My big concern is the criminal* cheating already planned by...

In a recent begging letter from the "Trump National Committee" The fine print says donations are divided
between the 'primary election account', the 'general election account', and the 'recount account'.
So yeah, the recount already has a budget. Rump will not accept defeat. In his mind, if he looses, somebody MUST be cheating. (or else he will.)

(Sorry if I'm late. I'm only here on weekends)

 

[pood]

Which leads me to the question... What if a candidate should die too close to the election to change. (for some hypothetical reason
not at all attributable to the secret powers in charge) What happens? Does the opposition automatically win? Does the VP candidate automatically win? Do they postpone or rerun the election?
- Asking for a friend.

Answers here.

 

[TomC]

It is too late to change, in Ohio. Each state has a different deadline for 'printing' the ballet. Ohio's deadline just past. This is why Harris had to poll the delegates before the Dem convention.

Oh no!
Some Republicans in the state legislatures might have to change the rules to suit their political goals? I simply cannot imagine them doing anything so blatantly underhanded/snark
Tom

 

[Elixir]

Which leads me to the question... What if a candidate should die too close to the election to change. (for some hypothetical reason
not at all attributable to the secret powers in charge) What happens? Does the opposition automatically win? Does the VP candidate automatically win? Do they postpone or rerun the election?
- Asking for a friend.

Answers here.

Thanks Pood.
I’m sure the Republican snakes know about every single one of those possibilities, and how to make the most advantageous ones for them, to come to pass. For instance…

It's "not 100% clear Congress would count the votes for somebody who is deceased,” Fortier said. And if neither candidate has the 270 Electoral College votes needed to secure the presidency, the results of the election would then be decided by the House in what is called a contingent election.

Kinda worries me. If I read it right, it says that if both candidates die in a timely enough manner, the House (if Republican) gets to pick Empty Gee, Matty Gaetz or Gym Jordan serve as President?

The entire Constitution seems to have been written under the assumption that The People would never elect an entirely malevolent individual to serve as President.

SO many ways for a bad actor with deep pockets to demolish democracy in a mass-media fed society … I’m afraid we could learn a lot more about that soon.

 

[pood]

The entire Constitution seems to have been written under the assumption that The People would never elect an entirely malevolent individual to serve as President.

Actually, it was’t. It was written under the express notion that we would have no more monarchs, but also under the assumption that the common people were a mob, and had to be protected from their own passions by wise, white, privileged male property owners.

That is why the founders set up more of a Republic than a democracy. Among the safeguards were indirect election of senators (later overturned and changed to the popular vote) and, of course, the good old Electoral College.

The EC was set up precisely to prevent people like Trump from taking office. Perhaps it is not so well known that electors do not have to vote the candidate to whom they are assigned. The founders envisioned the election of a bunch of “wise men” who would overturn the popular vote if necessary to keep demagogues and would-be dictators like Trump out of power, even if the people wanted them.

The irony is palpable. In 2016 the EC functioned exactly the opposite of how intended. The demagogue lost the popular vote, but won in the EC that was designed to protect the people from monsters like Trump.

 

[Elixir]

The EC was set up precisely to prevent people like Trump from taking office.

I think they had something more like Bernie in mind.
Obviously the “Trump” that modern media created, wasn’t anticipated. If he’s re-elected, their vision is almost certainly destroyed.

 

[unapologetic]

Which leads me to the question... What if a candidate should die too close to the election to change. (for some hypothetical reason
not at all attributable to the secret powers in charge) What happens? Does the opposition automatically win? Does the VP candidate automatically win? Do they postpone or rerun the election?
- Asking for a friend.

Answers here.

Thanks Pood. That does answer my questions.

"it's important to remember that when people cast a vote, they aren't voting for a candidate, but for electors who will vote for their preferred party in the Electoral College."
Nice to see the EC is good for something.

 

[pood]

"it's important to remember that when people cast a vote, they aren't voting for a candidate, but for electors who will vote for their preferred party in the Electoral College."
Nice to see the EC is good for something.

Right, but it is important to remember that these electors do not have to vote for the candidate you elected them to vote for. In the past they have been called “faithless electors,” and it has happened a number of times that electors refused to vote for the candidate to which the voters assigned them, but these votes have never swung an election.

 

[Shadowy Man]

"it's important to remember that when people cast a vote, they aren't voting for a candidate, but for electors who will vote for their preferred party in the Electoral College."
Nice to see the EC is good for something.

Right, but it is important to remember that these electors do not have to vote for the candidate you elected them to vote for.

that may depend on the state as I believe some have laws about this.

 

[pood]

"it's important to remember that when people cast a vote, they aren't voting for a candidate, but for electors who will vote for their preferred party in the Electoral College."
Nice to see the EC is good for something.

Right, but it is important to remember that these electors do not have to vote for the candidate you elected them to vote for.

that may depend on the state as I believe some have laws about this.

There are laws in some states requiring that they vote for whom they are assigned to vote. Such laws would not survive a court challenge.

 

[pood]

I stand (slightly) corrected. The U.S. Supreme Court has upheld state-level laws requiring electors to vote for the candidate to whom voters assigned them. However, my understanding is that electors can break these laws, and vote for whom they want, and under the constitution their votes would stand. They would then have to accept any legal consequences at the state level, however.

 

[Cheerful Charlie]

More on the helicopter story. Trump claimed he was in a near helicopter accident with Willie Brown. Lie or bad memory? But Trump embroidered this tale. Claiming Willie Brown bad mouthed Kamala Harris. Trump was actually in a helicopter with Nate Holden, a California politician. Who denies bad mouthing Kamala Harris. Trump once had a helicopter ride with Jerry Brown. who states that he did not discuss Kamala Harris with Trump. Trump might claim bad memory as to whom he was riding with when the helicopter started to have mechanical trouble. But it is hard to make that claim in regards to hearing Kamala bad mouthed. In a recent interview, ex-Trump advidor John Bolton claimed Trump had a habit of BSing nonsense and apparently had little sense of the notion of truth.

Trump's Broken-Down Helicopter Was a Vehicle to Make Up Shit about Kamala Harris - emptywheel

It has taken two days and at least ten journalists to chase down Trump's fabrications about a helicopter flight with Willie Brown on which he badmouthed Kamala Harris. But the stories have yet to focus on that part -- that the failing helicopter was just a vehicle to tell more lies about the...

www.emptywheel.net

 

[Shadowy Man]

Apparently, the point of the electoral college is that the President gets picked by only upstanding land-owning white men and not by the unwashed masses of rubes who might want to elect an unqualified charlatan of low moral character. Thank god the founders thought to protect us from such an undesirable outcome!! Can you even imagine??

 

[pood]

Alexander Hamilton foresees Donald Trump, except for the “possessed of considerable talents” part.

 

[TomC]

"it's important to remember that when people cast a vote, they aren't voting for a candidate, but for electors who will vote for their preferred party in the Electoral College."
Nice to see the EC is good for something.

Right, but it is important to remember that these electors do not have to vote for the candidate you elected them to vote for. In the past they have been called “faithless electors,” and it has happened a number of times that electors refused to vote for the candidate to which the voters assigned them, but these votes have never swung an election.

There's even more to this.
Originally, POTUS had almost nothing to do with domestic policies. The individual states were pretty darned sovereign. Differences between them were settled in the elected Congress and Senate. The Federal government had almost nothing to do with citizen's daily lives.

POTUS wasn't expected to do much but representing the state legislatures to foreign powers with one voice. So the elected legislatures of individual states sent representatives to the EC to choose the best representative for the country as a whole. The delegates were expected to represent the interests of the citizens of the state, but choose the best overall representation for the USA.

Things are very different now. For one thing, the Federal government is far more involved in our daily lives. Some of the biggest issues in the last few decades didn't even exist when the Constitutional processes were being created. There was no federal personal income tax. There was no federal healthcare policy. There was no federal immigration policy.

There was essentially no information technology more advanced than printed pamphlets and broad sheets. The ability of rich people to advance their own interests by buying media didn't exist.

Partisan power now commonly takes precedence over the best interests of the people. The Founders opposed the existence of such groups for good reasons.

It's just a different world and a different country.

Go NationalPopularVote.com

Tom

 

[TomC]

I stand (slightly) corrected. The U.S. Supreme Court has upheld state-level laws requiring electors to vote for the candidate to whom voters assigned them. However, my understanding is that electors can break these laws, and vote for whom they want, and under the constitution their votes would stand. They would then have to accept any legal consequences at the state level, however.

Except, it's not the voters who decide who to send. It's the legislatures.
They might stick with whomever they prefer, normally the party in power can bank on the "first past the post" election system to rubber stamp the POTUS candidate they want.

But there is nothing stopping state legislatures from deciding that their delegates will be pledged to the top vote getter of The American People overall.
Nationalpopularvote.com
Tom

 

[Elixir]

But there is nothing stopping state legislatures from deciding that their delegates will be pledged to the top vote getter of The American People overall.

Nothing to stop them except 35 million trumpsucking AR15 owners.
They might be cowards but they're scary cowards when they set their collective sights on someone.