The incredible Willful Ignorance of 1/6 denyers

[Tigers!]

Well this isn’t a single country it is a federation of states. Back when it was founded it may have made some kind of sense to give smaller states outsize political power but now it will never change because the smaller states will not want to give up their power. Part of the problem was in adding more states just for political gain (why we have two Dakotas for example).

Might explain the two Virginias too I guess.

 

[Tigers!]

Because here in Australia we hear about (far too much) about the comings and goings, to-ing and fro-ing, huffing and puffing of your electoral process. It seems like a shipwreck. If you could get your act together the rest of the world would be much obliged.

How is that our fault???

Because collectively, as a nation, we disowned Murdoch decades ago. He's now your fault. We still take responsibility for Peter Costello, though.

And we cursed the USA by making K Rudd the ambassador too.

 

[Shadowy Man]

.

What you yanks seem to need is a consistent, coherent method of voting that reduces the possibility of complaints etc. When you use mechanical, electronic, paper, tally sticks then that inconsistency is ripe fro compaling. Simplify and standardise.

And since no one has come forward with actual evidence that our current system isn’t accurate why do you think we need to change?

Because here in Australia we hear about (far too much) about the comings and goings, to-ing and fro-ing, huffing and puffing of your electoral process. It seems like a shipwreck. If you could get your act together the rest of the world would be much obliged.

Media sell what makes money. That seems to be the most sensational of news. Our election went just fine, very smooth and accurate. It’s just that a few dumb shit narcissists couldn’t stand the idea of losing. And the major media company supporting those fuckwits found that it made more money selling lies than truth.

 

[Patooka]

I know that there is an election in your state this Saturday. Saturday is a much better day than a week day to have an election. If no outlet is talking about the leaked tapes how do you know of their existence?

I said "no news outlet".

You claim that the NSW media is a mouthpiece for the Coalition. In Victoria it is a love-in for Andrews. Neither of us get what we want.

NewsCorp and Channel Nine/Fairfax are the two largest media outlets in Australia and roughly own 3/4ths of all TV, radio and newspaper outlets combined. One is obviously run by Rupert Murdoch, the other is run by the former Treasurer of Australia's longest running conservative government.

 

[Tigers!]

I know that there is an election in your state this Saturday. Saturday is a much better day than a week day to have an election. If no outlet is talking about the leaked tapes how do you know of their existence?

I said "no news outlet".

You claim that the NSW media is a mouthpiece for the Coalition. In Victoria it is a love-in for Andrews. Neither of us get what we want.

NewsCorp and Channel Nine/Fairfax are the two largest media outlets in Australia and roughly own 3/4ths of all TV, radio and newspaper outlets combined. One is obviously run by Rupert Murdoch, the other is run by the former Treasurer of Australia's longest running conservative government.

Thank you for telling me what is commonly known. And both of them are almost useless.

 

[T.G.G. Moogly]

Never claimed hand counts are less costly or time consuming. They will not be. But so what? What is needed is reliability and consistency.
What you yanks seem to need is a consistent, coherent method of voting that reduces the possibility of complaints etc. When you use mechanical, electronic, paper, tally sticks then that inconsistency is ripe fro compaling. Simplify and standardise.

You neither answered my questions nor supported your claim that hand ballots are better than machines with any kind of evidence.

 

[T.G.G. Moogly]

And since no one has come forward with actual evidence that our current system isn’t accurate why do you think we need to change?

Exactly.

 

[Elixir]

Well this isn’t a single country it is a federation of states. Back when it was founded it may have made some kind of sense to give smaller states outsize political power but now it will never change because the smaller states will not want to give up their power. Part of the problem was in adding more states just for political gain (why we have two Dakotas for example).

Might explain the two Virginias too I guess.

We obviously need six or eight Californias.

 

[bilby]

Well this isn’t a single country it is a federation of states. Back when it was founded it may have made some kind of sense to give smaller states outsize political power but now it will never change because the smaller states will not want to give up their power. Part of the problem was in adding more states just for political gain (why we have two Dakotas for example).

Might explain the two Virginias too I guess.

We obviously need six or eight Californias.

The obvious answer is to keep dividing up your states until there's as many states as there are voters, each with a voting population of one. Then the EC winner just becomes the same as the popular vote count winner.

Of course there may be a few bugs to work out of such a system; It seems slightly impractical to have a Senate with two members for each voter, for example (though given the woefully low turnout in US elections, you could probably get there by just making almost everyone over 21 a Senator). Also, you're gonna need a bigger flag - or much smaller stars.

 

[Tigers!]

Never claimed hand counts are less costly or time consuming. They will not be. But so what? What is needed is reliability and consistency.
What you yanks seem to need is a consistent, coherent method of voting that reduces the possibility of complaints etc. When you use mechanical, electronic, paper, tally sticks then that inconsistency is ripe fro compaling. Simplify and standardise.

You neither answered my questions nor supported your claim that hand ballots are better than machines with any kind of evidence.

What evidence do you desire?
This whole thread is a litany of complaints from Americans about the ignorance of 1/6 deniers. There were complaints from Americans about your voting system, machines vs. paper etc. None of which began with myself or others.
We (non-Americans) merely suggest you people might like to get your house in order to avoid bothering the rest of the world about it and we offer offer possible solutions. All of which you decry and then we are to blame.

 

[Patooka]

What evidence do you desire?
This whole thread is a litany of complaints from Americans about the ignorance of 1/6 deniers. There were complaints from Americans about your voting system, machines vs. paper etc. None of which began with myself or others.
We (non-Americans) merely suggest you people might like to get your house in order to avoid bothering the rest of the world about it and we offer offer possible solutions. All of which you decry and then we are to blame.

You're missing the point that the arguments made about the US voting system are not done in good faith. It's simply a disrupting tactic. It's just Birtherism all over again.

"Show us the birth certificate!"
"No, show us the long form certificate!"
"No, show us the roster of the doctors who were working that day!"

100% guaranteed; if you entertain the notion that there is rampant wide spread fraud and offer a solution, Q-tards will change their slogan to something else. Because it's not about fixing a problem, it's about disrupting the current system.

 

[Shadowy Man]

What evidence do you desire?
This whole thread is a litany of complaints from Americans about the ignorance of 1/6 deniers. There were complaints from Americans about your voting system, machines vs. paper etc. None of which began with myself or others.
We (non-Americans) merely suggest you people might like to get your house in order to avoid bothering the rest of the world about it and we offer offer possible solutions. All of which you decry and then we are to blame.

And we are pointing out that you are offering solutions to a problem that doesn’t exist. The problem you are being bothered by isn’t the vote counting it’s the narcissistic ignorant madness of the losers of that vote. If you have a solution to *that* I’d love to hear one.

 

[Politesse]

Because here in Australia we hear about (far too much) about the comings and goings, to-ing and fro-ing, huffing and puffing of your electoral process. It seems like a shipwreck. If you could get your act together the rest of the world would be much obliged.

How is that our fault???

If the complaints, claims, counter-claims did not exist then it would be blessedly quiet.

Apologies for giving a shit about our political situation, I guess? If you ask me, Australians would be much better off paying attention to some of the creepy shit going on with their own "faceless men" than obsessing over ours.

 

[Tigers!]

Because here in Australia we hear about (far too much) about the comings and goings, to-ing and fro-ing, huffing and puffing of your electoral process. It seems like a shipwreck. If you could get your act together the rest of the world would be much obliged.

How is that our fault???

If the complaints, claims, counter-claims did not exist then it would be blessedly quiet.

Apologies for giving a shit about our political situation, I guess? If you ask me, Australians would be much better off paying attention to some of the creepy shit going on with their own "faceless men" than obsessing over ours.

Agreed. But so many Aussies are obsessed by you lot. And the loud noises about allegedly stolen elections, what will, or will not Trump say are drowning all else out.

 

[Tigers!]

What evidence do you desire?
This whole thread is a litany of complaints from Americans about the ignorance of 1/6 deniers. There were complaints from Americans about your voting system, machines vs. paper etc. None of which began with myself or others.
We (non-Americans) merely suggest you people might like to get your house in order to avoid bothering the rest of the world about it and we offer offer possible solutions. All of which you decry and then we are to blame.

And we are pointing out that you are offering solutions to a problem that doesn’t exist. The problem you are being bothered by isn’t the vote counting it’s the narcissistic ignorant madness of the losers of that vote. If you have a solution to *that* I’d love to hear one.

I'd say ignore them but that is probably not viable.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

Never claimed hand counts are less costly or time consuming. They will not be. But so what? What is needed is reliability and consistency.
What you yanks seem to need is a consistent, coherent method of voting that reduces the possibility of complaints etc. When you use mechanical, electronic, paper, tally sticks then that inconsistency is ripe fro compaling. Simplify and standardise.

You neither answered my questions nor supported your claim that hand ballots are better than machines with any kind of evidence.

What evidence do you desire?
This whole thread is a litany of complaints from Americans about the ignorance of 1/6 deniers. There were complaints from Americans about your voting system, machines vs. paper etc. None of which began with myself or others.
We (non-Americans) merely suggest you people might like to get your house in order to avoid bothering the rest of the world about it and we offer offer possible solutions. All of which you decry and then we are to blame.

Other people are lying, there must be something to it. You should fix what isn't broken.

 

[T.G.G. Moogly]

What evidence do you desire?
This whole thread is a litany of complaints from Americans about the ignorance of 1/6 deniers. There were complaints from Americans about your voting system, machines vs. paper etc. None of which began with myself or others.
We (non-Americans) merely suggest you people might like to get your house in order to avoid bothering the rest of the world about it and we offer offer possible solutions. All of which you decry and then we are to blame.

And we are pointing out that you are offering solutions to a problem that doesn’t exist. The problem you are being bothered by isn’t the vote counting it’s the narcissistic ignorant madness of the losers of that vote. If you have a solution to *that* I’d love to hear one.

I'd say ignore them but that is probably not viable.

Now you get it.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

A lot harder to count, a lot more errors, and much easier to hack (replace ballots with fakes filled out the way you want them.) They're also legally problematic because they are not disabled-friendly.

Harder to count - yes. So what?
More errors? That is debatable.
Easy to hack? Paper - certainly possible but requires immense work. More work than getting it right the first time. Electronic machines - There are plenty of wicked puppies on the dark web who could hack your machines far easier than ballot stuffing.
Disabled friendly? Our paper system work quite well. If problems are found we fix them instead of complaining. Oh wait I see your problem now.

No ballot system will ever be 100% error free or easy. But how much is your electoral process worth to you?

The problem is not the electoral process per se. Rather the problem(s) is that you Yanks are whingers, hate each other so much and do not like to wait.

The machines in use locally produce a voter-verified paper trail. It's on a very long roll of paper, sealed in the machine--if there's any question about the electronic total you compare the records from the machine with the tape. You can't stuff the ballot box without leaving evidence of having done so. I'm not saying it's unhackable--I'm sure they're hackable (but they're not connected so it's not going to be easy), but it's very hard to mess with the system in a way that will stand up to scrutiny.

As for the disabled, how do you propose my mother (blind) vote on paper?? The electronic machines have audio outputs, paper does not. In the old days we simply accepted that people like her would need someone in the voting booth to actually mark the ballot but we don't have to do that anymore in most cases. (And the few that need assistance almost certainly are going to vote absentee anyway because getting to the polling station is too much work for them.)

 

[Loren Pechtel]

It's not that radio station owners suddenly became conservative - they're just driven by the same corporate greed that undermines product quality in every single unregulated market there ever was. Conservative listeners are easy to manipulate,

Ever noticed that non-conservatives are also easy to manipulate. Must be a human thing.

Republicans are dogs. Democrats are cats.

If the "conservative" stations bother you so much start non-conservative ones. I know, I know it is hard work. Much easier to whinge. And more fun too.

Because there's a much bigger market base--you can't listen to radio with words if you're doing any sort of job that actually requires thinking about it. Thus most talk radio is consumed by those in reasonably low-skill jobs.

A simple test: Observe the advertising, see what sort of person it's targeted at. (Note that this is not useful for anything with user content--the ad matching is by keyword, not by people who understand who they are aiming at.)

 

[Elixir]

But so many Aussies are obsessed by you lot.

I must admit, we are mighty flattered by your fascination. It’s like we’re all reality tv stars. We are all Donald Trump, and we all appreciate your support.