Merged Gaza just launched an unprovoked attack on Israel

[Copernicus]

Anyone who has allowed Hamas to build a tunnel under their house, I think, has made their house a legitimate military target. Which is most of Gaza. I have no problem with Israel bombing. I think it probably is the only viable solution. They’re also pumping sea water into the tunnels to flood them.

I think we all know that, if you were living in a house in the Gaza strip and Hamas decided to build a tunnel under it, there would be nothing you could do to stop them. In fact, I'm pretty sure they could get you to help them build that tunnel, if they wanted to. And I don't think you'd be eager to inform the Israelis about that tunnel, either. Just guess whose house they would blow up, not to mention what Hamas would do to a snitch if they found out. Just the same, you seem to believe that Israel would be justified in bombing your house with you in it.

 

[bilby]

In his bunker in Berlin, on April 29, 1945, Adolf Hitler decreed his "last political testament".

"Since 1914, when as a volunteer, I made my modest contribution in the World War which was forced upon the Reich, over thirty years have passed." - referring to the Great War, later renamed World War I. Overreacting to some terrorism is not exactly a forced response.

Insofar as the cause of the Great War can be pinned on any single thing, the overreaction of Austria-Hungary to some terrorism is that thing.

They didn't have to declare war on Serbia; Just as Israel didn't have to destroy Gaza. A more measured and proportionate response was available in both cases, and in both cases would have lead to far less suffering of innocents (on all sides).

 

[Shadowy Man]

Hamas could stop using civilians as human shields. The IDF has never behaved in that way. Using hospitals as army staging posts is so low.

is the IDF obligated to shoot through human shields? You seem to imply that the killing of human shields is justified.

What? What kind of fucked up logic is that?

So if it is not justified to shoot through the human shields then you think the IDF is wrong to kill civilians?

Or is it simply an undesired consequence of Hamas’ actions and the IDF are not responsible for the civilian death toll.

Maybe I’m not understanding your position.

They are innocent civilians by definition of “human shields” otherwise you would refer to them as “combatants”.

Hamas certainly does their best to make their fighters look like civilians. Something the International press rarely mention. The result is of course that civilians are sometimes targetted by mistake, and that all civilians (of fightable age) have to be treated as potential combatants.

So it is justified to treat civilians as combatants and the IDF is not in the wrong for the civilian death toll. Is that what you are saying?

If Israel simply carpet bombed all of Gaza, ensuring the total destruction of Hamas, would that be wrong? I’m hoping you would agree. So, as I said before there’s a line somewhere between a justified response and potential war crimes. And people are arguing over where that line should be drawn.

 

[Tigers!]

In his bunker in Berlin, on April 29, 1945, Adolf Hitler decreed his "last political testament".

"Since 1914, when as a volunteer, I made my modest contribution in the World War which was forced upon the Reich, over thirty years have passed." - referring to the Great War, later renamed World War I. Overreacting to some terrorism is not exactly a forced response.

Insofar as the cause of the Great War can be pinned on any single thing, the overreaction of Austria-Hungary to some terrorism is that thing.

They didn't have to declare war on Serbia; Just as Israel didn't have to destroy Gaza. A more measured and proportionate response was available in both cases, and in both cases would have lead to far less suffering of innocents (on all sides).

And the more and proportionate response in each case is/was?

 

[laughing dog]

It seems that there are three basic positions in this debate:

1) Israel is justified in killing innocent Palestinians to destroy Hamas.
2) Hamas is justified in killing innocent Israelis to destroy Israel.
3) Neither Hamas nor Israel is justified in killing innocent people to destroy the other.

Nobody here is defending (2). Some defend (1) and others defend (3). Those who defend (1) often portray the defenders of (3) as defenders of (2).

I don’t think anyone has defended 1 either. Innocent Palestinians are getting killed because Hamas is on purpose using Palestinian civilians as human shields.

That is a falsehood. Innocent Palenstinians are getting killed because the IDF is bombing and shooting them. The fact you feel the IDF is justified does not change the reality that innocent Palestinians are directly killed because of IDF choices and actions.

The persistent elision over over that reality by the defenders strongly suggests that the IDF is justified in killing innocent civilians.

Bullshit. Stop trying to defend mass murders. Its despicable IMHO

I am not defending Hamas. Please produce a single sentence of mine that you imagine defends Hamas's terrorism.

Ironically, you defend mass killers (see you defense below). No matter how you try to spin it, the IDF is much more prolific in killing innocents than Hamas, and they are not even trying!

Because you put the blame on the civilian casualities on IDF. That's why I think you are defending Hamas

That is illogical and factually incorrect. The IDF is the one dropping the bombs. The bombs are the direct cause of civilian deaths. It is a recognition of reality that the IDF is killing civilians. That is not a defense of Hamas.

Hamas is going to act like it does no matter how many civilians get killed. Unless Hamas is completely wiped out, they will regroup and recruit and this cycle will continue.

At best, Israel is just postponing the next vicious terrorist attack with their own vicious attack. Except maybe next time, both sides will escalate the damage.

I don’t think so. If Israel takes over defence of Gaza, Hamas can no longer divert tax money to weapons. Instead, perhaps, tax money can be used to build the economy. Something no Palestinian leaders have so far have had any interest in.

Your analysis ignores over 70 years of history there. It is as naive as thinking Hamas or Zionist extremists will simply come together and sing Kumbayya.

At least Zionist extremists aren't able to influence Israeli policy or actions by the IDF. That puts Israel well above the Palestinian Authority.

You are misinformed. Zionist extremists are in the Cabinet and the Knesset. Netanhayu needs to keep the happy in order to keep his coalition and his job.

The main problem with PA is that its a failed state. Its dysfunction has been exploited by Islamists. And its not getting better with time. Something needs to change.
 

Israel is just defending itself. Hamas needs to go.

Killing civilians is not defending oneself. If it were, Hamas's actions on Oct. 7 would not terrorism, but self defense.

Hamas could stop using civilians as human shields. The IDF has never behaved in that way. Using hospitals as army staging posts is so low.

Yes. The IDF could stop using bombs. But neither is going to happen.

 

[DrZoidberg]

It seems that there are three basic positions in this debate:

1) Israel is justified in killing innocent Palestinians to destroy Hamas.
2) Hamas is justified in killing innocent Israelis to destroy Israel.
3) Neither Hamas nor Israel is justified in killing innocent people to destroy the other.

Nobody here is defending (2). Some defend (1) and others defend (3). Those who defend (1) often portray the defenders of (3) as defenders of (2).

I don’t think anyone has defended 1 either. Innocent Palestinians are getting killed because Hamas is on purpose using Palestinian civilians as human shields.

That is a falsehood. Innocent Palenstinians are getting killed because the IDF is bombing and shooting them. The fact you feel the IDF is justified does not change the reality that innocent Palestinians are directly killed because of IDF choices and actions.

The persistent elision over over that reality by the defenders strongly suggests that the IDF is justified in killing innocent civilians.

Bullshit. Stop trying to defend mass murders. Its despicable IMHO

I am not defending Hamas. Please produce a single sentence of mine that you imagine defends Hamas's terrorism.

Ironically, you defend mass killers (see you defense below). No matter how you try to spin it, the IDF is much more prolific in killing innocents than Hamas, and they are not even trying!

Because you put the blame on the civilian casualities on IDF. That's why I think you are defending Hamas

That is illogical and factually incorrect. The IDF is the one dropping the bombs. The bombs are the direct cause of civilian deaths. It is a recognition of reality that the IDF is killing civilians. That is not a defense of Hamas.

We strongly disagree. You are playing right into the manipulative tactics of Hamas.

Hamas is going to act like it does no matter how many civilians get killed. Unless Hamas is completely wiped out, they will regroup and recruit and this cycle will continue.

At best, Israel is just postponing the next vicious terrorist attack with their own vicious attack. Except maybe next time, both sides will escalate the damage.

I don’t think so. If Israel takes over defence of Gaza, Hamas can no longer divert tax money to weapons. Instead, perhaps, tax money can be used to build the economy. Something no Palestinian leaders have so far have had any interest in.

Your analysis ignores over 70 years of history there. It is as naive as thinking Hamas or Zionist extremists will simply come together and sing Kumbayya.

At least Zionist extremists aren't able to influence Israeli policy or actions by the IDF. That puts Israel well above the Palestinian Authority.

You are misinformed. Zionist extremists are in the Cabinet and the Knesset. Netanhayu needs to keep the happy in order to keep his coalition and his job.

I think yoiu are abusing the word "extremist"..

The main problem with PA is that its a failed state. Its dysfunction has been exploited by Islamists. And its not getting better with time. Something needs to change.
 

Israel is just defending itself. Hamas needs to go.

Killing civilians is not defending oneself. If it were, Hamas's actions on Oct. 7 would not terrorism, but self defense.

Hamas could stop using civilians as human shields. The IDF has never behaved in that way. Using hospitals as army staging posts is so low.

Yes. The IDF could stop using bombs. But neither is going to happen.

Why? How else are they supposed to win? What you are implying is that Israel needs to withdraw and accept how its been. Dropping bombs is the only way they can win. You’re ignoring the 7/10 attack. Nothing can go back to what it was.

Israelis tell British MPs of evidence of Hamas sexual violence

Israelis tell British MPs of evidence of Hamas sexual violence

People who dealt with the bodies of 7 October victims describe seeing "systematic genital mutilation".

www.bbc.co.uk

 

[laughing dog]

It seems that there are three basic positions in this debate:

1) Israel is justified in killing innocent Palestinians to destroy Hamas.
2) Hamas is justified in killing innocent Israelis to destroy Israel.
3) Neither Hamas nor Israel is justified in killing innocent people to destroy the other.

Nobody here is defending (2). Some defend (1) and others defend (3). Those who defend (1) often portray the defenders of (3) as defenders of (2).

I don’t think anyone has defended 1 either. Innocent Palestinians are getting killed because Hamas is on purpose using Palestinian civilians as human shields.

That is a falsehood. Innocent Palenstinians are getting killed because the IDF is bombing and shooting them. The fact you feel the IDF is justified does not change the reality that innocent Palestinians are directly killed because of IDF choices and actions.

The persistent elision over over that reality by the defenders strongly suggests that the IDF is justified in killing innocent civilians.

Bullshit. Stop trying to defend mass murders. Its despicable IMHO

I am not defending Hamas. Please produce a single sentence of mine that you imagine defends Hamas's terrorism.

Ironically, you defend mass killers (see you defense below). No matter how you try to spin it, the IDF is much more prolific in killing innocents than Hamas, and they are not even trying!

Because you put the blame on the civilian casualities on IDF. That's why I think you are defending Hamas

That is illogical and factually incorrect. The IDF is the one dropping the bombs. The bombs are the direct cause of civilian deaths. It is a recognition of reality that the IDF is killing civilians. That is not a defense of Hamas.

We strongly disagree. You are playing right into the manipulative tactics of Hamas.

You have argued and continue to argue that the IDF is justified in its actions. Those actions include killing innocent civilians. It is irrational to deny something occurs when you acknowledge it is occurring.

Hamas is going to act like it does no matter how many civilians get killed. Unless Hamas is completely wiped out, they will regroup and recruit and this cycle will continue.

At best, Israel is just postponing the next vicious terrorist attack with their own vicious attack. Except maybe next time, both sides will escalate the damage.

I don’t think so. If Israel takes over defence of Gaza, Hamas can no longer divert tax money to weapons. Instead, perhaps, tax money can be used to build the economy. Something no Palestinian leaders have so far have had any interest in.

Your analysis ignores over 70 years of history there. It is as naive as thinking Hamas or Zionist extremists will simply come together and sing Kumbayya.

At least Zionist extremists aren't able to influence Israeli policy or actions by the IDF. That puts Israel well above the Palestinian Authority.

You are misinformed. Zionist extremists are in the Cabinet and the Knesset. Netanhayu needs to keep the happy in order to keep his coalition and his job.

I think yoiu are abusing the word "extremist"..

Your posts suggest that belief about your level of knowledge is unwarranted.

The main problem with PA is that its a failed state. Its dysfunction has been exploited by Islamists. And its not getting better with time. Something needs to change.
 

Israel is just defending itself. Hamas needs to go.

Killing civilians is not defending oneself. If it were, Hamas's actions on Oct. 7 would not terrorism, but self defense.

Hamas could stop using civilians as human shields. The IDF has never behaved in that way. Using hospitals as army staging posts is so low.

Yes. The IDF could stop using bombs. But neither is going to happen.

Why? How else are they supposed to win? What you are implying is that Israel needs to withdraw and accept how its been. Dropping bombs is the only way they can win.

Win what? Certainly not peace. Nor the eradication of Hamas or anti-Israeli terrorists.

You’re ignoring the 7/10 attack. Nothing can go back to what it was.

No, I am not. I am unaware of anyone suggesting that they can go back to what it was (wtf that gobbledygook meant).

 

[DrZoidberg]

It seems that there are three basic positions in this debate:

1) Israel is justified in killing innocent Palestinians to destroy Hamas.
2) Hamas is justified in killing innocent Israelis to destroy Israel.
3) Neither Hamas nor Israel is justified in killing innocent people to destroy the other.

Nobody here is defending (2). Some defend (1) and others defend (3). Those who defend (1) often portray the defenders of (3) as defenders of (2).

I don’t think anyone has defended 1 either. Innocent Palestinians are getting killed because Hamas is on purpose using Palestinian civilians as human shields.

That is a falsehood. Innocent Palenstinians are getting killed because the IDF is bombing and shooting them. The fact you feel the IDF is justified does not change the reality that innocent Palestinians are directly killed because of IDF choices and actions.

The persistent elision over over that reality by the defenders strongly suggests that the IDF is justified in killing innocent civilians.

Bullshit. Stop trying to defend mass murders. Its despicable IMHO

I am not defending Hamas. Please produce a single sentence of mine that you imagine defends Hamas's terrorism.

Ironically, you defend mass killers (see you defense below). No matter how you try to spin it, the IDF is much more prolific in killing innocents than Hamas, and they are not even trying!

Because you put the blame on the civilian casualities on IDF. That's why I think you are defending Hamas

That is illogical and factually incorrect. The IDF is the one dropping the bombs. The bombs are the direct cause of civilian deaths. It is a recognition of reality that the IDF is killing civilians. That is not a defense of Hamas.

We strongly disagree. You are playing right into the manipulative tactics of Hamas.

You have argued and continue to argue that the IDF is justified in its actions. Those actions include killing innocent civilians. It is irrational to deny something occurs when you acknowledge it is occurring.

I have never said that. I think you're twisting words. I also don't think you believe it. I think you're just being dishonest to score debate points, or something. Just stop.

Hamas is going to act like it does no matter how many civilians get killed. Unless Hamas is completely wiped out, they will regroup and recruit and this cycle will continue.

At best, Israel is just postponing the next vicious terrorist attack with their own vicious attack. Except maybe next time, both sides will escalate the damage.

I don’t think so. If Israel takes over defence of Gaza, Hamas can no longer divert tax money to weapons. Instead, perhaps, tax money can be used to build the economy. Something no Palestinian leaders have so far have had any interest in.

Your analysis ignores over 70 years of history there. It is as naive as thinking Hamas or Zionist extremists will simply come together and sing Kumbayya.

At least Zionist extremists aren't able to influence Israeli policy or actions by the IDF. That puts Israel well above the Palestinian Authority.

You are misinformed. Zionist extremists are in the Cabinet and the Knesset. Netanhayu needs to keep the happy in order to keep his coalition and his job.

I think yoiu are abusing the word "extremist"..

Your posts suggest that belief about your level of knowledge is unwarranted.

The main problem with PA is that its a failed state. Its dysfunction has been exploited by Islamists. And its not getting better with time. Something needs to change.
 

Israel is just defending itself. Hamas needs to go.

Killing civilians is not defending oneself. If it were, Hamas's actions on Oct. 7 would not terrorism, but self defense.

Hamas could stop using civilians as human shields. The IDF has never behaved in that way. Using hospitals as army staging posts is so low.

Yes. The IDF could stop using bombs. But neither is going to happen.

Why? How else are they supposed to win? What you are implying is that Israel needs to withdraw and accept how its been. Dropping bombs is the only way they can win.

Win what? Certainly not peace. Nor the eradication of Hamas or anti-Israeli terrorists.

Peace is not going to be acheived with an autonomous Palestine. They've had plenty of time to show the world they're capable of living in peace with Israel. It's just not happening. If the Palestinians can't be trusted to behave themselves then someone else will need to come in to do it. Israel has a good track record. So I think they taking over is our best bet for stability. And we'll just have to accept that we'll never have peace anywhere around Palestinians.

You’re ignoring the 7/10 attack. Nothing can go back to what it was.

No, I am not. I am unaware of anyone suggesting that they can go back to what it was (wtf that gobbledygook meant).

Then what's your plan? You seem to think peace is possible. How do you propose it can be acheived?

 

[laughing dog]

That is illogical and factually incorrect. The IDF is the one dropping the bombs. The bombs are the direct
You have argued and continue to argue that the IDF is justified in its actions. Those actions include killing innocent civilians. It is irrational to deny something occurs when you acknowledge it is occurring.

I have never said that. I think you're twisting words. I also don't think you believe it. I think you're just being dishonest to score debate points, or something. Just stop.

You think wrong. Placing the entire onus on Gazan civilian deaths on Hamas and denying any IDF responsibility is doing just that. Please stop flinging your slanderous projections.

Peace is not going to be acheived with an autonomous Palestine. They've had plenty of time to show the world they're capable of living in peace with Israel. It's just not happening. If the Palestinians can't be trusted to behave themselves then someone else will need to come in to do it. Israel has a good track record. So I think they taking over is our best bet for stability. And we'll just have to accept that we'll never have peace anywhere around Palestinians.

Certainly not with that patronizing and bigoted attitude.

Then what's your plan? You seem to think peace is possible. How do you propose it can be acheived?

Right now, peace is not possible because there is too much distrust, fear, and hate. Peace is going to take a very long because it requires trust and real courage. Real courage is not terrorism ir killing civilians by yhe thousands, it is turning the other cheek when necessary which, in turn, requires trust.[

 

[ZiprHead]

Biden signs executive order sanctioning West Bank settlers

The settlers will not be allowed to send money to the United States or have anyone act on their behalf, the officials said. The order also prevents any American from contributing money, goods or services to those sanctioned, the officials said.


The financial sanctions follow an announcement in early December restricting U.S. visas for people believed to have been involved in settler violence, as well as their immediate family members. Neither those restrictions, nor the sanctions announced on Wednesday affect the many U.S. citizen settlers.

Those sanctioned include individuals whose actions led to the death of a Palestinian civilian, and others who have set buildings on fire, caused property damage, assaulted Palestinian farmers and carried out attacks with stones that caused serious injuries, according to one of the senior officials. The sanctioned settlers have also tried to break into windows and passing vehicles, blocked roads and used other forms of intimidation.

Too little, too late?

 

[DrZoidberg]

That is illogical and factually incorrect. The IDF is the one dropping the bombs. The bombs are the direct
You have argued and continue to argue that the IDF is justified in its actions. Those actions include killing innocent civilians. It is irrational to deny something occurs when you acknowledge it is occurring.

I have never said that. I think you're twisting words. I also don't think you believe it. I think you're just being dishonest to score debate points, or something. Just stop.

You think wrong. Placing the entire onus on Gazan civilian deaths on Hamas and denying any IDF responsibility is doing just that. Please stop flinging your slanderous projections.

I guess we strongly disagree on this

Peace is not going to be acheived with an autonomous Palestine. They've had plenty of time to show the world they're capable of living in peace with Israel. It's just not happening. If the Palestinians can't be trusted to behave themselves then someone else will need to come in to do it. Israel has a good track record. So I think they taking over is our best bet for stability. And we'll just have to accept that we'll never have peace anywhere around Palestinians.

Certainly not with that patronizing and bigoted attitude.

Trust is earned. I think the Palestinians have had every opportunity, and keep blowing it

Then what's your plan? You seem to think peace is possible. How do you propose it can be acheived?

Right now, peace is not possible because there is too much distrust, fear, and hate. Peace is going to take a very long because it requires trust and real courage. Real courage is not terrorism ir killing civilians by yhe thousands, it is turning the other cheek when necessary which, in turn, requires trust.[

Yeah. But Israel can't endlessly keep being nice and then get rammed in the ass. Enough is enough

 

[laughing dog]

That is illogical and factually incorrect. The IDF is the one dropping the bombs. The bombs are the direct
You have argued and continue to argue that the IDF is justified in its actions. Those actions include killing innocent civilians. It is irrational to deny something occurs when you acknowledge it is occurring.

I have never said that. I think you're twisting words. I also don't think you believe it. I think you're just being dishonest to score debate points, or something. Just stop.

You think wrong. Placing the entire onus on Gazan civilian deaths on Hamas and denying any IDF responsibility is doing just that. Please stop flinging your slanderous projections.

I guess we strongly disagree on this

Facts are facts. Denying reality is delusional.

Peace is not going to be acheived with an autonomous Palestine. They've had plenty of time to show the world they're capable of living in peace with Israel. It's just not happening. If the Palestinians can't be trusted to behave themselves then someone else will need to come in to do it. Israel has a good track record. So I think they taking over is our best bet for stability. And we'll just have to accept that we'll never have peace anywhere around Palestinians.

Certainly not with that patronizing and bigoted attitude.

Trust is earned. I think the Palestinians have had every opportunity, and keep blowing it

And you think the gov't of Israel has earned trust through its persistent land grabs and violations of Palestinian human dignity in the West Bank?

And how exactly are the Arab inhabitants of the West Bank "blowing it"?

Then what's your plan? You seem to think peace is possible. How do you propose it can be acheived?

Right now, peace is not possible because there is too much distrust, fear, and hate. Peace is going to take a very long because it requires trust and real courage. Real courage is not terrorism ir killing civilians by yhe thousands, it is turning the other cheek when necessary which, in turn, requires trust.[

Yeah. But Israel can't endlessly keep being nice and then get rammed in the ass. Enough is enough

Israel is not endlessly nice.

 

[Tigers!]

Then what's your plan? You seem to think peace is possible. How do you propose it can be acheived?

Right now, peace is not possible because there is too much distrust, fear, and hate. Peace is going to take a very long because it requires trust and real courage. Real courage is not terrorism ir killing civilians by yhe thousands, it is turning the other cheek when necessary which, in turn, requires trust.[

You want Israel to turn the other cheek but what of Hamas? Are they to turn the other cheek too?

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

Then what's your plan? You seem to think peace is possible. How do you propose it can be acheived?

Right now, peace is not possible because there is too much distrust, fear, and hate. Peace is going to take a very long because it requires trust and real courage. Real courage is not terrorism ir killing civilians by yhe thousands, it is turning the other cheek when necessary which, in turn, requires trust.[

You want Israel to turn the other cheek...

This would be after the bombings and attacks that have killed some large numbers of civilians in Gaza.

...but what of Hamas?

The terror group that at this point has no viable leadership capacity in the future? Yes, Hamas should... but we aren't expecting them to any time soon.

 

[laughing dog]

Then what's your plan? You seem to think peace is possible. How do you propose it can be acheived?

Right now, peace is not possible because there is too much distrust, fear, and hate. Peace is going to take a very long because it requires trust and real courage. Real courage is not terrorism ir killing civilians by yhe thousands, it is turning the other cheek when necessary which, in turn, requires trust.[

You want Israel to turn the other cheek but what of Hamas? Are they to turn the other cheek too?

Did you miss "Real courage is not terrorism"?

 

[repoman]

30 Palestinians with hands tied behind their backs mass executed in Gaza by the IDF?

 

[Copernicus]

Then what's your plan? You seem to think peace is possible. How do you propose it can be acheived?

Right now, peace is not possible because there is too much distrust, fear, and hate. Peace is going to take a very long because it requires trust and real courage. Real courage is not terrorism ir killing civilians by yhe thousands, it is turning the other cheek when necessary which, in turn, requires trust.

You want Israel to turn the other cheek but what of Hamas? Are they to turn the other cheek too?

Did you miss "Real courage is not terrorism"?

And it isn't just about which side turns the other cheek. Violence is self-perpetuating, so one side has to stop first. The US has no leverage over Hamas, but it supplies the weapons that Israel is using to carry on its bloody revenge against people in the Gaza Strip. So it only has leverage over Israel in this mess. The US can tell Hamas to turn its cheek all it wants, but Hamas couldn't care less. The US can tell Israel to turn the other cheek, and Israel has to listen. The reason Biden is in trouble with his base of support is that he refuses to reign in Israel's bloody revenge on the Palestinian population living in Gaza. To do so would have a negative impact on his chances of getting reelected.

 

[DrZoidberg]

Then what's your plan? You seem to think peace is possible. How do you propose it can be acheived?

Right now, peace is not possible because there is too much distrust, fear, and hate. Peace is going to take a very long because it requires trust and real courage. Real courage is not terrorism ir killing civilians by yhe thousands, it is turning the other cheek when necessary which, in turn, requires trust.[

You want Israel to turn the other cheek but what of Hamas? Are they to turn the other cheek too?

If they do that they'll stop getting money from Iran. They wouldn't want that. Hamas doesn't care about the Palestinian people. They care about the money. The main problem in this conflict that is that the Palestinian side is led by people who don't have the best interest of the Palestinian people at heart. And since the Palestinians are very supportive of Hamas, there doesn't seem to be any possibility to fix this.

Islamic Jihad (also Funded by Iran) are Islamist fanatics. The second most popular group among Palestinians. And the Palestinian Authority, who are in nominal control, are kleptocratic bandits who only care about getting rich. They also don't give a fuck about the Palestinian people.

So the main problem for the individual Palestinians is that there is no viable horse to back if they want peace. A Palestine average Joe who wants a job and wants to be able to raise a family, needs to ally himself to one of these parasitic organisations to be able to just survive. That guarantees continued conflict.

As I see it, the only possible option is for an external party to come in and take over. Israel is a well functioning modern democratic state. They're the ideal party to do this. Whatever external force moves in, they're going to be resented by the Palestinians.

 

[Derec]

And it isn't just about which side turns the other cheek. Violence is self-perpetuating, so one side has to stop first.

If Palestinians were to stop their attacks, Israel would have no reason to retaliate in self-defense.
If Israel were to stop defending itself, Hamas and other terrorist groups would continue attacking because their goal is destruction of Israel. They have said so themselves.
Let's stop pretending the two sides in this conflict are in any way equivalent.

The US can tell Israel to turn the other cheek, and Israel has to listen.

It would be absolutely wrong to demand Israel "turn the other cheek" after >1000 Israelis were brutally murdered and >200 kidnapped by Islamic fanatics of Hamas. You would not be demanding that kind of mindless self-sacrifice of any other country or people.
Should Ukrainians "turn the other cheek" in face of Russian aggression?

The reason Biden is in trouble with his base of support

By "base" you mean the left wing radicals and the Arabs/Muslims mostly in Michigan?

is that he refuses to reign in Israel's bloody revenge on the Palestinian population living in Gaza.

The problem is that the pro-Palestinian leftists and the Islamic groups do not want Israel to defend itself at all. There was a rally cheering Palestinian "resistance" a day after the bloody terrorist attack by Hamas.

This is the "base" that you think Biden should kowtow to.
Note, there was a ceasefire on 10/6, and Hamas broke it.

To do so would have a negative impact on his chances of getting reelected.

If he had acquiesced to the demand by the Israel haters he would not deserve to get reelected.

 

[laughing dog]

If Palestinians were to stop their attacks, Israel would have no reason to retaliate in self-defense.

The Palestinians in the West Bank are nit attacking Israel and haven’t for some time, but Israeli settler attacks on Palestinians in the West Bank have steadily increased while the Israeli gov’t does little to stop it. Hmmm.

Let's stop pretending the two sides in this conflict are in any way equivalent.

They’re not. Hamas are vicious terrorists perpetuating atrocious crimes against civilians while the gov’t of Israel in its “ defensive” war manages to kill magnitudes more children and other civilians.